opinions of TAURUS 92, 58

[lions]

Can someone baby me through this? What do you guys mean when you refer to cocked and locked, decocker, sa, da on the Taurus?

Cocked and locked: hammer back, safety on.

decocker: push the safety lever up and it is the safety, pull it down and it is the decocker. Decocker lowers the hammer without you having to pull the trigger. It basically releases the hammer but blocks it from contacting the firing pin.

SA: single action- hammer is already cocked and pulling the trigger simply releases the hammer.

DA: double action- hammer is down and pulling the trigger cocks the hammer and then releases it.

The gun is da/sa which means it is capable of firing both ways.

 

[PlayMaker]

Quote:
Can someone baby me through this? What do you guys mean when you refer to cocked and locked, decocker, sa, da on the Taurus?

Cocked and locked: hammer back, safety on.

decocker: push the safety lever up and it is the safety, pull it down and it is the decocker. Decocker lowers the hammer without you having to pull the trigger. It basically releases the hammer but blocks it from contacting the firing pin.

SA: single action- hammer is already cocked and pulling the trigger simply releases the hammer.

DA: double action- hammer is down and pulling the trigger cocks the hammer and then releases it.

The gun is da/sa which means it is capable of firing both ways.

Ok, gotcha. So you can cock a round in the chamber, decock it so the hammer goes back but not all the way and still fire but with a longer pull of the trigger. And Berettas don't alow that? I thought I saw Ethan Hawk do it in Training Day?

 

[gmh1013]

I have a 92 thats about 10 years old with 20k rounds through it....but thats a guess. One of best Auto's
I have ever owned. I dont shoot it much anymore and bought a 917c to replace it.

 

[squinty]

Ok, gotcha. So you can cock a round in the chamber, decock it so the hammer goes back but not all the way and still fire but with a longer pull of the trigger. And Berettas don't alow that? I thought I saw Ethan Hawk do it in Training Day?

Read up on various action types. The 92fs is a double action/single action (DA/SA) pistol. It cannot be carried cocked, the way a single action pistol such as a 1911 can. The safety automatically uncocks the hammer. The taurus can be left cocked with a manual safety in place, much like a 1911, or carried with the hammer down ready for a double action pull.

http://www.thehighroad.org/showthread.php?t=248556
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Trigger_(firearms)
http://www.genitron.com/Glossary.html

 

[GLOOB]

Just noticed on the picture of the Taurus 92 that not only does it have a frame mounted safety, but it appears the safety also locks the slide closed?

It looks like Taurus took a decent European gun and made it totally awesome.

 

[Myles]

1990 model 92 ($295) with over 30,000 rounds through it.

At 20,000 I sent it to Taurus for replacement of the DA return spring.

At 30,000, I ordered a full spring set from Numrich, and did it myself.

Finish not as elegant as a Beretta, true. Out of the box workhorse - accurate, tough as nails, and reliable.

 

[seeker_two]

You can carry cocked & locked in single action or decocked & safety on in double action if you prefer.

I'm sorry Beretta fans, but I just think Taurus has constantly been the 1st to innovate the 92 leaving Beretta to follow.

You do know that the original Beretta 92's had frame-mounted safeties that allowed Condition 1 carry...and that the Taurus 92's are made on the machinery that produced those Berettas for the Brazillian military...

However, I share your enthusiam of the Taurus 92's.....I'm finding it harder to resist buying a 917 every day....

....if only it took those cheap surplus Beretta mags....

 

[galilgunner]

Love my Taurus PT99 I have had it since 1992, put alot of rounds through it, it has seen more than its share of water and mud, and always comes out firing. I can't remember ever having any kind of malfunction with it.

 

[JR47]

You do know that the original Beretta 92's had frame-mounted safeties that allowed Condition 1 carry...and that the Taurus 92's are made on the machinery that produced those Berettas for the Brazillian military...

Not exactly. The original Model 92 didn't have a decocking function. However, the Taurus Model 92 WAS made on the SAME machinery that Beretta used to produce the Model 92 for the Brazilian Army. Fit and finish were exactly the same.

The PT58, which I own, is a blow-back operated semi-auto. Mine is an early one, without a decocker function, and holds 12 in the magazine. The NEW PT58 HC holds 19 rounds in the magazine.

My old PT92 is also a pre-decocker model, with upwards of 20+k through it, on the same locking block. The older PT92 came with 15 round mags, while the new ones have 17 round mags.

I also own a PT101, adjustable sighted, .40 S&W, decocking variant. It has proven to be reliable, accurate, and durable, as well. It holds 12 rounds in it's magazine.

The PT58 later had the decocker added, and is a smaller package, much like the Beretta Model 84.

 

[cleetus03]

I'm sorry Beretta fans, but I just think Taurus has constantly been the 1st to innovate the 92 leaving Beretta to follow.

For better or worst, Here's a list of innovations that Taurus has made to the 92 platform.

1. As built from 1980 to 1983, the Taurus-made PT 92 differed from the early-style Beretta Model 92 only in different slide markings and grips, and in the addition of vertical grooves on the front and rear gripstraps (Beretta had added such vertical grooves to its own Model 92 series pistols with the experimental Model 92S-1 in 1978 but did not standardize this feature until they introduced the Model 92SB in 1981).

2. Forjas Taurus showed still more innovation in 1982 when they introduced the PT 99, identical to the PT 92 except for being outfitted with an adjustable rear sight and matching higher front sight.

3. Not an innovation but a note in Taurus keeping the Condition 1 ability in the original Beretta design. Early sales were limited, as the Taurus PT 92, like the early Beretta Model 92, lacked a mechanical device for automatically uncocking the hammer. The necessity of using the trigger to lower the hammer, creating the possibility of an accidental shooting, sharply constricted the PT 92’s appeal to police and military forces. (I believe practice & familiarity makes this issue nonexistent)

4. In 1991 Forjas Taurus changed the safety system yet again to allow a third position which would automatically decock the hammer when the shooter depressed the safety lever past the fire setting. Designated “PT 92AF-D” by the factory, Forjas Taurus improved this in 1992 by adding a small spring, about the size and shape of a paper clip, to the left-side safety lever. Retained by the left grip plate, this spring automatically resets the safety lever to its fire setting after the shooter depresses it to lower the hammer. This three-position manual safety/decocker has become standard on the Taurus PT 92 and PT 99 pistols ever since.

5. Another Forjas Taurus innovation dating from 1991 was the PT 92AF-S, which featured a stainless steel barrel and slide, atop an aluminum-alloy frame anodized a matching silver color. This predated Beretta’s own similar “Model 92 Inox” variant by almost a year.

6. In 2000 Forjas Taurus introduced a security key-lock system to the PT 92 series. Located in the rear gripstrap, this device locks the trigger mechanism until the owner releases it with a supplied special key

http://www.taurususa.com/newsreviews/HG2004_000.cfm

 

[John Wayne]

FWIW, M9 mags can be purchased for about $6 at a PX. If you plan on purchasing a lot of mags, this will quickly make up for the difference in price of the less expensive Taurus with its more expensive mags..

 

[cleetus03]

Anyone have an opinion, good or bad, of the Taurus 92 or Taurus 58? Worthwhile purchases or should I just save up more for Berettas?

My previous comments are in no way a attempt to turn this thread into a Taurus is better than Beretta rant. I firmly believe that both pistols are with out a doubt equal in ballistic performance as well as reliability & durability. I just want to reiterate that you get no advantage in these attributes when considering the higher priced Beretta 92.

The only differences in which you should consider before purchasing are the differing ergonomics. This is where different people will see the advantage in operating one over the other.

 

[squinty]

FWIW, M9 mags can be purchased for about $6 at a PX. If you plan on purchasing a lot of mags, this will quickly make up for the difference in price of the less expensive Taurus with its more expensive mags..

I can't shop at a PX as a civilian, can I? More to the point - Taurus and Beretta mags aren't interchangeable? I had assumed they were. I'm disappointed if they're not.

 

[pneumagger]

They are not interchangable "out of the box". While the release notch on both mags are located in the same position, the Taurus mag has a wider notch.

The Taurus mag's notch looks to be around 1/8" wide and the Beretta is about 1/16". I suspect a Taurus mag may work OK in a Beretta.
Dremmel or file to widen the M9 mag - either solution is fast and easy for converting Beretta mags to Taurus.

Alternatively, I suspect one may be able to install a Beretta Mag release (?) I do not own a Beretta, so that is speculation on my part.

 

[squinty]

Too bad. Magazine interchangeability would have been a big plus for me.

 

[huduguru]

It's my "get to my AK" gun and sits about 3 ft. away from my head
when sleeping.

 

[JR47]

Getting back to the original post, the PT58 was also available as a de-cocker, and in stainless steel, something that the Beretta 80 series was never available in.

 

[PlayMaker]

There is nothing bad anybody can say about the Taurus 92, even Taurus-bashers have to acknowledge how excellent the pistol is. The beretta does not look better. Believe me go to a shop and compare the two. I did and the Taurus took the cake in my opinion because of the all black/blued with the writing on the slide, which comes standard. That sir, is a classic that you'll never get tired of looking at. Beretta's look funny with the safety on the slide. To me it look like little wings that you'd find on the ankles of a some cartoon charicature. In my humble opinion the Taurus 92 is the best pistol ever made and I say that with all confidence. Reliability, durablity, accuracy, ergonomics, sexappeal, and any other category you can think of etc...are off the charts so you can put that out of your mind. I only have to say that if you don't plan on putting accessories on it, try to get one without the rail, I'm a purist at heart.

Whether the Beretta or Taurus depends on how you want to carry the gun. If you want to draw flip off the safety and have that critical first shot in SA then the Taurus all the way. But if you're one of those decocker guys then either will do. I'd still get the Taurus.

 

[PlayMaker]

Too bad. Magazine interchangeability would have been a big plus for me.

Just grind down the mag catch onthe beretta mags with a dremel tool a 1/16th of an inch and there you go...virtually identical.

 

[PlayMaker]

You do know that the original Beretta 92's had frame-mounted safeties that allowed Condition 1 carry

Everybody keeps bringing that up but good luck finding those in an antique store.

 

[Maj Dad]

Alphabet Soup

The older Berettas and Tauri (let's be proper here talking about our Taureses) did not have decockers, the newer ones do. It is a lever mounted either on the slide (Beretta, Smith & Wesson etc) or frame (Taurus, SIG etc) which when activated drops the cocked hammer safely into a de-cocked condition. From that condition, you can pull the trigger through a long(er) arc and fire the weapon, after which the weapon will cycle and end up cocked and ready to fire single-action (very short arc of the trigger). Colt/clone 1911s/older Berettas & Tauri do not have a decocker but have a frame mounted safety which can be activated only when cocked, and the weapon is said to be "cocked and locked," or condition 1 (see link for all othe conditions Col Cooper came up with).

My older PT-99 doesn't have the decocker, but it hasn't made any difference at all. I have decockers, but having grown up on 1911s it's second nature. I also sent it back to Taurus about 10-12 years ago when they were advertising action jobs (I think mostly new Wolff springs) for 50-60 bucks and it shoots really nicely. I used it to remediate a couple of friends who bolo'd the M9 qualification course in the AF prior to deployment and it did the job. Let them shoot a couple hundred rounds apiece to get used to it, then ran them through the target a couple of times & they did great. All in all, a great pistol and one I won't turn loose of anytime soon.

http://www.sightm1911.com/Care/1911_conditions.htm

 

[JR47]

The current Taurus Model 92, 58, and 100, and the like may STILL be carried in Condition One, unlike the others that you mention, with the slide mounted safety. They may also be Carried in Condition Two, hammer down on a chambered round, and be used as double action for the first shot. Unlike the earlier versions, like my PT58 and PT92, they do have a de-cocking function that loows the hammer to be dropped in a more safe manner.

 

[deon]

I have an airsoftgunKWC Taurus PT99 CO2 power, and my HG can not shoot in single shoot mode, only burst shoot mode, what the problem is that? the outer selector switch can be switch in single, burst or save but it can not shoot in single mode

anyone can help my problem?

 

[Nushif]

Oh god ... The Taurus version can be carried cocked and locked?

*sticks fingers in ears* LALALALA IDON'TNEEDANEWGUN!

 

[jon_in_wv]

You can call me a Taurus basher if you like, but I can't stand Taurus as a company or its products. BUT, there is nothing bad to say about the PT-92s/99s/58s. They are great, well made pistols. If I found a used one I would have no problems buying one.