NRA Sounds Alarms on Gun Control

[antsi]

Mike PGS:

I agree that actions of the government to restrict RKBA are unconstitutional and contrary to oaths of office, and under a truly just and correct administration of the law, would be punished.

Do you think this is the most effective and realistic strategy to promote, protect, and restore RKBA?

Do you think a campaign promoting "Prosecute and Imprison the Anti's!" is the most effective and realistic way to advance our agenda?

Do you think the NRA would get more accomplished politically if they openly advocated prosecuting the gun-ban crowd?

 

[tellner]

And do you think that the Gulag or a rope over the lampost is the best solution for people who honestly disagree however incorrectly with your interpretation of the Law? We don't even hang lobster eaters, people who wear wool-linen blends or kids who mouth off to their parents anymore.

 

[utahminirevolver]

For people who disagree, first try humor, like Ann Coulter does. She's excellent...I'm reading her book "Godless" these days and it presents lots of laughs.

Gulags are the style of the left. They did that in Russia, China, Cambodia, Cuba, Vietnam, Korea, and it looks like Venezuela is sliding down that evil slope too.

 

[mbt2001]

Uhhh

I am not sure why everyone is attacking the NRA... Seriously, we have the CCW legislation in many areas thanks to their support. I would advise everyone of joining the NRA and GOA.

Let's be honest, it is $25.00 per year...

 

[MikePGS]

I'm just saying that any ban on guns is against the law. So anyone who makes a ban or proposes one directly contradicts their oath of office. At the very least, this should automatically kick them out of whatever office they have been elected to, because at the absolute least they are committing perjury. Its really not a gray area whatsoever, they take an oath to defend the constitution, then directly violate it.

 

[Phetro]

"When these two certainties intersect, America’s anti-gun agenda will emerge in full force masquerading as an anti-terrorist agenda. Unless we face that moment, the final disarmament of law-abiding Americans will occur beneath the shroud of anti-terrorism legislation.”

Things like this make me want to throw up. Though it's true to an extent (most cowards will turn 'em right in), don't they think at least some Americans will have the courage to use the Second Amendment for its intended purpose at that point?

 

[Phetro]

And do you think that the Gulag or a rope over the lampost is the best solution for people who honestly disagree however incorrectly with your interpretation of the Law?

The Law is the Constitution. There is no "interpretation" of it to be had. It's in plain English.

To people who disagree, no punishment should be given. But to those who attempt to destroy the Constitution because they disagree with its plain meaning, your punishments don't go nearly far enough.

 

[The_Shootist]

Nod To Phetro

Yeah, I fugure if the Democrats decide to try an AWB II, it might be time to raise the Stars and Bars again.

Like Winston Churchill said, you can always take one with you - and with a few standard cap mags for my WASR10 it might be more than one

 

[Ms. Annie Oakley]

I think that the AWB is just an invitation for the dems to increase the Militia efforts and they should consider this issue heavily before trying anything along those lines. Although myself I wouldn't see the increase of said militia organization efforts to be a bad thing because our freedoms continually being syphoned off one stupid piece of legislation at a time. But who I am to say everyone knows that our goverment would never do anything intentionally to make us a society of unarmed peasants, that won't ever come to pass..... As far as the Californians are concered all that I can say is it certainly worked in L.A. didn't it?

 

[tellner]

I wish we had some "scumbag left wing Democrats". I know it's popular to call anyone who doesn't actually go into orgasmic trance at the sound of Rush Limbaugh's voice a socialist or a commie. When the old Republican establishment becomes "RINOS" you know we've entered the Twilight Zone.

But be serious. It's not even remotely true. The DNC crowd is hard-core pro-big business, anti-labor, pro "Free Trade", squishy on civil liberties - and please don't insult either of our intelligences by saying that the GOP has been the champion of civil rights other than the RKBA, and otherwise roughly in the position of the Center Right parties in Europe. We haven't had a Left by world standards since, oh, FDR's second term. The economic historians place the supposedly socialist Bill Clinton's policies as roughly those of a moderate Republican of 40 years ago. Since then the Dems have been too busy "triangulating" with the GOP to do anything even the remotest shade of green, let alone pink.

Think back thirty years and a hair. Richard Nixon was a real honest to Cthulhu Republican and the first to make the Southern Strategy work. He was the last one to try and put the whole pricing and wage structure under strict government control. Remember "Frozen P's"? The GOP is experiencing a return to its Old Time Values. The values are those of the Gilded Age.

What passes for a slightly more moderate Right is Leftish only from a rather skewed perspective.

"One World Government" whatever the heck that means? Consider PNAC's plan for world domination through perpetual war. Consider the neocons and even a few paleocons who believe that our destiny is to be a globe-spanning empire. Consider the "Free Trade" pacts which subordinate our laws to an unelected group of unbound Capital's representatives. Clinton lost the support of what passes for the Left wing of the Dems by pushing the first one. The Republican Party loved it and accelerated the trend. It's global government with protections for corporate profits but not for workers, the environment or the shrinking Middle Class. In other words, we have a Right Wing One World Government. The only people actually standing up to it are the Islamists who have hated every ideology that has come out of the West, capitalism or communism.

 

[JohnBT]

"we have a Right Wing One World Government"

We do? Where? The U.N.? NATO? I sure don't see one.

John

 

[Art Eatman]

"The economic historians place the supposedly socialist Bill Clinton's policies as roughly those of a moderate Republican of 40 years ago."

Hmmm. 1967. LBJ's Great Society. Sorry, but the historians' conclusions don't fit my memory, from having been there at the time. And before...Few Republicans were voting for more spending or for the creation of more federal agencies/programs.

Fascism hs been cited as "You own it, but the government tells you what you can or must do with it." From that standpoint, Clinton's policies were fascistic. He definitely was Statist in his views; as is Dubya...

Art

 

[Malone LaVeigh]

For people who disagree, first try humor, like Ann Coulter does.

Oh, yeah, calling them names is a great way to reach people who disagree with you.

"we have a Right Wing One World Government"

We do? Where?

We have a de facto One-World Multi-National Corporatocracy enforced by the US military, paid for by your and my taxes.

Clinton's policies were fascistic.

Bingo. Or, to use Mussolini's synonym, "Corporatist."

 

[JohnBT]

"We have a de facto One-World Multi-National Corporatocracy enforced by the US military, paid for by your and my taxes."

Not very effective are they? Looking at the entire world they don't control much of it.

John

 

[Glockfan.45]

"We have a de facto One-World Multi-National Corporatocracy enforced by the US military, paid for by your and my taxes."

Not very effective are they? Looking at the entire world they don't control much of it.

Well enforcement and control are two different things. We enforce our will in every corner of the globe. It does seem though that our will and the corporate will coincide quite often however.

 

[athlon64]

History repeats itself...

The anti gun crowd doesn't even know who GOA is.

+1. I'll support the organization that is hated the most by gun grabbers. The NRA.

The NRA is now leading the fight in CA over off-list semi auto's. Where are JFPO and GOA? Anyone who isn't ignorant knows that gun control cancer-experimentation starts in California, and can easily spread to the Federal level. e.g. The 1989 CA AW ban influenced the 1994 Federal AW and 10+ round magazine ban. We got lucky on the 1994 Federal ban, it had a 2004 sunset clause.

The 1994 Federal ban was produced by a democratic congress and president. What do you think will happen in 2008? These laws only get worse.... we may be facing a more restrictive ban post-2008. The gun grabbers share info and knowledge on loopholes too, it's highly likely they may close the gaps the 1994 Federal ban had in the next round; and I'm willing to bet there will be another more restrictive Federal level ban after 2008, with the level of apathetic gun owners in the U.S. who take their freedom for granted.

 

[rojoko]

You folks still haven't realized how much the NRA lacks any kind of foresite, because they simply STILL do NOT realize the problems that they and we as shooters face...

The American public has been conditioned and been conditioned for many MANY years by the media. The NRA does NOT understand the media in any manner shape or form. Simply put, they need someone that does.

In the mid 80's, I offerede a forum that predated the internet by ten years. Around that time I was simply stunned at how ineffective WAyne LaPierre was in public speaking and debate. I started raising heck about this since the NRA heirarchy was doing itself far more damage then it was helping the situation everytime Wayne got in front of the public. In late 85, early 85 I started a discussion on getting someone far more effective in front of the public to handle the peo 2nd arguments. I forwarde the idea that the NRA should grab Charlton Heston and yes, Vern Humphreys was aroiund in those days... he remembers...

Since we knew both the NRA and the ATF was reading those forums.. Heston made it into office. Sadly he suffers from medical problems and had to retire.
But now we're faced with the same old problems... Wayne can't handle it, never could. He simply does NOT have the ability to deal with the media in any fashion form or shape... we need someone that can and has been doing so for years (yes I have a list).

More over, the NRA has been hampered with a horric case of short sightedness... they simply do not understand the WORST problem we're facing and even more so... have done nothing to correct the problem.. because if we do not.. and if we do not start quickly... we're lost. Period.

Case in point: Look at one simply fact, the shooting community is shrinking.. and shrinking rapidly... why?? To involved to deal with at one sitting...

However because I've been doing this for over 30 years, I have a plan.. a simply plan.. however I'd like to do so within the ranks of the NRA because of the resources that they posess.. because they'll be needed. However after all the time, engergy and money I put out over the years, this time I'd prefer to do so on a different basis.. and one I haven't decided yet.

But most of all, 99% of you still haven't seen the problem either... and that's simply the scariest of all factors.

 

[rojoko]

One more note, one of the reasoins that the NRA HAS TO CHANGE, is simply for one reason, they've alienated far to many people.... for a lot of reasons, but most of all is the lack of foresite, lack of finese to deal with the situations as they arise and most of all, they simply do not see the situation as it exists.

The NRA as it exists will loose against people like the Clintons, because they do NOT understand the American public anymore. A serious issue with a lot of the sonservative community at this time.

Time to wake up folks, because if we don't... there will be no NRA or 2nd ammendment within 20-30 years. MARK MY WORDS!

 

[rojoko]

Actually one more note (sorry I do get rather hot about all this!!)

Doesn't anyone watch the trials that are now aired on the TV magazines?

Recently there was a gentlemen that was attacked by a mentally unstable individual.. and this issue was raised in court. The gentleman that had been attacked was an upstanding citizen, father, etc etc etc. THe guy was squicky clean.. a good guy!

All in all it really was an astonishing case, because both attourneys did a moderate job.. and brought a fair amount of what they needed to to win their side....

EXCEPT FOR ONE SIMPLE FACT.. the defense attourney didn't deal with the fact that his client was using a 10mm Colt, loaded with hollowpoints.

In talking to the jury afterwards, the simple main fact of why they'd convicted the clean cut Gentleman, etc of 2nd degree murder was the most astonishing of all facts..... he was using hollowpoints - that they considered excessive and something he shouldn't have used... I was stunned.. because in reality, Hollowpoints WERE the perfeect choice!

Because a simple clean cut getleman had protected himself from a KNOWN mentallity unstable individual who was KNOWN TO BE AGREESIVE AND HOSTILE, crazy, etc.. the guy's life is now ruined... he'll ruin himself financially trying to get out of jail. His children and wife are now without their sole means of support.... etc etc etc.

Where the hell was the NRA? Where was the ILA?? where was anyone with a damn clue???

The man had his life ruined because the AMERICANS on the jury had NO F*** clue about firearms, effective methods of self defense.. and why someone would want to use hollowpoints!! They simply felt it would have been better if the guy had shot him with less effective ammo and not "killed him" (This is actually paraphrasing)

WORST OF ALL!!! THIS WAS NOT IN CALIFORNIA!!!! I think this was either in Colorado, Ariz or one of those states....

Folks, America has been conditioned for years that GUNS ARE BAD!! and
this is just another glimpse of what the future will look like....

WAKE UP!!!

 

[Builder]

Quote tellner:If we see a 108th Congress that doesn't pass lots and lots of gun control will any of the alarmists say "Gee, maybe we were wrong?" End quote



No they will just wait till they have a dem pres and go to town on gun owners rights...That's all that Congress does, is pass lots and lots of laws!

Have people really forgotten the Clinton years? The RTKABA is one that all gun owners should be rabid dogs on...Never ever let a politician take your gun rights away....Ever...Never touch the 2ND...Ever!
The clear and consistent voice coming from Americans is "touch that right and you get bit" PERIOD...

Here is the rub...There are a lot of Americans that should not have the RTKABA, So why do we citizens allow them the right to be an American? It is my belief that once you commit certain crimes that you should loose your citizenship...A man/woman without an island so to speak...

I was a prison guard after getting out of the service for a short period of time while I decided what to go to school for and most of you don't have a clue about the kind of people that are locked up, given the chance they would slaughter you like sheep, prey on your children, your loved ones, any decent people they can get at...

All that is wrong with our system today is because "politicians" think they know what is best for everyone! How can anyone know what is best for everyone? Prisons are run like high schools because weak minded individuals have thought that we need to be warm and fuzzy with criminals...People, criminals are not wired the same!

You think you know? You think you have the answers? Go work in a prison for a while and get a clue! We are talking subhuman species here in some cases...

I think it is great to be a political moderate in the true context but make no mistake about it YOU NEVER WANT YOUR GUN RIGHTS INFRINGED ON IN ANYWAY!

I used to talk to this one guy that was a three time armed robbery convict and he said that within an hour of getting out he could have any gun he wanted and would have a "job" within a day or two...Did not care that he would end up back in the system...It was all good to him either way...
Inside 3 hots and a cot...Outside tons of stupid sheeple, lots of opportunity and can do whatever he wants till he gets caught again...

Believe me, the line between your perceived feeing of safe and the reality is a very THIN one indeed! Never ever let a politician take your gun rights away or alter them in any way...

It is just very difficult for me to understand some of the opinions I see posted here, I mean if people are really thinking like they are posting, they really don't have a lot of real world experience and that will get them hurt or killed...

Pencil necks and soccer moms will never be able to pass enough laws to keep you safe...Your safety is YOUR responsibility, the government has no mandated policy to keep YOU the indivdual safe...

Most politicians that we have elected are millionaires and lawyers to boot, do you really think they care about you? They have agendas that you are not part of outside controlling you and I...

The absolute worst thing we can do is put a lawyer or the super rich in public office, that is like making a bank robber the president and manager of a bank...
Lawyers have ruined this country with unchecked litigation and there are more of them in jail then you would think...

I have served this country in a couple different capacities and find it distressing that so many law abiding people don't know their rights, criminals know their rights better than the average citizen, they also have the time to think about how to get some payback for the time they have to serve...

Folks your wake up call was when congress starting altering your 2ND...BTW, I don't care which party is in....But you better know when to say enough, be willing to fight for yourselves and you can't do that with some little popgun, that some pencil neck or soccer mom says you can have... We all got kicked in the groin on 9-11...When you gonna wise up?

 

[Sharps-shooter]

Gotcha!

this is how the people in power make monkeys out of the disempowered. While people stand around bickering about whether the puppet on the right hand, or the puppet on the left hand, is more likely to represent their political views, the guy holding both puppets uses the diversion to push his agenda forward.

People in the upper echelons of the upper class are, for the most part, essentially apolitical. They're not statists, fascists, or anything like that. they're selfists.

Say I own a refinery and a bunch of oilwells. I've got tons of money, and I know that I can do nearly anything I want, regardless of what the law says. When the republicans, who generally get a lot of juice from the energy industry, are in power, I'm going to use that advantage, to increase that enterprise.

When the Democrats are in power, I will focus on some other area of my investments, like pharmaceuticals. Under each party, I get different types of leverage. but I hopefully don't lose the leverage I gained under the previous administration.

Guns and gun control are big business. the biggest business, in some ways, since force and the possibility of force are what back all "property rights". Right now, the people who want to disempower gun owners are doing a much better job of leveraging the political parties than we are, partially because most of us think the conservatives are our buddies, when really they just see us (and everyone else) as a means to an end. Just like the Democrats.

We can't wait for them to save us, because they won't unless they see some benefit in doing so.

 

[St. Gregori]

Come now, you have to know that the people writing the 2nd Amendment knew beyond a shadow of a doubt that it would eventually be violated, otherwise why write it? The purpose of the 2nd Amendment was to keep the means to successfully revolt against the government. Violent revolution would only be necessary when faced with a government that was denying rights, not respecting them, so while the 2nd Amendment was being respected the need for it was nil. Perhaps the 2nd Amendment is reaching the culmination of it's purpose, having safeguarded the people's means of self-defense for the day those means would be called upon. Perhaps that day still lies in the future.

On the bright side, unlike the Revolutionary War those people who don't understand the danger in a disarmed populace are unlikely to intervene effectively on the behalf of the Government because they are will no longer possess the means to do so (having turned their weaponry in to the State).