Off Duty cop goes on a rampage...

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Good question... I wonder if they will try to spin this tragedy to their advatage like always.

Please no police bashing.
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I agree. This man was obviously mentally disturbed. Police officers are human just like all of us. Usually in the process of becoming an officer, those who are mentally unstable are weeded out, but I guess a few can make it through the cracks, because mental examinations are not 100% effective.
 
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but I guess a few can make it through the cracks.
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The thing is, spot checks are just that. I could legally buy a gun today, and go out and massacre a playground full of kids tomorrow. Same deal with cops - passing the psych eval only means that they're nice, normal people, not that they can't be subject to the same impulses, emotions and passions that everyone else is susceptible to.

That said, I feel that the way the media paints the people who pull things like this as mentally unstable is the wrong way to look at it. I'm sure by all accounts this guy was a nice, upstanding average dude up until this happened. So why did it happen? He made a decision - one that made sense to him, whether right or wrong, good or bad, tragedy or no.

What I'm getting at is that this isn't some pre-existing condition that so happened to finally manifest itself, but a human being simply following the impulse of the moment.

Not trying to take away from how horrible this is - I just find it strange that this sort of thing is accepted and blown off as "oh, he was mentally unstable." :confused:
 
I am not bashing cops, but it seems to me that possibly, the screening methods most police departments have, wasn't in place or isn't effective. And how can a 20 year old serve as a deputy and police when you have to be 21 to legally handle a pistol, or maybe I am ignorant of gun laws that govern the police. It is also suspuicious that the particular individual was supposedly dating a girl in High School. It just sounds fishy to me, perhaps the perp was on the force because of famliy connections or something else, I don't know. Could also be that the papers got the basic facts wrong. I'm still trying to figure out what kind of firearm the Keren guy shot all the hunters with. Still, I can't imagine he shock and sorrow the families of teenagers go through when something horrible like this happens. Scale that up about a thousandfold or a millionfold, and you have what would be the reaction to Glenn Beck's description of AlQueda's "Perfect Day". The papers mention a "Sniper", and like the other details, I hope that question is answered.
 
If the story gets looked into closer (as It will) that will be a help to understand the reason for it.
Sad to the max. There is nothing I believe to stop this type of behavior, it has existed since the dawn of time "Amok" is another term.

Amok:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Runs_amok

Berserk is another term that is very old.

HQ
 
First off I would like to ask all of you to pray for the families of the victims. If you don't pray then just think of their sorrow. Secondly, I want you to know that police officers have the highest rate of suicide of any proffesion in America. We see things everyday that we have to just put in the back of our minds and move on to the next call. Imagine if across your desk, or cubical, or whatever you see in front of you at work, was a car crash with a bleeding teenager screaming for her mother, an otherwise normal father who just beat his wife of ten years, or a gun shot victim holding your hand as he died. All three are things that I have seen this month.
I'm not saying that what this man did was right by any means, I'm just saying that the stress we endure is greater than most can imagen. He was obviosly a troubled young man that needed help and never got it. I don't think we will ever know a reason or motive for what he did. I think he just snapped and thought what he was doing was right. Once again, Pray for the families involved.

As far as him being a police officer at 20 years old, most states allow an officer to be sworn it at 19.
 
Oh for chrissake... He committed suicide by cop? And that is admirable to you? IN WHAT WAY?

Excuse me, but you need to get a serious grip on life.

LIFE IS NOT A MOVIE OR VIDEO GAME. Now go play your favorite thing until you get tired of it.

The real thing that folks need to pay attention to right now is the concept of "lockdown." Notice the same term used in prisons.

It basically guarantees two things: An easy supply of victims for the nutjob, and a buncha folks for the cops to interview after they show up and clean up.
 
ROMAK IV said:
And how can a 20 year old serve as a deputy and police when you have to be 21 to legally handle a pistol
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Forgot to address that in my OP, but I was thinking the same thing. I thought that you had to be 21 to act in any capacity as an armed peace officer (or even an armed security guard) due to the requirement to carry a handgun.

opd743 said:
As far as him being a police officer at 20 years old, most states allow an officer to be sworn it at 19.
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Interesting. Back in CA (I know, I know, "but that's California") the help-wanteds always mentioned you had to be 21. Maybe I'll ask around at the PD here - I like being helpful and I don't mind paperwork.
 
Tactical Ninja said:
Interesting. Back in CA (I know, I know, "but that's California") the help-wanteds always mentioned you had to be 21. Maybe I'll ask around at the PD here - I like being helpful and I don't mind paperwork.
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Sorry Ninja, should have read "here in Alabama". But I do think most states allow sworn officers at 19. I got my pistol permit at 19 by just going to talk to the sheriff and clear it through him. Could have helped that my dad works for him but anyone can legally do it here by special permit. But, if you go to the police academy before 21 you have to give them your gun and they let you have it back during different training days.

Stretchman, you are an idiot and people like you should not reproduce. Do you really think that it is better to get shot by police than to shoot yourself? I mean seriously, "Kudos for getting sniped", you have problems you need to look into.
 
Forgot to address that in my OP, but I was thinking the same thing. I thought that you had to be 21 to act in any capacity as an armed peace officer (or even an armed security guard) due to the requirement to carry a handgun.
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Wisconsin's law says that you have to be 18 to be an LEO....although most counties require deputies to be 21, and don't normally hire them until 23-ish. There are always exceptions, however.
 
At least he didn't suicide. Most guys turn the gun on themselves. Kudos to this guy for getting sniped.
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I hope this is sarcasm.. There is nothing honorable in what he did .. He deserves no "Kudos"
 
Speaking to the age issue . In smaller depts especially there are a lot of jobs that fall under the title deputy or officer . Jailer and animal control officer are two that immediately come to mind where a person would have the title but not necessarily be armed . Personally i dont see how this nutjobs employment is relevant to the murders he commited .
 
You only have to be 21 to BUY a handgun, not have one in your custody.

But, legalities aside, I think the sheriff here is in a very deep world of doo doo this morning for hiring the guy because of the age issue, real or not.
 
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I can't understand it

Especially the cute little 14 year old girl they just showed on TV.
What a vile madman.
I agree we should pray (if you're so inclined) for the families involved.

stretchman, I urge you to edit your post.
 
My heart goes out to the families who lost their young ones.

wrt. the blame game that's ensuing with the "how could they let this guy be a police officer?" line of questions.....

there is no such thing as "foolproof" character screening......and no way to accurately predict who's going to go postal when their girl friend dumps them.

but as the father of three daughters....I'm reminded of a couple things....

1. Romantic love evokes powerful emotions, feelings and reactions in people....especially "spurned" boy friends....young people do well when they steer clear of romantic relationships untill their mature enough to make and keep a commitment (i.e. save it for marriage).

2. Parents of 14 year old girls would do well to act like parents and raise their daughters to understand that partying with the boys till 3:00 a.m. is not such a great idea.

But....hey....let's absolve everyone who had years to influence wise decisions and lob a blame grenade at the county sherrifs office for failing to be all knowing about their deputies future actions.
 
This is just a terrible, terrible tragedy.

Personally, i am not going to second guess anything about this situation. Mental illness is such a nasty, subtle, ubiquitous, dynamic disease in american society (and the world). I don't think that any 100% screening procedures, etc. Some people go from being totally normal to spiraling into despair/instability over the course of weeks to months.

First the deacon in LA and now this. I will say that I honestly can't remember another case where a LEO was involved in such a monstrous act. Nothing like the postal worker incidents in the mid-late '90s. (nothing against postal workers, just the facts).

I think LEOs do a great job and this is just a terrible chance incident.

My thoughts and prayers with the families.
 
Nothing good ever comes from incidents such as these. This type of event provides the definition of meaningless tragedy.

It should serve as a reminder that violence and tragedy know no boundaries and can spring from the thoughts and actions of virtually anyone.

Is the local sheriff to blame for what this youngster did? Of course not. Is he responsible for the actions taken by one of his employees. YES. That is
the nature of authority. With authority comes responsibility, separate the two and all that is left is petty tyranncy. Whether or not the sheriff could have foreseen or prevented such an act by a deputy etc. is debatable it's unlikely that there was anything in this persons past to indicate he would act this way. The same can be said for any other employee of any other organization. The only person that I can say with 100% certainty would never do such a thing is myself. That is because I cannot read the minds and intentions of others. The same statement is true for all other people. Only the individual knows for sure what they are capable of deep down inside.

Life is cruel and capricious, enjoy it while you can and teach your kids to make the most of every day. We never know when the end will arrive prematurely.
 
"Is he responsible for the actions taken by one of his employees."

Why should one free person be responsible for the actions of another free person?

And another thing, he wasn't just an employee of the sheriff, as a LEO, I think he was an employee of Wisconsin and the US Gov't in general. If the sheriff is responsible for his actions, then so are all other Americans.
 
This type of event provides the definition of meaningless tragedy.
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No ! The definition of meaningless tragedy would be something like a rock crushes a bus load of nuns and orphans . This is a homicidal idiot on a rampage who feloniously took the lives of others, it had meaning ( at least to the shooter ) no matter how skewed and sick . IMHO label it as a meaningless tragedy belittles the level of victomisation he put the familys and friends of the kids as well as the kids themselves he killed through .
 
I have a feeling that the sheriff is going to have a very hard time explaining this away at election time.
 
'I have a feeling that the sheriff is going to have a very hard time explaining this away at election time."

I will not be surprised if the sherrif finds some way to blame it all on guns. Blaming the tool with draw attention away from him, as it does for those who depend on votes for their job. Will be interesting to see how this plays out, but the Brady Bunch et al will find some way also to blame guns. Call me jaded I guess....
 
I can't understand it

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Especially the cute little 14 year old girl they just showed on TV.
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No especiallys about it. Just because someone isn't young and pretty doesn't make their lives have any less value. Would it have been any less a tragedy if the house was full of overweight old men? Would you want to be the one to tell that to their wives, children and friends? Its a terrible tragedy for the families and friends of all SEVEN people who were killed. Even Peterson's family deserves our prayers now.
 
the anti's usually say that the police should be the only ones with guns....
now are they going to say that nobody should have guns?
 
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