Opinions of SpringField M1A Standard for Long Range Target Shooting
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ocabj
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The base model Springfield Armory Inc M1A can make hits at 600 yards with no problem. Granted, if you plan on shooting NRA/CMP High Power, you'll want the NM sights, but the rifle is good enough for 600 yard shooting. Good ammo (factory or reloads) will be the deciding factor.
10-Ring
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I have not been able to even begin to tap into the capabilities of my standard M1a....fantastic rifle! 
The stock M1A will work just fine for making hits at long range. As ocabj said, good ammo is key as well as your skill as a rifleman.
After you shoot the rifle for awhile and get a good feel for it, find a good gunsmith to do a trigger job, and to unitize the gas system. Those two mods will cost no more than $150 total. Combine this with a good tight fitting GI fiberglass stock which comes standard on the rack grade M1A, and you should have an excellent shooting rifle.
As always with M1As I recommend shopping around for an older M1A which will have mostly if not all GI parts. The older guns just have better components than the newer rifles do since SA Inc. ran out of original GI parts.
After you shoot the rifle for awhile and get a good feel for it, find a good gunsmith to do a trigger job, and to unitize the gas system. Those two mods will cost no more than $150 total. Combine this with a good tight fitting GI fiberglass stock which comes standard on the rack grade M1A, and you should have an excellent shooting rifle.
As always with M1As I recommend shopping around for an older M1A which will have mostly if not all GI parts. The older guns just have better components than the newer rifles do since SA Inc. ran out of original GI parts.
Lobotomy Boy
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How can you tell if you're looking at an older M1A with military parts?
Should not be a problem. Mine was a "loaded" standard with an ostensible NM barrel (if the stamp meant anything). The only thing I ever did with it was to have it glass bedded and the other NM mods (unitizing gas system etc) done after a couple of years.
It will ding things out to 600 yards nicely and I have shot it on identifiable rocks, sagebrush, and so forth all the way out to 1200 yards which is as far as the elevation knob will go. The 168 grain Sierra Matchking bullet will get all the accuracy there is in the barrel out of it and shoot more accurately than 147 grain ball. I have pulled targets for better shooters than myself on 600 yard strings and those groups can be downright scary--everything well inside a dinner plate.
Your eyeballs and shooting skills are more likely to be your limiting factors than the barrel.
I sure like mine.
It will ding things out to 600 yards nicely and I have shot it on identifiable rocks, sagebrush, and so forth all the way out to 1200 yards which is as far as the elevation knob will go. The 168 grain Sierra Matchking bullet will get all the accuracy there is in the barrel out of it and shoot more accurately than 147 grain ball. I have pulled targets for better shooters than myself on 600 yard strings and those groups can be downright scary--everything well inside a dinner plate.
Your eyeballs and shooting skills are more likely to be your limiting factors than the barrel.
I sure like mine.
There are many ways to tell. Do you want the long version or the short version?
In the interest of time and space I'll give you the short version.Basically USGI builders that were under contract to build the M14 were as follows:
Harrington and Richardson- Most common maker of complete M14 rifles. H&R parts are stamped "HRA".
Winchester- Maker of complete M14 rifles. Winchester parts are stamped 66118.
TRW (Thompson Ramo Woolridge) - Maker of complete M14 rifles. Parts are stamped "TRW"
Springfield Armory- Parts marked "SA" on an M1A may or may not be original GI. The original Springfield Armory is located in Springfield, Massachusetts and was closed by the U.S. government in 1968. The current "Springfield Inc." of Illinois just took over the non-trademarked name of a closed U.S. government arsenal. SA Inc. does a great job of misleading people to think they have some connection to the original U.S. arsenal, using marketing slogans such as "The Oldest Name in American Firearms". Nothing against SA Inc., they helped revive a classic rifle, produce a receiver legal for the average citizen to own, and have done a good job of it. It's not their fault that the supply of original GI parts ran out. The M1A is an expensive rifle to make and SA Inc. had to start making their own reproduction parts or else close the doors. Some of their repro parts are ok, some aren't so good and it shows.
Identifying original Springfield Armory parts of government manufacture can be a bit tougher, since the current commercial venture marks their parts similarly. For example, original (government) SA op rods are marked with part number 7267064 SA all in one line on the op rod. "SA Inc." reproduction op rods might have a -2 after the 7267064 part number with the "SA" stamp being above the part number instead of in line with the part number as would be found on an original GI op rod. I could go on and on, but the bottom line is buyer beware of SA marked parts. They may or may not be GI so do your homework.
SAK- Did not make complete rifles but did make op rods and barrels under government contract. My memory is failing me right now. I forget what "SAK" stands for, but I know they were definitely a government contractor.
This is just a quick and dirty rundown of original M14 manufacturers. You can learn a lot with a quick disassembly of a rifle into its basic components of trigger group, barreled action, and stock. My advice is to check critical components like op rods, trigger groups, hammers, sight assemblies, and to a lesser extent barrels for original GI stampings. Typically GI flash suppressors have splines that are more squared at the ends versus commercial versions that are rounded. There are many rear sight variations from GI contractors that I won't even begin to get into.
What does all this mean? Maybe nothing, or maybe everything. It just depends on whether you value having the best of the best in terms of parts on your rifle. Most of SA Inc's repro parts are good enough to get the job done, but some aren't so good, extractors being the number one problem. Go armed with as much information as you care to and spend your money accordingly.
Lobotomy Boy
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I've been thinking about getting some sort of .308 autoloader, either an M1A Scout, an SA58 FAL Predator, or maybe even waiting for the new Kel-Tec bullpup. The FAL and the Scout are almost identical in weight and price (9.3 pounds, around $1,500). I like the idea of the M1A just because the gun uses a great American design and has history, but are there any more measurable advantages? Any problems with the FAL or Springfield that I should be aware of?
Lobotomy Boy
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Thanks for the tips. That all makes a lot of sense, and explains why some of the new Springfield guns I've looked at have been less than impressive. I'm going to print out a document with your info when I go shopping at a gun show next month.
It's amazing how much a person can learn in a short amount of time when you gather this many knowledgeable people on one forum.
It's amazing how much a person can learn in a short amount of time when you gather this many knowledgeable people on one forum.
nbkky71
Member
A standard M1A will be able to reach out to 600 yards but the accuracy will depend on the ammo that you're using.
Using M80 ball ammo (or equivilent), you can expect accuracy to be in the 3-4" range at 100 yards. Using quality match ammo can shrink that down to 2-3".
As others have mentioned, there are things that can be done to your M1A to enhance it's accuracy potential:
1) bedding the rifle
2) unitizing the gas system
3) a good trigger job and
4) NM sights.
However, you just don't want to turn your $1000+ dollar rifle over to any gunsmith. Make sure that the 'smith that will do the work is familiar with the M1A/M14 platform.
Shooting at the 600 yard line you'll want to use either 168gr and 175gr ammunition. Once you have a good rifle you'll have to feed it good ammo!
USGI parts are desirable, but are not required. Since USGI parts are becoming scare they are commanding premium prices. If you want them, be prepared to pay. My M1A still sports the original SA, Inc. op-rod, barrel and trigger group. I did have a problem with the bolt but SA swapped it for a USGI bolt. All parts are holding up just fine.
Using M80 ball ammo (or equivilent), you can expect accuracy to be in the 3-4" range at 100 yards. Using quality match ammo can shrink that down to 2-3".
As others have mentioned, there are things that can be done to your M1A to enhance it's accuracy potential:
1) bedding the rifle
2) unitizing the gas system
3) a good trigger job and
4) NM sights.
However, you just don't want to turn your $1000+ dollar rifle over to any gunsmith. Make sure that the 'smith that will do the work is familiar with the M1A/M14 platform.
Shooting at the 600 yard line you'll want to use either 168gr and 175gr ammunition. Once you have a good rifle you'll have to feed it good ammo!
USGI parts are desirable, but are not required. Since USGI parts are becoming scare they are commanding premium prices. If you want them, be prepared to pay. My M1A still sports the original SA, Inc. op-rod, barrel and trigger group. I did have a problem with the bolt but SA swapped it for a USGI bolt. All parts are holding up just fine.
Zak Smith
Member
Think about if you are going to want to mount optics, and if so, how you will do it. The M1A/M14 is problematic for mounting optics due to the receiver arrangement.
Certainly long-range shooting can be done with iron sights - the High Power guys do it all the time - but realistically you are limited to the kinds of targets you can successfully see (ie, large and high contrast).
Certainly long-range shooting can be done with iron sights - the High Power guys do it all the time - but realistically you are limited to the kinds of targets you can successfully see (ie, large and high contrast).
Lobotomy Boy
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Good point about optics. I've had problems with ejected shells jamming between the receiver and scope on a Mini 14 Ranch; I imagine the same issues exist with the M1A.
The M1A might be a 600-yard gun when properly set up, but with iron sights I have 50-yard eyeballs. I keep getting new prescriptions in my glasses but my eyes keep getting worse each year. If I didn't know better, I'd almost suspect I'm getting older. I've grown to rely on optics for shooting at anything farther out than 50 yards.
The M1A might be a 600-yard gun when properly set up, but with iron sights I have 50-yard eyeballs. I keep getting new prescriptions in my glasses but my eyes keep getting worse each year. If I didn't know better, I'd almost suspect I'm getting older. I've grown to rely on optics for shooting at anything farther out than 50 yards.
Granted, the M14 pattern rifles are not the most friendly in terms of scoping. This can be overcome. I've always shot my M14 rifles with irons, but have decided to scope one of them with a 1.5-5 variable scope so I can try my hand at 3 gun competition.
I'm going with the ARMS #18 mount. This is the lowest M14 mount out there. A couple years back ARMS took a step back in my opinion and changed their mount by making it a solid picatiny rail instead of a split rail with two mounting points at each end. The old style mount allowed plenty of room for ejected brass to clear. With the newer mount, some people have had ejection problems.
The easy solution is to modifiy a new style ARMS to the old style. Simply section out a portion of the rail and you've created an old style ARMS mount. Any machine shop should be able to do this. Add in a set of medium height rings and you should have an optic that will sit as low as possible and still clear the rear sight assembly.
I'm using the VLTOR modstock, but without the cluster rail assembly which looks a bit clumsy. http://www.vltor.com/socom_pics.htm#CompleteKit
The VLTOR does much to solve the scope mounting issue on the M14. The stock has a full 1" of upward or downward movement for mounting optics or using iron sights while being able to get a proper cheek weld. This eliminates one of my dislikes about scoped M1As which is having to strap one of those funky cheek pieces to the stock. The stock even shaves a little weight off and maintains the good handling characteristics of the rifle.
I'm going with the ARMS #18 mount. This is the lowest M14 mount out there. A couple years back ARMS took a step back in my opinion and changed their mount by making it a solid picatiny rail instead of a split rail with two mounting points at each end. The old style mount allowed plenty of room for ejected brass to clear. With the newer mount, some people have had ejection problems.
The easy solution is to modifiy a new style ARMS to the old style. Simply section out a portion of the rail and you've created an old style ARMS mount. Any machine shop should be able to do this. Add in a set of medium height rings and you should have an optic that will sit as low as possible and still clear the rear sight assembly.
I'm using the VLTOR modstock, but without the cluster rail assembly which looks a bit clumsy. http://www.vltor.com/socom_pics.htm#CompleteKit
The VLTOR does much to solve the scope mounting issue on the M14. The stock has a full 1" of upward or downward movement for mounting optics or using iron sights while being able to get a proper cheek weld. This eliminates one of my dislikes about scoped M1As which is having to strap one of those funky cheek pieces to the stock. The stock even shaves a little weight off and maintains the good handling characteristics of the rifle.
I am planning on mounting and optic with a Sadlak mount. It seems to be the best mount available, a bit pricey but you get what you pay for. I have been using westtexasarmory.com for some M1a/M14 references also, check it out. I have also been looking at a Baucsh & Lomb 10x40 scope for the optic.
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