Old 45-70 cartridge found near a road.

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GTFord1

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Long time reader, first time poster. I also post under this name on GlockTalk. I figured I'd post this here, too. It's always fun to know what you're looking at in a find.

Someone here at work found this yesterday on the side of the road while working. I think we pretty much locked down the fact it's a 45-70 round.

It measures 2 and 7/8" overall, the rim is approximately 5/8", and the case length 2 and 1/8" inches.

Someone over on GlockTalk mentioned with the case color and berdan primer that it may be from the late 1800's. The only thing you can read on the end is a "2," and a "5," that had another number in front that can't be made out due to the primer.

img1435vl4.jpg


img1430sz3.jpg
 
I'm not sure it is a 45-70.
And it hasn't been by the road very long.

Late 1800's?
We didn't use Berdan primers then, or steel cases either.
But we can't know this one is Berdan without taking it apart and looking at the flash-hole, or holes.

And it doesn't seem to even be an American headstamp, but I can't make it out very well in the photo.

rcmodel
 
Imagine if that thing was found on a road in the UK. Remember that poor .22 LR round last year?
 
Someone suggested it to be tinned brass, not steel. On the ring near the bullet, you can see a brass like color not obvious in the picture. Someone DID suggest it may be imported and not American made.
 
See if a magnet will stick to it.

If it's tinned brass, it won't.
If it's steel, it will.

rcmodel
 
Hey, good thinking. I never even thought about that.

It does NOT stick. Not one iota.
 
Well, there you go then!

But, I still feel someone just tossed it out a car window recently unless you live in a very dry arid climate.

Ammo exposed to the weather & ground for any length of time wouldn't look that good.

rcmodel
 
I've seen old .45-70 rounds in original boxes that looked very similar to that.
 
Yeah, I'd tend to agree that someone probably lost it fairly recently. It was found in Central Florida. Granted it hasn't rained here in the past couple of months much, but it'd still be in pretty bad shape if it'd been on the ground for a long time.
 
A member over on GT has pointed out it came from the Frankford Arsenal in Feburary 1895, one of the last produced for the Army. What a freak thing to find laying on the road.
 
What happened?
Click to expand...

I can't find the link, but basically, a store patron found a .22 LR round sitting on the doorstep of some fellow's shop, and in the next moment...

The bombsquad was called.
The entire street was placed under lockdown.
Stores were evacuated, and ambulances called for those who fainted at hearing the "terrible news".
The store owner was put through countless hours of investigation and interrogation, even though he had nothing to do with that cartridge sitting on his doorfront.
 
It does look like an old military 45-70 cartridge from the late 19th century. I have a fragment of a case that was pulled out of a river near a military post that was active from 1882-1911 and they are indeed berdan primed. The headstamp does seem to indicate that it was loaded at Frankford Arsenal during February of 1895. I have military 45-70 head stamp guide at home I would have to check to be sure.
 
Yup, old G.I. rifle round. The arsenal "tinned" the brass since some of the cartridge belts had leather loops, which would cause that green crud to stick to the brass.

This is because the chemicals used to tan the leather would react with the brass. You have probably all seen old leather rifle slings with brass keepers and hooks, which have some of this green crud.

Bart Noir
Who thinks that is the 405 grain bullet, not the 500 grain. But might be wrong.
 
You have a Frankford Arsenal .45-70-500 round there. The single digit refers to the month of manufacture, and the two digit number to the year. I have one just like it that my wife picked up off the ground here when we built our house about fifteen years ago. We are on the site of old Fort McKinney, established in 1878, and we are smack on the old firing range.

The round I have is headstamped 3-89, and in about the same condition--it is semiarid here. There is little doubt that it laid on the ground for about 100 years.

And yes, it WILL chamber.
 
The .45-70-500 Gov't--- From a time when the US Army was SERIOUS about stopping power! :D

I bet you would not have many "failure-to-stop" complaints with these in Iraq compared to the M-4/5.56 mm Green Tip combo.
 
Yeah, I'd tend to agree that someone probably lost it fairly recently. It was found in Central Florida. Granted it hasn't rained here in the past couple of months much, but it'd still be in pretty bad shape if it'd been on the ground for a long time.
Click to expand...

You would be very, very suprised. A buddy of mine's father was out hunting near an old fort down here in Port Charlotte, Fl. He tripped on a stick. He turned around and noticed it was a metal rod sticking out of the ground. Curious, he tried to pull it out and it wouldn't budge. He finally got it loose and it was an old rifle.

He called me to come look at it to see what I though and it appeared to be an old flintlock shotgun. It's been in the ground for a long, long time.

It was in suprisingly good shape for being buried where it was. The wood was almost intact, the metal was rusted and pitted but intact and there was even remants of the leather sling.
 
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