Plus and/or negative to adding a pistol grip to a home defense shotgun?

[Rockrivr1]

I currently own a Mossberg 500B that I've got set up as my upstairs home defense shotgun. A buddy of mine gave me an aftermarket buttstock that fits that Mossberg with a pistol grip. I'm intrigued by it but before I swap it out and give it a try anyone have any plus or negatives to having a pistol grip on a home defense shotgun?

 

[Legionnaire]

This question comes up periodically. I've never been a fan. I guess if one trained with a dedicated shotgun with a pistol grip that would be one thing, but I mostly hunt and shoot clay birds with my traditionally-stocked Mossbergs. I keep one handy for home defense, but I want it set up the way I typically shoot. I do like a Bantam (youth-length) stock on that one though. YMMV.

I assume you mean a grip something like this:

 

[Old Dog]

The issue with Mossbergs is that the action-bar release tab is behind the trigger guard (as opposed to the Rem. 870's forward of the trigger guard). The great advantage of the Mossberg is that your finger does not go around the trigger guard to acquire the action-bar release.

Unfortunately, all the Mossberg 590A1s that we labored to put pistol grips on resulted in making it substantially more difficult to access the action-bar release tab. It was a big problem. There are aftermarket extended action-bar release levers available though.

Frankly, I have never seen an advantage to a pistol grip on a shotgun and don't even know why that became a thing.

 

[shoobe01]

The issue with Mossbergs is that the action-bar release tab is behind the trigger guard (as opposed to the Rem. 870's forward of the trigger guard). The great advantage of the Mossberg is that your finger does not go around the trigger guard to acquire the action-bar release.

Unfortunately, all the Mossberg 590A1s that we labored to put pistol grips on resulted in making it substantially more difficult to access the action-bar release tab. It was a big problem. There are aftermarket extended action-bar release levers available though.

Frankly, I have never seen an advantage to a pistol grip on a shotgun and don't even know why that became a thing.

This. I have used a 590A1 with pistol grip and collapsing stock in a match no less, after some practice. Terribad. The best of the stocks are pretty clever, but the controls are not useful so it slows you down a lot, and worse it encourages bad behaviors like just leaving the safety off.

My current favorite stock is the short LOP from Hogue.

Mossberg 500 12 and 20 Gauge OverMolded Shotgun Stock - 12" L.O.P. - Stocks - 12 Gauge - Mossberg 500, 590, 835 & Maverick 88 - Rifle & Shotgun Stocks - Hogue Products

www.hogueinc.com

Sadly the rubber is not on the cheekrest, so I also added a neoprene pad myself. Amazon and eBay have adhesive backed foams and suedes that make such stuff easy to make yourself.

If you like pistol grips for angles and stuff, try the MagPul ones:

SGA® Stock – Mossberg® 500/590/590A1

Ambidextrous buttstock for Mossberg 12ga

magpul.com

Quite a bit steeper than stock, but still provides full access to the controls so should be a nice compromise for you (not mine):

(I have used other shotguns, but have had 8 Mossberg/Mavericks, shot them a ton, in classes and all, for some 30 years).

 

[Old Dog]

My current favorite stock is the short LOP from Hogue.

That's funny - I have that SGA stock, it's still sitting in the box in a drawer as I have grown used to the Speedfeed stock on my personal Blackwater edition. I will probably swap it out eventually as I like the capability to attach a sling to the side of the stock.

 

[hso]

I currently own a Mossberg 500B that I've got set up as my upstairs home defense shotgun. A buddy of mine gave me an aftermarket buttstock that fits that Mossberg with a pistol grip. I'm intrigued by it but before I swap it out and give it a try anyone have any plus or negatives to having a pistol grip on a home defense shotgun?

Are you talking about a pistol grip only shotgun like this?



Or this?

 

[Old Dog]

Are you talking about a pistol grip only shotgun like this?

Or this?

I'm thinking he's asking about the latter. It's always referred to as a pistol grip. The former is usually referred to as a "bird's head" grip. A pistol grip on a long gun is normally in addition to a collapsible or full-length stock, be it AR, AK, shotgun...

In any case, did I mention how useless I believe the pistol-gripped shotgun is? Especially on the Mossberg, which screws up access to the action-bar release.

Aside from that, if you're not shooting a defensive (or a LE entry weapon) shotgun with the buttstock on your shoulder or body armor, you're not doing it right, and that negates any possible use for the pistol grip in every case.

Of course, we'll always have those morons who attempt to fire full house 00 buck or slugs one-handed, from the hip. Makes for entertaining YouTube, but not practical in the real world.

 

[hso]

I'm thinking

Best if he clarifies this for everyone himself instead of perpetuating assumptions.

 

[Rockrivr1]

Best if he clarifies this for everyone himself instead of perpetuating assumptions.

I'm definitely talking about the latter. A butt stock with a pistol grip to replace the original butt stock.

 

[Mauser lover]

Where's the safety? Will you need to let go of the gun to disengage the safety? This is the strength of the Mossberg, your trigger finger does one job (the trigger) while you disengage the safety with your thumb. If you need to let go of anything more than previously required, it's probably not a great choice.

 

[Deus Machina]

Yup, depends how the gun's set up.
I like pistol grips. They fit me, when done right. Worked well back when I had a Maverick or an 870--safety on the trigger guard and a release tap I could hit with my finger or a knuckle.
My secondhand 500, I swapped back to a traditional stock. I had to release the grip and move my hand considerably to hit the safety, and the grip isn't the right shape to hit the release tab by just twisting my wrist.

Bonus: it's easy to find good butt pads for the original stocks. I'm not a hefty guy and not getting any younger. I'm fine rolling with it to control the recoil when I'm firing slow at the range, but putting multiple rounds out quick requires a nice squishy pad to tame it.

 

[shafter]

Pistol grips aid in ballistic breaching which is something none of us will ever do in a home defense scenario. I'm not a fan on shotguns.

 

[hso]

I'm definitely talking about the latter. A butt stock with a pistol grip to replace the original butt stock.

Better control of the weapon vs. a theoretical concern about how it may be perceived if you end up in court.

 

[shoobe01]

That's funny - I have that SGA stock, it's still sitting in the box in a drawer as I have grown used to the Speedfeed stock on my personal Blackwater edition. I will probably swap it out eventually as I like the capability to attach a sling to the side of the stock.

I forget why I rejected the Speedfeed (some reason though, I remember considering it also) and instead went maximum nerd and put a footman's loop on the side of the Hogue myself, with reinforcing inside yes. It's solid:
(I modded all my VCAS to have SRs front and back so I don't have to have 20 slings, and it reduces storage and transport mayhem a bit also). Since I did this I've switched all my carbine side slings to right side at back of stock so... may be adding another over there sometime. TBD.

The other method I've used (and these two are right next to each other in the cage) is the sling loop plate that fits between the receiver and stock.

 

[jmr40]

They can be useful in certain situations. They are somewhat popular for turkey hunting and do provide an advantage. I can see them being useful for personal defense. On the right shotgun. The safety on a Mossberg is in the wrong place and they would be pretty useless on a Mossberg. If the safety is somewhere on the trigger guard it would be much better.

If you're carrying the shotgun low like an upland game hunter and are only going to mount the shotgun just prior to firing a shot then a conventional stock is better. But if you want to mount the shotgun to your shoulder and be ready to fire quickly then a pistol grip is much more comfortable to hold in that position.

That is the advantage they have for turkey hunters. They can already have the shotgun mounted to their shoulder while using a mouth call to get the birds to come in that last few yards to get in range. You might have to stay in that position for 10-15 minutes. It's a lot harder to hold a conventional stock in that position for extended time.

That could be an advantage for HD. And if it has a telescoping stock it takes up less space for storage and transportation.

 

[lysanderxiii]

The Army did a study titled "Effects of Rifle Configuration on Quick-Fire Accuracy".

In this test, two weapons of comparable weight and recoil, but differing only in configuration were tested against each other to see which configuration was best for the quick, snap-shot engagement inside 100 meters. The shooting subjects ranged from inexperienced shooters to expert shots. The range had pop-up targets arrayed in a arc of a 30 degrees in front of the shooter and ranging from 20 to 60 meters, the targets were dropped after a set time interval. Instructions were simple, when a target pops up attempt to drop it as fast as possible, and continue to shoot it until in completely disappears from view. The grading criteria were: a) how long did it take to get the first hit on the target (seconds), b) how many total hits were made, and total number of shots fired per engagement.

The weapons were: an M16, an M1 Carbine, and a modified M1 Carbine. The modified carbine had the rear sight removed and a shotgun type rib, with front bead, mounted on the receiver ring and going to where the front sight would be.

Over two weeks of shooting, and all of the subjects got to shoot each configuration several times the results were:

Time to the first shot fired was pretty much the same averaging around 1.1 seconds after target. However, the time to the first hit, and ratio of hits to shots fired where quite different, the modified Carbine had almost twice the hits to fired than the M16 and consistently was faster with the first hit. The regular Carbine was in between the Modified Carbine and the M16.

The conclusion was that a conventional stock, with a simple sighting rib, (a typical shotgun set-up) is the best configuration for rapid engagement of target inside 100 meters.


Range layout:

Modified Carbine

 

[kje54]

I have them with and without pistol grips, I like both but I do prefer the pistol grip more. Pistol grips are more comfortable for me as long as there's also a shoulder stock attached.

 

[Steve in NC]

I vote for a std. stock configuration myself. I simply shoot and manipulate the controls of a HD/SD shotgun just like I'm shooting clays or ducks. It's a keep it simp,e theory for me. Watched to many guys fumble around and have to break a master grip to operate their shotgun with pistol grips because of the tacticool mentality. It sells.
The fastest and most consistent guys in class IMO are std stocked guns.

My opinion and observations only,
Steve

 

[I6turbo]

For me, they make the gun noticeably less maneuverable than with a standard stock, and I don't have as much speed and accuracy with the pistol grip.

 

[Chuck R.]

I've got a pistol grip on my Benelli M1 "Tactical" and it does come in handy for shooting one handed, opening doors etc.

But, other than the box fed AK derivative shotguns, the majority of shotguns I see in 3Gun matches where speed matters, are standard stocked guns.

 

[drobs]

There are 2 problems with adding a pistol grip full stock to a Mossberg 500.
The action release as mentioned and the safety. Both are more difficult to access / use.

Side note:
When braces were still legal, I braced my Mossberg Shockwave - while it looked cool, the recoil was horrendous. It was an altogether bad idea.



I went back to the birdshead grip. However, I might just get a stamp for it and put a regular full size (non-pistol grip) stock on it.

 

[PapaG]

Would probably violate some esoteric variation in the Illinois assault weapon ban.

 

[HKGuns]

Either can work, its just a matter of being adaptable. I prefer neither over the other and own both.

 

[Beck]

The US military did some experiments back in the day that showed a pistol grip rifle or shotgun was easier to twist away by an adversary if it came to a fight over control of the weapon... if the user held on to the pistol grip. (Yeah I know I should put a reference here to that study. I'll find it and add later in an edit)

The traditional shotgun stock proved to be superior in that scenario. With a traditional stock you're also able to more easily use the shotgun butt and receiver as a bludgeoning instrument if you should run out of ammo in a close quarters struggle..

I have an old Remington 870 18-inch barrel with the original traditional wood stock. I'm very confident in my shotgun for SD... that I can shoot well with it, and beat the freakin' bejsesus out of an attacker in the unlikely but possible event he gets too close. So for me a pistol grip is just something that would get in the way. YMMV

 

[cfullgraf]

I have a Remington 870 with a pistol grip stock that has an M4 carbine style adjustable butt stock. I got it for a barn gun so that both my 5’-2” wife and I could use it dispatch un-wanted critters around the barn. Besides raccoons and opossums, we have coyotes around in our area.

It serves our purposes. I would not and have not tried it at clay games