Old Model Vaquero Question

[Quickill]

I just purchased a Never-Fired Old Model Vaquero in .44mag for the sum of $400. I am really excited to get out to the range and test it out, I just have one question.

Do these revolvers have to be fed so that the hammer rests on a empty chamber or does it have the transfer bar safety. I have a New Model in .45lc and I know those are safe to be carried with all six, I have just never had any experiance with the Old Models.

Thanks!

 

[Oro]

Yes, you have the safety.

Rugers made after '73 have the transfer bar safety. The ones before that may have it as the company made a big push to add them and encouraged folks to send in their Blackhawks, etc. for the new parts.

But that's not important to you; the Vaquero came out in the early '90s and all of them have the transfer bar safety like all the SA guns post-73. I think that what might be confusing is that when people talk about Blackhawks and Super Blackhawks, "Old Model" means pre-safety, and "New-Model" means post-safety. But "Old Model" Vaquero means large frame, "New Model" means smaller frame - so It's an inconsistency in Ruger nomenclature that could easily confuse someone.

 

[VegasOPM]

Great gun at a great price- enjoy it. Although I would suggest starting with lighter loads unless you have spent a lot of time shooting SA's. Full power .44's out of the plowhandle design have a nasty habit of leaving marks on the web of the hand until you get then figured out.

 

[ArchAngelCD]

Actually, there really isn't an "Old" Vaquero. There is a New Vaquero and since you sometimes need to make the distinction I usually call them an "Original" Vaquero.

BTW, very nice Vaquero you have there. I was lucky enough to find one like that a while back but in .45 Colt. They are fun revolvers to shoot and can be shot with fairly hot loads like the Blackhawk.

 

[Oro]

there really isn't an "Old" Vaquero. There is a New Vaquero and since you sometimes need to make the distinction I usually call them an "Original" Vaquero.

So there exists a "New" Vaquero, but there isn't really an "Old" Vaquero? So you can have "New" but you don't have to have "Old" ? Cool. This frees me from the twin restraints of "rationality" and "history." You have a mental flexibility even Obama would adore. Hell, you should be a cabinet member.

Really?

I mean, I've seen Democrats make better arguments than that. That gave me a good laugh tonight...

 

[Jim Watson]

There is always the problem of what to call the previous model when the company comes out with something similar but "new and improved."
Technically, based on company literature, I think you have the Vaquero and the New Vaquero. No real need for adjectives on the older model. But people are not satisified with that, so you have Old and New.

It does annoy me that people will call a S&W Military & Police built in 1919 a "pre-model 10", though.

Do you think Julius Caesar gave his birthday as "100 BC" on official Roman documents?

 

[BlkHawk73]

uh boy... The "Old Model" designation was given to the pre-transfer bar models and was given this designation by the manufacturer. The "New Model" designation was given to the models which incorporate the transfer bar system and again was given the designation by the manufacturer. ALL single action revolvers made after 1973 by Ruger are "New Models" by design. The OM BH's are marked as simply a Blackhawk. The NM ones are marked as "New Models". Same model name with a different design.
With the Vaqueros, they are of course all New Models by design. As marked on them they are Vaquero andNew Vaquero They are two different models - different frames, cylinders, grip frames... Hence having the word "New" added to the given name, once again by the manufacturer. Why not simply call them as they're makers calls them?
If they were the same guns, then maybe the OM Vaquero terminology would fit but the current model is named the New Vaquero not just Vaquero as though it was a continuing run of the previous model bearing that name.

Ex: Ford made a Bronco a full size vehicle. Years later they made the Bronco II - a medium sized vehicle. Does that mean all the others became Bronco I's?

Vaquero = full sized
New Vaquero = medium sized

Like the Broncos, two different vehicles, two different revolvers.

 

[1911Tuner]

Technically, based on company literature, I think you have the Vaquero and the New Vaquero. No real need for adjectives on the older model.

Well...There should be a distinction made all the same. The "Old" Vaqueros were built on Blackhawk frames, and they're perfectly safe to fire with anything that a Blackhawk or Super Blackhawk will take.

Not so with the New Vaquero. The problem comes when a handloader comes across the
"Ruger Only" data in a manual...has just aquired a .45 Colt New Vaq...and proceeds to leap enthusiastically without looking. After all...He has a Ruger single-action. It'll be fine. Right?

Ka-flippin'-blooey.

What went wrong?

What went wrong, indeed.

You just know that it's happened...and if it hasn't...it will.

Quickill...Nice revolver! You should enjoy it. I'd like to find one in either caliber with that barrel length.

 

[BlkHawk73]

Well...There should be a distinction made all the same. The "Old" Vaqueros were built on Blackhawk frames, and they're perfectly safe to fire with anything that a Blackhawk or Super Blackhawk will take.

Not so with the New Vaquero.

Ahh but the New vaquero IS derived rom a Blackhawk sized frame. The 50th Ann .357 Blackhawk flat tops built on the same sized (medium) cylinder frame. Maybe that model sgould be dubbed the New New Blackhawk...maybe the Even Newer Blackhawk...

 

[Virginian]

I figure by putting SLIGHTLY confusing labels on their guns, Ruger may be trying to help improve the gene pool. Doesn't bother me a bit.

 

[1911Tuner]

Ahh but the New vaquero IS derived rom a Blackhawk sized frame.

Ahhh, but it's not the big honkin' New Model Blackhawk frame. It's the original medium .357 Magnum Blackhawk frame that the New Vaquero is based on...which is decidedly not up to 80% .44 Magnum pressures and recoil forces.

The .357 New Vaquero will take anything within SAAMI specs that you can throw at it, and probably then some. In .45 Colt, it's a whole 'nother smoke.

 

[ArchAngelCD]

Oro,
I was actually poking a little fun at the guys on the Ruger forum and a few guys here who actually scolded me for saying I had an "Old Vaquero" a while back. I also thought it was very strange someone could thing there could be a "NEW" model without there being an "OLD" model first. I guess I should have added this > so you would know what I was getting at...

 

[Dr.Rob]

Want more confusion? Ruger model numbers...

KBNV44712 means K(stainless), Blackhwak New Vaquero, 44 Magnum, 7 and 1/2 inch barrel. And that's the 'old' one.

 

[Oro]

I guess I should have added this > so you would know what I was getting at...

I should have added a smiley, too, so it didn't sound like I was berating you. On re-reading it now I come across that way and I did not mean to.

 

[Quickill]

Whoa, thanks for all the info guys. I really appreciate it. I hope to get to the range tomorrow and see how well she shoots.

Thanks for the warning Vegas I'll keep it light until I get the hang of it.

 

[Jim Watson]

Not so with the New Vaquero. The problem comes when a handloader comes across the
"Ruger Only" data in a manual...has just aquired a .45 Colt New Vaq...and proceeds to leap enthusiastically without looking. After all...He has a Ruger single-action. It'll be fine. Right?

This is the same guy who cannot tell there is a difference between Clays, International Clays, and Universal Clays because they all have the word "clays" on the label, right?
Had one the other day who did not think the color of the few little "dots" in the can would affect the load, either.

 

[1911Tuner]

This is the same guy who cannot tell there is a difference between Clays, International Clays, and Universal Clays

Yep. Gotta play to the lowest common denominator to make sure ya cover all possibilities.

True story. I'll keep it as short as possible and then I'll un-hijack the thread.

Guy walks into a local gun shop a few years back. 20-ish guy. Appears to be reasonably intelligent. Wants load data for .45 Colt. Owns an older 2nd Generation 1873 and wants to shoot it with black powder. Has some black powder in his possession, but not with him at the moment.

Guy behind the counter tells him to try 28-30 grains...advises him to use a drop tube. A few days later, guy's buddy brings in the Colt...completely smithereened. His buddy is in the hospital, undergoing surgery in an attempt to save what's left of his hand.

Starts confrontation with counterman who provided the data. Has the remaining powder with him.

It's Accurate Arms #5.

Well. It IS black...and it's pistol powder.

*sigh*

 

[Jim Watson]

We had a guy in this area known as "Scoops" because his idea of charging a round was to scoop the case full of whatever powder he had and crunch a bullet down on it. He had wrecked two .300 Win Mags when a friend working at a gun store figured out his illiteracy and would only sell him H870, too slow for a case full to be an overload. He also supplied him with H4227 with the admonition to use only it in his .44 Super BH and nowhere else.

 

[ArchAngelCD]

Oro,
No problem at all. I've been reading your posts long enough to know you meant nothing by it...

 

[The Lone Haranguer]

An "old model" Vaquero is the original, essentially the New Model Blackhawk with fixed sights. It still has the transfer bar action, as do all Ruger single-actions made 1973 and later. Therefore you can carry all chambers loaded. If using it for cowboy shooting you still have to only load it with five, however.

 

[Dr.Rob]

That was a great price btw.