mljdeckard
Member
Even if you live off-base, the commander still owns you. You live off-base with the permission of your commander. The commander can punish individually or collectively and make you move back on-base.
personal guns in military armory (registration?)
- Thread starter Skillet
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I had to keep my shotgun and pistol in the armory when I lived in the barracks on Ft. Knox in the early 90's. I don't recall any paperwork though. Didn't bother me. I partied hard living in the barracks. Was probably the best place for me to keep them.
I lived in base housing in Guantanamo Bay, Cuba for a couple of years. I ordered a Ruger Redhawk 44 Mag and GP100 357 Mag through the Navy Exchange and when they arrived I was permitted to keep them in base housing. I had to get approval from the CO and the Master Chief in charge of Security before I could keep them at the house. At first the Security Chief refused my request for the 44 mag as he said that he didn't want his patrolmen to face guns of a larger caliber than they were issued. This was overridden by the base commander when the request hit his desk. To get ammo I had to order it through the Navy Exchange and it had to be shipped in on a barge that arrived once a month. This was in 1979 so I imagine the rules have probably changed since then.
statelineblues
Member
In the Army in 1978 I was stationed in So. Korea and I bought a Ruger Blackhawk .41 Mag through the 8th Army Rod and Gun Club (I was 19 at the time). I lived in barracks so it lived in the armory. I never had a problem and could sign it out at any time. Yeah, ammo was a PITA to get and had to live with the gun. When I came back stateside it went into the Hold Baggage with a DF Form signed by my Company Commander. Never had a problem.
Nothing new here. When I joined the Army in 1971, my first assignment was to Germany where I lived in the barracks on post. A couple of guys I knew had some personally owned weapons that they were required to keep in the arms room. Throughout my career, moving from post-to-post, the same thing occurred … you lived in the barracks … you kept your personal weapons secured in the arms room. If you lived on post in family housing, then you could keep them at home. Registration with the base was common throughout, more for accountability and loss. In a couple of discussions throughout the years about why they were kept in the arms room was that, unlike your home, barracks and the like were considered common use areas. Many of the barracks had shared living quarters that were not under full control of the occupant or owner. The solution of course … move off base if you could, or get married and move into base housing.
mljdeckard
Member
The other difference in Germany is, in keeping guns in your quarters, you are getting access to guns that most German people don't enjoy. We had a big flap in 1993 when a juvenile dependent borrowed his dad's 9mm and took it to school, out and about off-post in Germany. We nearly had to give up POWs in quarters in the SOFA because of that.
buckstrucks
Member
Ok this is one hell of a place for a first post. I did 5 years USCG, and my last ship was home ported out of one of the biggest CG bases there is. You were allowed to transit on and off base with your long guns/weapons, and CC. As long as they weren't visible. The amount of sportsmen/women there essentially required them to allow it. Fire arms were also permitted in base housing, but I am not sure of the requirements for paperwork. When I lived in the barracks I made the decision as a grown up E4 that my guns would never see the inside of the base armory, so the two I had with me at the time lived locked in the tool box of my truck. The base armory was safe and secure but the inventory lists were used to confiscate guns from vehicles if they weren't turned in in a timely fashion. They would see that SN/FN xxxx had a Rifle checked out on Friday after liberty and on Sunday it still wasn't back in the armory. So they would use the base sticker list to find their vehicles license number, and start probing the car. If they could see it, or any signs of it they would then find the members barracks room, force them to open the car and seize the weapons. Getting the gun back required a bunch a letter from your CO saying that you were a bad boy and were very very sorry.
This drove me crazy as it targeted Jr. enlisted people that were single. You could live on the other side of the base in the apartments for small families, and have your guns with you. But if you were stuck in a little barracks room you couldn't. Having a gun on base was also perfectly fine, unless you lived in the barracks and had them in the armory at some point. One way around this problem was to lock them in the ships armory, but that required a letter signed by your CoC and the Co. I got some guys together moved off base and avoided the problem all together.
This drove me crazy as it targeted Jr. enlisted people that were single. You could live on the other side of the base in the apartments for small families, and have your guns with you. But if you were stuck in a little barracks room you couldn't. Having a gun on base was also perfectly fine, unless you lived in the barracks and had them in the armory at some point. One way around this problem was to lock them in the ships armory, but that required a letter signed by your CoC and the Co. I got some guys together moved off base and avoided the problem all together.
mljdeckard
Member
Yes, there is an ongoing tradition in the military of inequality between soldiers on and off-post.
The number of sportsmen and the carry laws in Utah certainly hasn't persuaded Hill AFB to be flexible.
At other posts, like Guard HQ and Camp Williams, it is illegal, but I don't know of anyone who has ever been searched or caught. (I don't do it, with my luck, the day I decide to try it will be the day there is a terror threat and they will be giving anal probes at the gate.)
The number of sportsmen and the carry laws in Utah certainly hasn't persuaded Hill AFB to be flexible.
At other posts, like Guard HQ and Camp Williams, it is illegal, but I don't know of anyone who has ever been searched or caught. (I don't do it, with my luck, the day I decide to try it will be the day there is a terror threat and they will be giving anal probes at the gate.)
I store a couple old guns in armory once. Had just flew in from leave and needed like two days store so I could out process the dorms. PITA but they took em on a temp receipt after convincing armorer i had no means to store off base. Having worked with armorers, I wouldn't want to keep any nicer or valuable guns in there, some of the shiney or cool looking ones may well get messed with. They're not registered per say in armory just logged in detail, doesn't go anywhere else. Even the base housing "registration" is actually limited and yeah...not always kept up to date.
VA27
Member
Bought my Winchester 94 Classic off the rack in the BX! Of course this was in 1969. I was between tours and it lived in the base armory until I returned and got out in '70.
No place to secure it in a communal barracks and I didn't ask if I could bring it on the ship.
No place to secure it in a communal barracks and I didn't ask if I could bring it on the ship.
Dave Rishar
Member
During my very last tour in the Navy, I manned the base armory on duty days. I'd be lying if I said that I remembered the whole procedure (this was eight years ago) but there was additional paperwork involved beyond checking service weapons in and out, enough that we didn't like processing it. I seem to remember it not going anywhere - it was mostly to establish a chain of custody and so that we could keep track of personally owned weapons during inventories. (They got inventoried the same as the service weapons did.)
A requirement for storage was that the weapon show up with a lockable hard case. The person checking it in showed that it was unloaded, locked the case, and that was the last that we saw of it. We did not have keys to the cases. Other posts might do things differently. When we inventoried these weapons, we were basically checking that the case was there, it was still locked, and it had the appropriate tag on it.
The inconvenience came from our hours. The armory was not manned 24/7. It operated during normal business hours Monday through Friday and re-opened around 2230 for the swing shift/graveyard turnover, but personally owned weapons would not be checked in or out during that time as a matter of policy. Likewise, the duty armorer would occasionally come in on weekends (besides security force turnovers) to check in/out match or ceremonial weapons and was essentially on call, but that number was not common knowledge. Rarely someone was PCSing in on a weekend; in that case, security would give us a ring and we'd head on down to check it in. This was not done with things being checked out.
Yes, it's inconvenient, and yes, it's there for a reason. Trust me when I say that your base armorers would much rather not deal with your guns, as they already have plenty to keep track of.
Oh, and before I forget...that paperwork didn't go anywhere. It was strictly for internal use. I think that we sent copies to security but don't quote me on that. Our primary concern was making sure that the owner's gun was unloaded and and available if the owner came looking for it, and the paperwork was meant to facilitate that.
On the ship, things were...well, different. That's probably a topic for another thread.
A requirement for storage was that the weapon show up with a lockable hard case. The person checking it in showed that it was unloaded, locked the case, and that was the last that we saw of it. We did not have keys to the cases. Other posts might do things differently. When we inventoried these weapons, we were basically checking that the case was there, it was still locked, and it had the appropriate tag on it.
The inconvenience came from our hours. The armory was not manned 24/7. It operated during normal business hours Monday through Friday and re-opened around 2230 for the swing shift/graveyard turnover, but personally owned weapons would not be checked in or out during that time as a matter of policy. Likewise, the duty armorer would occasionally come in on weekends (besides security force turnovers) to check in/out match or ceremonial weapons and was essentially on call, but that number was not common knowledge. Rarely someone was PCSing in on a weekend; in that case, security would give us a ring and we'd head on down to check it in. This was not done with things being checked out.
Yes, it's inconvenient, and yes, it's there for a reason. Trust me when I say that your base armorers would much rather not deal with your guns, as they already have plenty to keep track of.
Oh, and before I forget...that paperwork didn't go anywhere. It was strictly for internal use. I think that we sent copies to security but don't quote me on that. Our primary concern was making sure that the owner's gun was unloaded and and available if the owner came looking for it, and the paperwork was meant to facilitate that.
On the ship, things were...well, different. That's probably a topic for another thread.
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