Our Home Invasion 01-03-05
- Thread starter Puppy
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I talked with a detective this morning, they still have no suspect in custody that matches the description we gave of the intruder.
Not good news, and I am sorta troubled by this.
But I still wont second guess myself, I believe that had I attempted to take the intruder into custody, things might have turned sour & I may have been forced to shoot.
Not good news, and I am sorta troubled by this.
But I still wont second guess myself, I believe that had I attempted to take the intruder into custody, things might have turned sour & I may have been forced to shoot.
Anniversary
I have had a year to think about this incident.
So in retrospect ...
The act of opening ones front door when someone knocks is almost an instinctive, Pavlovian response.
Had the door knob not been "jiggled" before the knock, my condition of readiness would have been nil.
Answering the door was bad judgement on my part.
I have had mixed feelings about not attempting to have detained the intruder until the police arrived.
This is compounded by the fact that our home invader was never caught, which makes me second guess my initial commands of ordering him to "GET OUT!" instead of "ON THE FLOOR!".
Had I commanded "ON THE FLOOR!" would he have complied? would he have fled? would he have resisted?
Its difficult to say for certain but maybe just maybe I would'nt be wondering about the guy returning if he had complied or resisted ...
I have had a year to think about this incident.
So in retrospect ...
The act of opening ones front door when someone knocks is almost an instinctive, Pavlovian response.
Had the door knob not been "jiggled" before the knock, my condition of readiness would have been nil.
Answering the door was bad judgement on my part.
I have had mixed feelings about not attempting to have detained the intruder until the police arrived.
This is compounded by the fact that our home invader was never caught, which makes me second guess my initial commands of ordering him to "GET OUT!" instead of "ON THE FLOOR!".
Had I commanded "ON THE FLOOR!" would he have complied? would he have fled? would he have resisted?
Its difficult to say for certain but maybe just maybe I would'nt be wondering about the guy returning if he had complied or resisted ...
You've had a year with a safe family, so I'm guessing your second guessing is just that: guessing.
Unless the guy was terminally stupid (which he apparently wasn't, since he ran when you said 'get out'), he won't be back. If he did come back, he'd have to be terminally stupid to come back unarmed. He knows you have a gun, and he knows he'd have to act quickly to get anything malicious done, You didn't hesitate, and were ready by the time he turned around. Do you think he wants those odds?
Maybe the guy is already six feet under, because somebody less reputable than him put him there over an argument about drugs, and you'll never know because he was never identified in your crime.
Or maybe he found and loves Jesus, but is still afraid of the law.
The doubts will always be there. Hopefully you already have the story you'll be able to tell grandkids.
Merry Christmas to you and yours.
jmm
Unless the guy was terminally stupid (which he apparently wasn't, since he ran when you said 'get out'), he won't be back. If he did come back, he'd have to be terminally stupid to come back unarmed. He knows you have a gun, and he knows he'd have to act quickly to get anything malicious done, You didn't hesitate, and were ready by the time he turned around. Do you think he wants those odds?
Maybe the guy is already six feet under, because somebody less reputable than him put him there over an argument about drugs, and you'll never know because he was never identified in your crime.
Or maybe he found and loves Jesus, but is still afraid of the law.
The doubts will always be there. Hopefully you already have the story you'll be able to tell grandkids.
Merry Christmas to you and yours.
jmm
Keith Wheeler
Member
lbmii said:
Could be. That's why I like "black guns". Home/self defense is not about fighting a war, it's about taking control of the situation. Some people can only be brought "under control" by shooting them, but many of these people ("Bad Guys") are just lazy, easily frightened scavengers. It shouldn't be relied upon as the ultimate way to control the situation, but the added factor of laser sites, "assualt weapons", large capacity mags, whatever "evil gun stuff" that the public has been indocrinated by Hollywood to believe is "instant death" helps to gain their attention.
The Rabbi said:
Sound like an argument for stopping him once and for all.
However, I am not criticising the decision not to shoot/hold him. I was not there.
I once had a guy banging on my door yelling and screaming (he was drunk). I pointed my rifle out the door as I opened it and he got real polite and seemed to sober up. Said his girlfriend used to live there. Because he then retreated, I did not shoot him. I did not even call the police.
Sean85746
Member
Good job....though I'd shot if he advanced any further, no hesitation, I would not have been able to resist letting my rottie chew on him until the police arrived.
Remember what Machiavelli said:
If an injury has to be done to a man, it should be so severe that his vengeance need not be feared
I like it said:
If you force me to do violence, then I shall hurt you so badly, and so severely, the thought of revenge shall never cross your mind.
Remember what Machiavelli said:
If an injury has to be done to a man, it should be so severe that his vengeance need not be feared
I like it said:
If you force me to do violence, then I shall hurt you so badly, and so severely, the thought of revenge shall never cross your mind.
BullfrogKen
Moderator Emeritus
I think you did fine. Stop second guessing yourself. Killing a man scars the soul. Many a justified shooting has put people into depression. You could be here a year later, watching a man dying before your eyes each time you lay down to sleep, playing it over and over again, wondering if you really had to do it. Everyone who beats their chest saying how they'd have killed this man and had been happy to do it, my guess, has no experience killin' a man.
You did a good job. I'm glad you are OK. I have no doubts if this person needed killing you would have done it. I'm quite sure he knew you were in control and knows you spared his life, and he was beyond joy to have escaped this encounter with his life.
Everyone, please keep your doors locked 24/7. Even a locked screen door is an impediment to entry, as it must be forced open and it alerts the homeowner to the forced entry. A series of 3 home invasions occured in my area this week, all in one evening. In one of the invasions, the burglar gained entry to a dwelling occupied by college students. One young, attractive girl interviewed opined, "I don't know why he chose OUR house." She commented that they never lock their doors.
You did a good job. I'm glad you are OK. I have no doubts if this person needed killing you would have done it. I'm quite sure he knew you were in control and knows you spared his life, and he was beyond joy to have escaped this encounter with his life.
Everyone, please keep your doors locked 24/7. Even a locked screen door is an impediment to entry, as it must be forced open and it alerts the homeowner to the forced entry. A series of 3 home invasions occured in my area this week, all in one evening. In one of the invasions, the burglar gained entry to a dwelling occupied by college students. One young, attractive girl interviewed opined, "I don't know why he chose OUR house." She commented that they never lock their doors.
IndianaDean
Member
- Joined
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Good job and awareness.
Anderson is a somewhat depressed city. GM shipped all the jobs there down to Mexico and elsewhere and the city largely depended on the Delco Remy plant. Very sad.
The only thing I'd do different is, I don't open the door for people I don't know. Then again, I can see them through a window, it's not a completely solid door.
Anderson is a somewhat depressed city. GM shipped all the jobs there down to Mexico and elsewhere and the city largely depended on the Delco Remy plant. Very sad.
The only thing I'd do different is, I don't open the door for people I don't know. Then again, I can see them through a window, it's not a completely solid door.
GoBrush
Member
DarkKnight01 said:
Like you said I dont like to monday morning quarterback either and I am not judging at all just wondering how I might have handled it.
While the main objective was met and all where safe I do agree with DarkKnight
Nice job sounds like I need to keep my gun a little closer to the front door. Nice job glad all ended well.
GoBrush
loose cannon
Member
wow big thread but important stuff.to those who may think "i live in the middle of nowhere this cant happen here",,,,,
i live 5 miles from a small town of 7-800 people.near this town a home invasion was commited by a fellow with a single shot shotgun loaded with a rifled slug.when he entered the house,the homeowner fetched a sks rifle and atempted to repel boarders.the invader fired first and the slug nearly took off the home owners arm,he managed to scare the guy off with several inacurate rounds.
lessons;have good doors and lock them this guy got in way to fast and easy.
2,if hes in your house dont hesitate shoot him quickly and accurately and multiply.3,be ready to be shot and have a plan and mindset to keep fighting till the threat has ended and the means and knowledge to do first aid on yourself.this guy is lucky he only lost his arm!as it was he nearly bled to death.4, if possible get your wife involved in defense.this guys wife was a spectator,tho i think she did some first aid on her husband.5, like others have posted here have the gun on you so you dont waste valuable time"fetching"it.
and above all be ready,it can happen anywhere and anytime.no place is safe!
by the way the invader was arrested and will be(hopefully)doing alot of time.
i live 5 miles from a small town of 7-800 people.near this town a home invasion was commited by a fellow with a single shot shotgun loaded with a rifled slug.when he entered the house,the homeowner fetched a sks rifle and atempted to repel boarders.the invader fired first and the slug nearly took off the home owners arm,he managed to scare the guy off with several inacurate rounds.
lessons;have good doors and lock them this guy got in way to fast and easy.
2,if hes in your house dont hesitate shoot him quickly and accurately and multiply.3,be ready to be shot and have a plan and mindset to keep fighting till the threat has ended and the means and knowledge to do first aid on yourself.this guy is lucky he only lost his arm!as it was he nearly bled to death.4, if possible get your wife involved in defense.this guys wife was a spectator,tho i think she did some first aid on her husband.5, like others have posted here have the gun on you so you dont waste valuable time"fetching"it.
and above all be ready,it can happen anywhere and anytime.no place is safe!
by the way the invader was arrested and will be(hopefully)doing alot of time.
ingram
Member
Thank you for sparing your daughter having to witness that.
You made the right decision.
I find it hard to imagine he would ever consider returning. These lowlifes are looking for easy prey, not revenge against a would-be victim.
Stay sharp.
You made the right decision.
I find it hard to imagine he would ever consider returning. These lowlifes are looking for easy prey, not revenge against a would-be victim.
Stay sharp.
Skeptic
Member
Puppy,
Listen to BullfrogKen...... sounds like he really knows what he is talking about.
You and your family are alive and well - and you have not spent large amounts of money defending yourself in court.
You did good....
Listen to BullfrogKen...... sounds like he really knows what he is talking about.
You and your family are alive and well - and you have not spent large amounts of money defending yourself in court.
You did good....
Thanks for all of the replies, I am very glad that things worked out the way they did but I just havent been able to "set the incident aside" like I had hoped.
Some of the thankfully unanswered questions that are really disturbing are:
What if I had been unarmed?
How many times could I have been stabbed before loosing consciousness?
What would have happened to my wife, or to my little girl?
Some of the thankfully unanswered questions that are really disturbing are:
What if I had been unarmed?
How many times could I have been stabbed before loosing consciousness?
What would have happened to my wife, or to my little girl?
Molon Labe
Member
I wouldn't be so sure of that.grimjaw said:
The intruder knows he has a gun, and surmises he may have more than one. To criminals, guns are more valuable than gold. He may come back and try to steal his guns when he thinks no one is home.
Tequila_Sauer
Member
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If you hadn't been armed when he pushed the door open, you might have had time to arm yourself in the time he was closing the door.
Either way, it's great that everything turned out well. You can't live your life wondering what would've happened if the variables were less favorable. Furthermore, no doubt about it, you made the BEST possible decision. Shooting and/or detaining the guy could've both led to more dangerous outcomes.
I don't own a firearm to shoot people as an act of revenge or even to attempt some kind of citizen's arrest, I own one to stop harm from coming to me or my loved ones. Once I know that I have prevented that harm, the police and my insurance company can handle anything else from there.
Either way, it's great that everything turned out well. You can't live your life wondering what would've happened if the variables were less favorable. Furthermore, no doubt about it, you made the BEST possible decision. Shooting and/or detaining the guy could've both led to more dangerous outcomes.
I don't own a firearm to shoot people as an act of revenge or even to attempt some kind of citizen's arrest, I own one to stop harm from coming to me or my loved ones. Once I know that I have prevented that harm, the police and my insurance company can handle anything else from there.
gunsmith
member
don't worry about the what if's
isn't anything you can do about the past.
as far as detaining him goes, sure you detain him,& he spends a few months in jail planning revenge. you shoot him? his relatives plan revenge & have your address.
he hasn't been back all year so I doubt he will ever come back. personally,
I would have shot him though, i am a victim of a home invasion and after they tied me up they stabbed me in the back and cut my wrist as they were slicing the duct tape. (thats why I'm an ex new yorker)
isn't anything you can do about the past.
as far as detaining him goes, sure you detain him,& he spends a few months in jail planning revenge. you shoot him? his relatives plan revenge & have your address.
he hasn't been back all year so I doubt he will ever come back. personally,
I would have shot him though, i am a victim of a home invasion and after they tied me up they stabbed me in the back and cut my wrist as they were slicing the duct tape. (thats why I'm an ex new yorker)
Daniel T said:
I have to say that even as murder happy as I am, I wouldn't kill a man in front of my wife and children, unless he made a move or they left the room... although after he closed the door, I know I would have double tapped him. By closeing the door he set himself up.
You showed good restraint, I've spent too much time clearing houses to show restraint... Fallujah will be with me for the rest of my life. I already live with PTSD, so a few more killings won't haunt me too much more.
I'd like to take a criminal like that and zip tie his wrists and stick a sand bag over his head like we do to the insurgents we capture... I think that would be fun, wonder what the cops would say? I'd have to get all geared up in uniform, vest on with sappi plates, drop holster, Berreta 92FS, my M4 clone out, and standing over some dude on the side walk hog tied with zip ties and a sand bag over his head
Cali Cops would probly lock me up and let him go because I was a mean person!
cz75bdneos22
Member
good to hear you are safe...
my advice...do'nt ever open your door, even if armed...i'm glad you had a happy ending...it could have been really, really worse...best wishes overcoming that uneccessary aggravation brought upon you and your loved ones..thanks for sharing...it's good to know...
my advice...do'nt ever open your door, even if armed...i'm glad you had a happy ending...it could have been really, really worse...best wishes overcoming that uneccessary aggravation brought upon you and your loved ones..thanks for sharing...it's good to know...
Taurus 617 CCW
Member
Good job on awareness and being prepared. Even in your own home it's a good idea to remain in condition yellow.
Tequila_Sauer
Member
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One additional thought, and I don't know if this has been mentioned yet (too lazy to read all of those pages), have you discussed home protection with your wife?
One thing I discuss with my g/f (she lives with me) is a time may come when not only will it be a good idea for me to arm, but a good idea for her, as well. If something like this were to happen, I would hope she would run to the bedroom, lay the baby on the bed and grab for the ballistic baby! I try to prepare her for the situation where she may need to back me up or even save my life. Say you answered the door and didn't have the firearm, now it's up to her to save YOU.
As a matter of fact, I'll be posing this same situation to her tonight, but removing the fact that I had a firearm and that she will need to run and get it if I'm unable to. I'm constantly trying to get her used to the idea that, part of the reason for the firearm, is that one day, I may not be there to protect her and she'll need to defend herself.
One thing I discuss with my g/f (she lives with me) is a time may come when not only will it be a good idea for me to arm, but a good idea for her, as well. If something like this were to happen, I would hope she would run to the bedroom, lay the baby on the bed and grab for the ballistic baby! I try to prepare her for the situation where she may need to back me up or even save my life. Say you answered the door and didn't have the firearm, now it's up to her to save YOU.
As a matter of fact, I'll be posing this same situation to her tonight, but removing the fact that I had a firearm and that she will need to run and get it if I'm unable to. I'm constantly trying to get her used to the idea that, part of the reason for the firearm, is that one day, I may not be there to protect her and she'll need to defend herself.
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