POI change

[Muddydogs]

I have a 308 Enfield that has been sporterized with a Bushnell 3x9 scope. I had problems with the scope mount staying tight which I fixed with a little welding and as far as I can tell its rock solid.

The problem I am having is each time I take it out it shoots high. I sighted it in for 2 inches high at 100 yards. About 2 weeks latter I shot the rifle again and it grouped 3 shots 8 inches high and 2 inches left at 100 yards, I figured ok lets adjust the scope which I did so it shot a 5 shot group 2 inches high. The next weekend I decided I should shoot it again and once again the first 3 shot group was 7 inches high and 1 inch left. I adjusted the scope to get 2 inches high and shot a 5 shot 1.5 inch group. I shot the rifle about 15 more times at steel and paper and all shot landed where they should have. Today I went shooting again and figured I needed to check the zero on the rifle and once again the first 3 shots grouped 1.5 inches but about 7 inches high and 2 inches left.

I'm guessing its the scope but the rifle is grouping well. It continues to group well after the scope is adjusted. Anyone have any ideas on why the POI change.

 

[Hondo 60]

Are you absolutely positive you're holding the rifle EXACTLY the same each time?

I know that's my problem.
Just somethin to think about.

 

[rcmodel]

Like a 1917 Enfield?
Or a Lee-Enfield??

If it's a 1917 I might suspect stock warping / humidity changes causing uneven forearm pressure on the barrel.

And have you checked the guard screws and made sure they are tight?

rc

 

[Muddydogs]

Ya, I can shoot a 1 to 1.5 inch group with the rifle whether its shooting high or I adjusted the scope. When I go to the range I usually have 3 or 4 long guns and don't have a problem shooting them. Today I didn't readjust the scope but help low on the target and was able to group in the bull.

 

[Muddydogs]

Like a 1917 Enfield?
Or a Lee-Enfield??

If it's a 1917 I might suspect stock warping / humidity changes causing uneven forearm pressure on the barrel.

And have you checked the guard screws and made sure they are tight?

rc

Sorry Lee Enfield with compost stock that I floated so 2 dollar bills will slide down between the stock and barrel. Had trouble with the stock touching the barrel and shifting POI up when things warmed up so I had to do some sanding.

 

[Muddydogs]

Pic of rifle.

[/URL][/IMG]

I hate the scope by the way. The cross hairs are fat, and the knob to turn on the illumination sticks up and knocks my hat off when I fire it.

I put the butt stock thing on so I could get a better cheek weld as the scope sets a little high.

 

[loose noose]

I'd try a different scope, and see if it does the same thing again.

 

[gamestalker]

My very first thought would be something is going on with the stock, except that you said your using Bushnell glass, more about that further down. Have you tried shooting the first group, which is going to be high if everything plays out consistent with the history of the first groups, and then printing another group without making any turret adjustments? If the group drops back down to the intended POI then you've likely got a stock problem, which could be resolved by either floating the barrel if it hasn't already been done, or it might need to be bedded. No big deal either way.

But back to the glass. I know Bushnell does make some higher end glass, but my experience with that glass hasn't been very favorable at all. After you've narrowed it down, and if the cause should end up being the glass, I would buy a Vortex for that rifle. I recently got bit by the Vortex bug and I'm a long time Leupold guy. Vortex is producing some really nice glass and at retails that make decent glass affordable for almost anyone's budget too.

You also mentioned something about doing some welding on the scope mounting system? I don't know exactly what that's all about, but I would seriously consider replacing the piece you've welded with a higher quality mounting system.

GS

 

[Centurian22]

I had a similar issue to this with my .308 savage axis only it was left not up. What solved my problem was storing the rifle upright in a rack instead of keeping it in the case. Odd as it may be, I think the foam of the case, when closed, was putting pressure on the stock and or the scope somehow causing the shift. Every time I went to the range the POI was 3-4 inches left, I would re-zero and have the same thing the next range trip a month later. Once it wasn't stored in the case it held zero perfectly. Good luck tracking down your 'mystery problem' it's a frustrating task.

 

[Muddydogs]

My very first thought would be something is going on with the stock, except that you said your using Bushnell glass, more about that further down. Have you tried shooting the first group, which is going to be high if everything plays out consistent with the history of the first groups, and then printing another group without making any turret adjustments? If the group drops back down to the intended POI then you've likely got a stock problem, which could be resolved by either floating the barrel if it hasn't already been done, or it might need to be bedded. No big deal either way.Groups stay high until scope adjustment is made. Stock is free floated.

But back to the glass. I know Bushnell does make some higher end glass, but my experience with that glass hasn't been very favorable at all. After you've narrowed it down, and if the cause should end up being the glass, I would buy a Vortex for that rifle. I recently got bit by the Vortex bug and I'm a long time Leupold guy. Vortex is producing some really nice glass and at retails that make decent glass affordable for almost anyone's budget too. I purchased this scope then replaced a Leupold 4x with a Vortex on my 7mm. Wish I would have purchased the Vortex first because they appear to be very good.

You also mentioned something about doing some welding on the scope mounting system? I don't know exactly what that's all about, but I would seriously consider replacing the piece you've welded with a higher quality mounting system.Its hard to find a mount for this rifle and since the sights were cut off I had to do something. Actually the welding has nothing negative to do with the weapon. What the problem was the rear of the scope mount clamps onto the stripper clip feeder on the rifle but the clamp is only a friction fit and with each shot the rear of the mount would slide up a little. All I did was stick my mig torch inside the mag well and laid a small bead across the mount and stripper clid feed to keep it from working up.

GS

Guess the forum doesn't recognize text inside a quote so this is so the message has enough text to post.

 

[Muddydogs]

I had a similar issue to this with my .308 savage axis only it was left not up. What solved my problem was storing the rifle upright in a rack instead of keeping it in the case. Odd as it may be, I think the foam of the case, when closed, was putting pressure on the stock and or the scope somehow causing the shift. Every time I went to the range the POI was 3-4 inches left, I would re-zero and have the same thing the next range trip a month later. Once it wasn't stored in the case it held zero perfectly. Good luck tracking down your 'mystery problem' it's a frustrating task.

If this is the case I would be afraid that just transporting the rifle would mess it up. My rifles live in a gun safe and get transported in soft cases. This is a truck gun so if it can't take a little beating then I'm in trouble.

I have a 4x Leupold I guess I will have to put on and try out. I already sent enough ammo down range figuring out the scope lifting problem and stock deal. I just want it to be done.