Problem - 1911 compact

[peacenik]

I have the 3.5" RIA compact 45. I obtained it about 3 weeks ago. The first couple of times I shot it, I would get (what I have learned is) a 3-point jam on the last round of the magazine (Novak 6-rd), with the back end of the cartridge pinned down, and the nose up blocking the barrel. I ordered a new Kimber magazine and got the same thing, except occasionally the last round would come almost to battery, but not quite, and the gun wouldn't fire. In this latter case, there was no jam.

Took it to my gunsmith last week, and he polished it well for me - he found some burrs and some sharp points under the extractor claw, which is a known culprit when the 3-point jam occurs. This seemed to clear up problem one - the gun no longer jams on the last round. However, problem 2 keeps reappearing - sometimes in the middle of a magazine, I pull the trigger and nothing. I think the cartridge is only going partially in the barrel. Sometimes, when I remove the magazine, intending to rack the slide to clear the weapon (in these situations), I feel some type of engagement down there, I know the round is fully in, and I can fire it off.

After some experimentation, I figured out the following: I get the failures to fire (or feed fully, really) when I rack the slide to load the first round manually. This does not mean the first round jams - it hasn't yet, in fact.

When I drop the slide (use the slide release) to load the first round, the whole mag has fired every time I've tried it, i.e., the problem hasn't occurred.

I'd really like to use this gun as a CCW, but it's got to go bang. Anybody know what the problem might be here? The ammo was Winchester White box, and some reloads I bought from the range. It loaded some Speer GDHP's fine, too.
I don't think it's the ammo or the mags.

 

[onebigelf]

I think you'll like the gun in the long run. I've rarely seen a new 1911 that didn't need 300-500 rnds of break-in. By the time you've done that it should settle down nicely and you'll be real familiar with it. I think it's because the commercial guns are built to tight tolerances compared to the original military issue.

John

 

[sqlbullet]

Are you by chance riding the slide back into battery when you rack in manually?

Some people make the error of keeping a hand on the slide as it travels forward when charging the weapon. This can affect both the first round chambered, as well as how the rest of the rounds on the mag feed upward the first time. Since you get the failures when charging manually, rather than by slide release, this seems likely.

Best practice for charging a weapon is to rapidly pull the slide completely to the rear and release cleanly, allowing it to fly back into battery. This is true whether the weapon begins with a closed action or with the slide locked back.

Releasing the slide into battery by slide release is not a best practice for two reasons: First, it is a fine motor skill, and will require lots of training to accomplish under stress. Second, if you encounter a different weapon in a defense situation, you may not be familiar with the location of the controls, and even a carefully honed fine motor skill won't work. Pulling and releasing the slide is a gross motor skill, and works on almost any auto-loading handgun.

 

[rcmodel]

1. Riding the slide forward when you load by hand.

2. Lack of proper lubrication on the rails, locking lugs, hammer face, etc. causing more friction to slow things down & suck up slide energy.

3. It's a compact 1911!
If old John had wanted it to work that short, he would have designed a different gun.

rcmodel

 

[Ed4032]

Talk to Ivan at Armsco in NV. He is the company rep. I had some problems with mine and he fixed it up really good. When he sent it back he included three boxed of ammo and four mags. He even called me to make sure everything was good.

He is at this forum http://forum.m1911.org/forumdisplay.php?f=17

 

[Mad Magyar]

I've rarely seen a new 1911 that didn't need 300-500 rnds of break-in.

I respectfully disagree....

 

[CWL]

Do you have any access to other magazines? Perhaps a better-designed follower will help to get that last round into the pipe.

I don't have any experience with Novak but Kimber mags suck.

 

[Walkalong]

I respectfully disagree....

Me too....

The shorter 1911's have a harder time getting rounds to chamber for a couple of purely mechanical reasons. That said, many 3" 1911's run great. I have one myself.

A very respected poster here said something like this about the 3" 1911's.......

When she's good, shes very, very good, but when she's bad, shes very, very bad.

Definitely not an exact quote.....but you get the point.

It sounds like yours can be made dependable. It doesn't sound like a big issue. Post in the Gunsmithing and Repairs section. They can give you some ideas.

 

[peacenik]

Maybe it's my hand....

... I do keep my hand on the slide after the rack - maybe that's what's doing it. I'll try releasing it instead - was just practicing. The same technique has never given me problems with my other guns. This one just might be a little finicky. I'm also going to try replacing the mainspring - I've ordered one and it's on the way.

 

[jim147]

+1 for Ed4032. Ivan will get it taken care of.

 

[loop]

I'll throw in my guesses.

With short-barreled 1911-style guns I replace the mag springs with Wolff +10 percent springs before I ever fire the gun.

Failure to feed the last round in these guns is a known issue. It usually is due to rough finish work in a number of areas or weak mag springs. Replacing the mag springs will usually overcome any roughness in finish and normal use will polish the surfaces enough to make the gun function smoothly.

The 1911 format requires careful timing between the mainspring, the recoil spring and the mag spring. The type of jam you mention is usually caused by the mag spring not pushing the last round up quickly enough for the slide to engage the back of the rim before it returns to battery.

It can also be caused by a number of other things, including a loose ejector, so replacing mag springs or polishing every part of the gun may not cure the issue. But, in general, extra power mag springs do the trick.

In regard to the gun not firing, your trigger is not fully resetting. I suspect that it is roughness on the trigger/disconnector/sear assembly. It could be the sear or disconnector hanging up on a minor burr of some sort or roughness on the trigger where it contacts the frame or the disconnector. This too, will work itself out with either time or it can be polished out.

Personally, I'd send it back and let them work it out. But, it will probably work itself out in 300 to 500 rounds.

There is a reason they have a break-in period. It is that the finish work is not done as finely as on more expensive pistols. The companies have found that certain parts will polish themselves given time and ammo. That is part of how the guns are kept under $500.

The 1911 is not a complicated machine. If you are mechanically inclined you can easily learn to detail strip it and rebuild it yourself. If you are not confident with this I'd just send it back. It makes no sense to me to spend whatever your .45 ammo costs to go through 500 rounds to mechanically do the finish work the factory did not bother to cover.

If you are confident with it 1911.org has all the info you will need to detail strip the gun and take care of your issues.

All you need to strip the gun is a 1/8 brass punch and to fix it some 400 sandpaper.

That is my guess from the info provided.

I will add that the enjoyment of the gun is enhanced when you are the one that took it apart and made it better.

Pay particular attention to how the mag catch works if you decide to do your own work.

All that said, I'd send it back.

Just my two cent's worth.

 

[Storm]

My experience with the RIA compact is that it is magazine sensitive. For example, with a Chip McCormick the slide wouldn't release unless you pulled the mag down a bit. I would try a number of different mags.