Philly has 21 murders in 8 days - so mayor wants moratorium on CCW permits!

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Preacherman

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From CBS3 in Philadelphia (http://kyw.com/news/local_story_074120610.html):

Mayor Declares City Violence A Crisis

The Public Is Urged To Come Forward

Mar 15, 2005 6:00 pm US/Eastern

PHILADELPHIA (KYW) Police and prosecutors concerned with a spate of killings in the city begged the public Monday for more help identifying murderers.

District Attorney Lynne M. Abraham vowed that her office will protect witnesses, even if it means sending a moving van to their home to take them to safety the day they come forward.

“We cannot only move you out of the city, we can move you out of the state; we can move you across the country,†Abraham said.

Within the past eight days there have been 21 homicides in Philadelphia, including three in the late-night and early morning hours after the prosecutor made her appeal Monday.

Now, CBS 3’s Walt Hunter reports that Mayor Street said under certain circumstances he would consider help from the Pennsylvania State Police and even the National Guard.

Street has declared the violence throughout the city a crisis and as a result has ordered the full review of police department policies and has suggested a full moratorium on the issuing of gun permits.

In addition, Street has requested a meeting with Governor Ed Rendell to talk about possible new gun legislation.


A 44-year-old man was found shot in his home early Tuesday morning. A 22-year-old man was shot several times in the street late Monday in a killing police believe was drug related. A 21-year-old man was shot during an argument.

The deaths brought Philadelphia’s 2005 murder total to 76, up from 66 at the same point a year ago, police said.
Homicide Capt. Richard Ross said police have had to solve most of the crimes without the public’s help.

“We’d like to see it come from cooperation from the public and not just from excellent police work,†Ross said. “We’d like to see a combination of the two.â€

Law enforcement officials have been on a campaign to persuade city residents to cooperate more with police since last year’s killing of Faheem Thomas-Childs, a 10-year-old boy struck by a stray bullet outside at his North Philadelphia school. The shooting happened in front of dozens of people, but few witnesses have spoken up.
“We know that people know who killed Faheem Thomas-Childs. We know that people know. We need them to come forward,†Abraham said. Nearly all progress made in that investigation has come from the work of the U.S. Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco, Firearms and Explosives, not from the public, she said.

Abraham would not discuss the case of Felix Summers, a 24-year-old man accused by federal authorities of killing off a string of witnesses who were to testify against him in as many as four murders. Summers, who has not been accused in any of the current cases, was acquitted in two homicide trials and a jury deadlocked in another trial last week. His lawyer says he had nothing to do with the witnesses’ deaths and was being persecuted by overzealous prosecutors.

Ross said he was especially unnerved by Saturday night’s slaying of 9-year-old Walter DeJesus, who was shot dead outside the corner store his father runs in North Philadelphia. He said police had “virtually no information†about that death and described going to the scene Saturday night, right after he had gotten home from investigating other killings.

“My daughter, who’s the same age, asked me, ‘Daddy, where are you going?â€â€™ Ross said. â€All I could say was, ‘A little boy your age got hurt.â€â€™
 
Funny that most people pretty much think the opposite way. i.e. CCW applications usually go up after incidents like this right?
 
During the 1992 Los Angeles riot, Mayor Tom Bradley and Chief of Police Darryl Gates decided the cure was to order all gun stores closed and ban the sale of ammunition in the city limits.

It was a truly enlightening time for those first time handgun purchasers outside the city limits to pay for their weapon and then find out they had to wait fifteen days to take it home. I remember one news story account of a first time handgun purchaser also becoming a black powder shooter when he figured out he could take immediate delivery of his Ruger black powder revolver.

Just you wait. Some day there will be a food shortage/riot and the politicians' solution will be to order the grocery stores closed.

Pilgrim
 
how exactly is taking one of the most effective means of self defense away from the good guys going to help stop the bad guys? If there had been a string of public servant homicides (and they were targets), would he be advocating disarming cops?
 
This type of reasoning from officials is astounding......

He has to "seem like" he is doing something other than twiddling his fingers and taking kick backs so now the fattest calf to slaughter is obviously the concealed carriers.....As we all know there is no way he could actually get the actual murderers/weapons without real work so the next best thing is to take away the legal guns that he can turn to his position of,"See I really do care about you lesser people by taking away your ability to defend yourself effectively"....... :cuss:
 
A better solution would be to have the Director of Public Health declare a quarantine. Seal off the city. Don't let anyone outside of their home. Anyone outside without permission will be arrested and quarantined aboard a ship. Need to work? Ha! Do it over the internet? Oh, you're a mechanic and you have to physically work on the car? Nahhh. No one is driving around except the police & the health department. Denied. :p
 
That mayor is just following the old Russian method:

The rain failed.
The crops wilted.
The peasants are restless and angry.
Kill the Jews!

Law-abiding armed American citizens are the least likely of all to be murderers—but we've been cast as "different" by the leftist extremist news media, and the leftist extremist politicians regard us as expendable.
 
I disagree, Standing Wolf. I think they view us as bad examples. People who take some responsibility for their own safety threaten the philosophy that only officially-recognized Authorities may gesture at protecting the flock. Sheepdogs look too much like wolves (no offense, SW) to some folks.
 
I wonder if anyone (in the media) has either calculated or asked Mayor Street (or both) how many of the 77 murders was committed by an LTCF?

:cuss: :banghead: :fire:
 
How do morons like Mayor Street keep getting elected? Oh well I guess I should look no further than the democratic majority in our state legislature. :banghead:
 
Any press on just exactly who is killing who? Are financial analysts and bankers getting honked at clients and offing them? Or maybe Joe and Martha Sixpack has just had enough? Is it possible, just ever so slightly possible, the killing is being done by (brace yourselves) criminals like, oh, say drug dealers or gang members fighting over hand signs or turf?

Irresponsible journalism at its zenith. No word on who is killing who. And yes, I do think it is important to know who is doing the killing. I will not get concerned over bangers and drug cartels shooting it out. Someone get Fast Eddie on the phone to see if he knows who is killing who. I doubt he does or cares. Any excuse for a gun crackdown is his creed.

A large number of killings in a short time leads me to believe there is a criminal war afoot.
 
If there had been a string of public servant homicides (and they were targets), would he be advocating disarming cops?

No, he would still be screaming to disarm Jon & Jan Q. Private-Citizen, while demanding MP-5's & M-16's for the police.
 
Mayor Street...

I saw the news report last night with Mayor Street. He said "there are too many people walking around the city with guns on their hips." He went on to say that in an effort to get guns off of the streets, he is going to stop issuing new CCW permits. He also going to press Gov. Rendell for some new legislation. Here is another situation where a big city mayor can't clean-up his own problems and tries to blame it on the rest of the state. I think that Mayor Street believes the guns that are used in these crimes were purchased legally by CCW permit holders and have been sold off to criminals like drug dealers. There is so much wrong with his two statements. I can understand how the Mayor does not know that you don't need a CCW permit to purchase a gun. I am also suprised how the Mayor can be so misinformed about the difference between the people who have gone through a background check and have been approved to get a carry permit and the drug dealers that are doing the murders. I feel like I am being blamed for the murders in Philadelphia because I carry in the city on a regular basis. I feel bad for you guys in Philadelphia and other similar cities. It is just another example of a failing politician with a knee jerk reaction that is trying to show his constituents that he is doing something about the crime problem.
 
Um.

Gangs are killing each other, and innocents are caught in the crossfire.

Sales of illegal drugs provide a prime motivation to commit violent acts and provide the funds to acquire weapons.

The solution seems clear to me: decriminalize drug sales and tax them like alcohol. Let the people who want to waste their lives do so without the burden the current "War" places on the rest of society.

Gee, I wonder how much money Mr. Shiznit on the corner can make selling his rocks - of unknown quality, I might add - when someone can walk into a state store and buy a superior product legally, cheaply, and quickly.

He might have to go get a job at Sheetz or Wal-Mart instead.

That said, somehow I seriously doubt it's the LTC folks causing the bloodshed. We should file a class-action libel suit against Mr. Street.
 
I don't feel bad for anyone in Philadelphia. Vote with your feet if you can't keep morons like Street and Rendell from positions of power.
 
Some day there will be a food shortage/riot and the politicians' solution will be to order the grocery stores closed.
Or maybe the stock market will crash and the banks will fail, and the politicians will order the banks closed...
uhhh...
:p
 
Street: Too many people get gun-carry permits in city

By MARK McDONALD

[email protected]


IF AND WHEN Mayor Street sits down with the governor and leaders in the General Assembly to discuss the "crisis" of gun violence in the city, Street may ask for a tough new law restricting concealed handguns.

Street said he's "concerned and frustrated" by the number of concealed gun permits that are being issued in the city and that he may decide by Monday to order a moratorium on new permits.

The mayor's flurry of words came on a day when he called in his top police commanders to consider how to cope with an ugly outbreak of bloody killings across the city.

At the same time, Street sent a letter to Gov. Rendell asking for help in dealing with state gun law "that handcuffs our ability to regulate the sale of guns in Philadelphia."

But Street was quick to defend Police Commissioner Sylvester Johnson, saying he "firmly and fully and completely and totally" supports Johnson.

Over the weekend, the city experienced 11 homicides, including a mother who killed two of her children and a 9-year old who was fatally shot in the chest as he sat in a mini-van. Speaking at a City Council budget hearing yesterday, Johnson said there have been 71 homicides in 74 days as of Monday. Asked what's happening, a somber Johnson said, "I don't know what's going on."

Though 80 percent of the murders involved handguns, that's about all that's clear.

Johnson said that 29 were the result of "arguments" generally about money and women, 19 have undetermined causes, seven were drug related, three were domestic, two were residential robberies and one each were sexual related and child abuse. But that left nine cases without a category.

Street said the pattern of killings is so varied that in most instances police would have great difficulty preventing the carnage. But he said he ordered Johnson to make a thorough review of the cases.

"We're never too proud to circle the wagons and go back to determine whether we can do things better," Street said. On Monday, the mayor will review whatever recommendations Johnson offers.

Street wants to put together a Philadelphia delegation including District Attorney Lynne Abraham to go to Harrisburg. And at the heart of Street's plans will be a frontal assault on Harrisburg, the keeper of all gun laws.

In his letter to Rendell, Street noted that Harrisburg has been quick to pass special legislation affecting the city, often against the city's wishes.

Gun regulation is another "special need," Street said. "We need tighter controls not only to protect our children and families but also to protect our law enforcement officers who are at risk every day," Street wrote.

He also told Rendell that the city has 28,000 active carry permits, compared to just 16,000 in New York City.

"We were compelled to issue more gun permits in Philadelphia in one year, 2003, than there are permits in the entire state of New Jersey," Street asserted.

If he had his way, Street said he would deal with handguns roughly the same way he wants to restrict second-hand cigarette smoke - a virtual ban.

Street said he sees few reasons for people to be packing heat in an urban setting. "For what? Why are they carrying? They're not hunters."

Though the list of carry permits is peppered with the names of politicians and judges, Street said it's not for him. "I've always been very reluctant personally about carrying a weapon," Street said. "Part of it is that I'm fortunate to have the common sense to understand that if you have a gun you might use a gun."

The mayor is considering a 90-day moratorium on issuing carry permits or simply reducing the staff of 12 police officers who now handle the work to some smaller number, thereby slowing the process.

In October 1995, the General Assembly eliminated Philadelphia's authority to set its own standards for carry permits, placing the city on the same footing as the rest of the state.

When the police department handled the matter, Johnson said staff conducted a thorough background check on the individual who also was required to justify the carry request. By contrast, Johnson said Pennsylvania now has "the most lenient gun laws in the entire country. You can't do this in New York or the state of New Jersey."

Johnson said current law enables a gun buyer to distribute 10 guns to 10 people.

"If a crime occurs using one of those guns, the person who bought them has no responsibility. That has to change. He should be responsible for that gun at least to the point if its missing or stolen that he has to report it right away," Johnson said.

But is the gun violence washing over this city related in any way to the carry permits held by 28,000 Philadelphians? Street balked at the question, instead arguing that there are just too many handguns in the city.

The issue, he said, is that in other states, "you may have a permit to have a gun in your home but that doesn't mean you are authorized to carry it as you walk all around the streets."

And how does he expect to convince a gun-loving legislature to carve out a special legal zone for the state's largest city?

"When you get enough tragedy, people will soften their position and they will understand the rationale for curbing the availability of these guns," Street said. "We are going to have to keep fighting this fight."

http://www.philly.com/mld/dailynews/news/local/11147978.htm
 
Furious, sorry to say it, but Fox had a particularly anti slant on the story this AM.

Rendell is a former Democrat Philly mayor. You know what to expect.

According to Walt Rauch: Before the days of legal CCW, a lot of people used to keep "Philadelphia deer rifles" - shotguns loaded with double-ought buck. Usually sitting on top of a paid-up hunting license.


- pdmoderator
 
"When you get enough tragedy, people will soften their position and they will understand the rationale for curbing the availability of these guns," Street said. "We are going to have to keep fighting this fight.
"When you get enough tragedy, people will soften their position and they will understand the rationale for curbing freedom in exchange for the hollow promise of security," Street said.
 
He knows damn well that CCW permits have nothing to do with it. It's just yet another case of some jerkoff politician using someone else's blood to further his political agenda and attempt to cover his own worthless butt.

Pebcac, that's the best summary of the situation anyone has posted so far.
 
Johnson said Pennsylvania now has "the most lenient gun laws in the entire country. You can't do this in New York or the state of New Jersey."
The issue, he said, is that in other states, "you may have a permit to have a gun in your home but that doesn't mean you are authorized to carry it as you walk all around the streets."
I guess he's never been to Montana, Arizona, Colorado, Vermont, or Alaska (and other states), or maybe he doesn't consider them to be part of "the entire country" which in his mind apparently only consists of NY, NJ, and PA.

:rolleyes:


Johnson should come out West, and bring lots of clean underwear .... :D
 
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