Progress report, .22 Hornet Combination Wolf & Small Game.

[Ugly Sauce]

Those the same as the old Beeman Crow Magnum? Those were great lil pellets.

I suggested the old Benjamin pellets a while back because they were a full "soup can" cylinder with a small dome and small hollow base. Full diameter the whole length of the pellet.

Might also try some of those pellets with the plastic ballistic tip. I culled a canada goose with one once.

@Ugly Sauce you should try a magnum primer with just the pellet. Might pick up a bit of that drop in aim back up?

Correct, and correct! Those "super rabbit magnums" (!!!) are a small hollow base bullet. The base is .223", ahead of that it is slightly smaller.

I'm out of small rifle magnum primers at the moment, but I think that is the way to go, if for no other reason just to up velocity a bit. If it raises POI up a bit that would be a plus. I think it has enough oomph right now for grouse, but I'll do some penetration test just to make sure.

Goose with an air rifle? Now that's a good trick. Must have surprised you, unless you were shooting a very powerful one. ? Way back when I worked on an exploratory drilling rig, way up in the mountains, on one of the Indian reservations, the geologists used to come up and pick up the core samples. One of them had just a cheapo air gun and shot grouse with it quite often. I don't think the tribe would have been happy about that, but he would always proudly show us his kills.

 

[Ugly Sauce]

OP;

You are following the same path with the Hornet I trekked back in 1977!
I started with a H&R 158 “Handi-Rifle”. Progressed to a T/C Contender w/7.5”bbl and 3x Lobo scope, then later on to several other Hornets.

I suggest you get the Lee 50gr “Soup Can” mold. Mid South Shooters Supply used to carry it in there special order mold section. It’s almost a wadcutter design.

I abandoned the H&R because as you are finding out, the lock up is inconsistent and the stringing of shots is unavoidable. I’ve actually had several and all but a .22WMR had the stringing issue.

My Ruger M77MkII KBZ will shoot 1- hole groups at 25yds with either the Lee 55gr RFNGC or Lyman 50gr FN Semi Pointed GC over enough of a wide assortment of powders to go from near squibs to over 2100fps.
The .22Hornet will easily take down a wolf! I’ve killed over 100deer with the .22Hornet. It’s no more shot placement sensitive than a .30/30 or .243. I’ve lost more deer to marginal hits with those than the Hornet, likely because I was being more careful.

On a cull hunt, I once dropped 4 does before they figured out what was going on. Only a fifth, a yearling buck got a “pass”...

My favorite.22cal air gun pellet is the H&N “Crow Magnum” as it has a groove for crimping the case.
My cast bullets at .225” are very superior however.
Try 4.2gr of Unique or 5.6gr of #2400. Gets about 1,850fps. with 50gr bullet.

You know, she does seem to vertical string with the full power loads. I was thinking it was just me. I'm not seeing it with the squib-loads, and the 46 grain Speer at 950fps are going into the same hole. That's interesting and I hadn't thought of that.

I do have the mold for the 55g RFNGC, but at squib velocity they are tumbling. I am a bullet caster, but I think I'm not going to cast for this. The 46 grain Speer is accurate at the velocity I want, and the air gun pellets are showing good promise. With the Speer bullet, 1.5 grains is giving me 950fps, which is exactly how a .22LR comes out of my pistol, which kills cleanly. I'd prefer 800fps but I'm not going to mess with the accuracy I'm getting. !!!!!

I'm glad you been-there-done-that. When I was searching and reading everything I could I really didn't find much on .22 Hornet squib/low power loads.

I'm pretty sure also that a full power .22 Hornet load won't have any problem with a light-skinned animal like a wolf. Especially considering I'd not shoot one over 50 yards, and hopefully will never shoot one. And I sure can't imagine one to keep coming after it took a hit. I think it would be quite "discouraged".

Okay thanks, good info!

 

[GooseGestapo]

I’m rather confident that you have a 1/16” twist with your rifle. The one I had definitely was a 1/16” which is the SAAMI standard for the .22Hornet.
My Ruger 77/22Hornet definitely has a 1/14” (per Ruger, and actual measurements).
It’ll handle up to a 55gr bullet provided velocity is over ~2,000fps.

I think Beeman used to import the H&N pellet under their brand. In college I shot a LOT of CCI small rifle magnum primers under an air-rifle primer in my 7.5” T/C Contender. It wasn’t however powerful enough to be practical for anything but target shooting. When approximately 1gr of Bullseye or Unique was added, it worked on pigeons to about 50’ I killed a BUNCH in college off the power line adjacent to my second story apartment.

About 15yrs ago, I ran a ladder test of velocities with Bullseye and the Lyman .225415. Mine throws 49.5gr and stabilize well in a 1/16” twist. I can’t for the life of me find where I put it.
It’ll be easy enough to do it again... IIRC I started at 1.0gr and ran it to maximum of around 3.5gr.
I’ve mostly shot my Marlin M1894CL in .218Bee since acquiring it in 2017. It’s actually much closer to the Hornet than most sources indicate.

A wonderful bullet for either the Bee or Hornet is the Armscor 40gr JHP intended for the .22TCM.
GRAFS sold them for $60/1,000 before last ammogheddon...
I also managed to once snag some bulk blemish Remington 33gr Accutips (Hornady Vmax) for about $4/100. I then bought out the rest MidwayUSA had... still have a “few”!!!

 

[codytrucker]

There is a youtube guy , Matt Dubber , who's channel name is AirArmshuntingSA . He does some pretty impressive stuff with some very expensive air rifles . He uses 22 cal . slugs that might work in your hornet . he shoots out to a couple hundred yards with them at 900 to 1000 fps muzzle velocity's , He's in South Africa so the rules are different for shooting waterfowl there . And some monkeys are considered pest .

 

[Ugly Sauce]

I’m rather confident that you have a 1/16” twist with your rifle. The one I had definitely was a 1/16” which is the SAAMI standard for the .22Hornet.
My Ruger 77/22Hornet definitely has a 1/14” (per Ruger, and actual measurements).
It’ll handle up to a 55gr bullet provided velocity is over ~2,000fps.

I think Beeman used to import the H&N pellet under their brand. In college I shot a LOT of CCI small rifle magnum primers under an air-rifle primer in my 7.5” T/C Contender. It wasn’t however powerful enough to be practical for anything but target shooting. When approximately 1gr of Bullseye or Unique was added, it worked on pigeons to about 50’ I killed a BUNCH in college off the power line adjacent to my second story apartment.

About 15yrs ago, I ran a ladder test of velocities with Bullseye and the Lyman .225415. Mine throws 49.5gr and stabilize well in a 1/16” twist. I can’t for the life of me find where I put it.
It’ll be easy enough to do it again... IIRC I started at 1.0gr and ran it to maximum of around 3.5gr.
I’ve mostly shot my Marlin M1894CL in .218Bee since acquiring it in 2017. It’s actually much closer to the Hornet than most sources indicate.

A wonderful bullet for either the Bee or Hornet is the Armscor 40gr JHP intended for the .22TCM.
GRAFS sold them for $60/1,000 before last ammogheddon...
I also managed to once snag some bulk blemish Remington 33gr Accutips (Hornady Vmax) for about $4/100. I then bought out the rest MidwayUSA had... still have a “few”!!!

From all the research I've done, I think the NEF (maybe not the very early versions) are 1:12 twist. Many sources say 1:16, but I'm pretty sure the 1:12" is correct. But I will always stand corrected.!!

It seems from the few shots I've fired that the Rabbit Magnum (love that label) driven by a standard primer does have enough power for a bird, but probably not for a rabbit. But, I plan to get some magnum primers and I'll do a casual penetration test to make sure.

What I'm going for now is three loads that will work without any significant POI between the. A primer driven load for birds (maybe squirrel) with the lowest possible noise signature. Then the 46 grain Speer over 1.5 grains, at 950fps for all small game up to rabbit. (this of course has been achieved!) And then the 55 grain FMJ at full Hornet power which has also been achieved. That's the plan. I be packing an air rifle, .22LR and .22Hornet all in one gun. It will be beautiful.

I wonder why Ruger didn't tighten up the twist on their rifles?

 

[tark]

I've shot the occasional coyote that wanders onto my property. You can bet your solid waste disposal chute that I will blast any wolf that might come around. P.E.T.A. be damned.

 

[CoalTrain49]

So how many wolves did you kill?

 

[JShirley]

Have you tried the lighter pellets with just a primer?

 

[BigBlue 94]

Goose with an air rifle? Now that's a good trick. Must have surprised you, unless you were shooting a very powerful one

RWS/Diana 34 in 22 cal, slinging them about 850 fps. It was wounded by whatever main gun i was carrying in my yard when the gaggle flew over. I had to get on my little boat and chase the darn thing around our shared 40 acre lake to put it out of its misery. I figured a pellet gun would be least obtrusive to the few other lake dwellers. Made some delicious jerky. This time of year we would have a 1000 head of Canadas or more wintering at the lake. Right about now is when the snows and blues would pass over too, with numbers north of 10,000. It was insane.

 

[Ugly Sauce]

Have you tried the lighter pellets with just a primer?

Not yet, doing one at a time. I have this disorder, where I try three things at once, and lose track of what the heck I'm doing. I'm also great at changing more than one variable at a time. It sucks to be me.

However, at only 14.5 grains I expect the RWS Superpoints to fly fast with just the standard primer. The thin skirt will certainly expand well. The point measures .215", so I'm not sure how that will center in the bore, or if it will matter. The skirt measures .228", which is great, but that will change when I seat it in the case. So I also want to load them in a fired unsized case, which I can't do until I turn down that hand-decapper (from the old Lee Loader Kit)

Anyhow, I decided to start with the "Rabbit Magnums" first, then when I get them shooting good (and they show great promise) I'll shoot some Super Points and see what shoots best or closest to POA.

But today I must make the dog fence higher, as the wife's Yorkshire Terrier has discovered that if it jumps high enough, it can get it's front legs over the top, and then scramble over. When the snow piles up, it takes a running leap and flies over the fence. Them Yorkies are too smart. !! I'm not joking. Not knowing the dangers that little dogs face! Owls, Eagles, Goshawks, coyote, big dogs and cars, Lions and Tigers and Bears to name a few.

 

[Ugly Sauce]

RWS/Diana 34 in 22 cal, slinging them about 850 fps. It was wounded by whatever main gun i was carrying in my yard when the gaggle flew over. I had to get on my little boat and chase the darn thing around our shared 40 acre lake to put it out of its misery. I figured a pellet gun would be least obtrusive to the few other lake dwellers. Made some delicious jerky. This time of year we would have a 1000 head of Canadas or more wintering at the lake. Right about now is when the snows and blues would pass over too, with numbers north of 10,000. It was insane.

I used to live West of Spokane, and it was a major flyway. Not anymore. We still have ducks and geese, etc., but nothing like back in the day. It would sometimes look like clouds of mosquitos swarming around in the sky.

 

[JShirley]

However, at only 14.5 grains I expect the RWS Superpoints to fly fast with just the standard primer...
Anyhow, I decided to start with the "Rabbit Magnums" first, then when I get them shooting good (and they show great promise) I'll shoot some Super Points and see what shoots best or closest to POA.

But today I must make the dog fence higher, as the wife's Yorkshire Terrier has discovered that if it jumps high enough, it can get it's front legs over the top, and then scramble over. When the snow piles up, it takes a running leap and flies over the fence. Them Yorkies are too smart. !! I'm not joking. Not knowing the dangers that little dogs face! Owls, Eagles, Goshawks, coyote, big dogs and cars, Lions and Tigers and Bears to name a few.

Too smart, and not smart enough...

It would be great if you were able to work out similar POA/POI with flea, mouse, rabbit, and woof loads, as it were.

 

[Ugly Sauce]

It would be great if you were able to work out similar POA/POI with flea, mouse, rabbit, and woof loads, as it were.

That's the plan my man! I have the full power load, and the 43 grain Speer/950fps load shooting the same, or same enough considering their purposes. The primer-pellet load looks like I may just have to hold the front sight high in the rear notch. But, as mentioned, some work and shooting to be done before I'm satisfied that the pellets are loaded/loading process goes as well as possible. Yeah, three guns in one, that will be peachy keen for sure.

 

[Ugly Sauce]

The .22Hornet will easily take down a wolf! I’ve killed over 100deer with the .22Hornet.

I'm curious what bullet did you use on deer? I hope to never shoot a deer with the Hornet, (lest I be lost and starving) but I've suspected the bullets made for the faster stepping .22's (.223, .22-250 etc.) would work well in the Hornet. I've been shooting the Hornady 50 grain SX-SP at pests and varmints for years, and it cuts a real nice controlled expansion wound channel in them (skunks/raccoons etc.). ??

I believe, but don't know for sure, but I think the Eskimos always used a FMJ on seals, walrus and stuff like that. Of course they were intimate with the anatomy of those animals. But still....!!!

 

[BigBlue 94]

A flip up adjustable sight like used on grenade launchers could solve the POI situation.

 

[Ugly Sauce]

True, it could come to that. Or, I can get a slightly longer sight base, and cut two dovetails in it and use two flip-up flip-down sights. Don't think it's going to come to that. Trying to avoid too much more work on the rifle. A flip up sight like one on a 1873 Winchester would look pretty cool.

 

[Ugly Sauce]

How does she look? The rifle is done, (unless I flute, chop, or re-contour the barrel, which is way on the back burner) and she has a barrel-band sling swivel, and a new ejector spring and polished internals.

Those are rounds with the Rabbit Magnum pellets loaded. These have one grain of Bullseye in them, will shoot them tomorrow.

I've concluded that a standard primer alone is real border line on power. I did try the lighter pellets today, and they did show some promise. But I could find none of them embedded in the wood behind my cardboard target. The Rabbit magnums bury themselves to where the base is flush with the surface of the wood. I think a tiny bit more penetration would be better. After shooting the RWS pellets, I could find none in the wood, in the cardboard, or the ground, although the ground had an inch of fresh snow on it. So they most likely hit the wood and dropped. Shooting both, it's like: "click....plunk". There's a pretty good pause between the hammer falling and the sound of the pellet hitting the target.

We'll see what happens tomorrow, one grain of Bullseye might be a bigger step up from primer power than I want. I hate to go under one grain, as that would hardly leave a puddle of powder in the case, and probably give erratic velocity.

Thanks for listening!

 

[Larry in wyoming]

Load powder in the case and then add either polyester fill or cream of wheat over it to keep the powder in the bottom of the case over the primer. Trail boss and shotgun powders offer the most bulk. All just food for thought

 

[Ugly Sauce]

I'd love to find some Trail Boss, but nobody got nothing around here. And when they get it, it's sold out in three minutes. !!!

As far as fillers, not gonna go there. Just don't like the idea of it. But thanks, some people like fillers, and perhaps they work well. For other people...!

 

[Larry in wyoming]

Pyrodex?

 

[Ugly Sauce]

No way!!!

 

[Archie]

Right. I guess (I am) what I'm trying to do is turn the NEF into two rifles, a .22LR and a .22Hornet.

Just for information. I have a Ruger M77/22 in .22 Hornet. I have a small supply of lead .22 bullets of around 40 grain weight (I don't remember exactly). The idea was to develop loads in both jacketed and lead. Turns out the lead loads duplicate (more or less) a .22 long rifle; greater velocity makes for severe leading in the bore. The jacket rounds (and I find 45 grain soft points to be the ideal weight) are much faster. So the two loads require a five or six inch vertical hold difference @ fifty yards.
I've got a decent .22 rifle (the Hornet is prior) so the lead bullet load in the Hornet is superfluous.

That is my experience. You may have other considerations. This is offered ONLY in the cause of sharing information.

 

[jschance]

Years ago I machined the base of a .22 Hornet case so I could put a shotgun primer in it, with an airgun pellet in the front.

I can tell you that out of a 10" Contender, it will vaporize an English Sparrow.

 

[Ugly Sauce]

Progress Report: This was the three Rabbit Magnums over one grain of Bullseye. Interesting eh? Just under an inch with a wobbly sitting position/hold. Minute of grouse for sure. I was holding the sights high, so I think holding normally or just a hair high should put this load right in the black.

However, it did have a fairly good pop to it, and again, I'm not going to go under a grain of any type powder. As Unique bulks up a little better than Bullseye, I might try something like .7 or .8 grains of Unique. I'll also try that under the lighter RWS pellets. Wait...I just said...oh never mind!

I may not achieve flea and mouse ballistics with the pellets, but accuracy wise, this looks to be potentially as accurate as the 46 grain Speer bullets, but way cheaper to feed the gun with the the Rabbit Magnums, or the RWS's than the Speers. !!!

 

[Ugly Sauce]

Years ago I machined the base of a .22 Hornet case so I could put a shotgun primer in it, with an airgun pellet in the front.

I can tell you that out of a 10" Contender, it will vaporize an English Sparrow.

I believe it. I wonder, if one could enlarge the primer pocket to take a large rifle or large pistol primer? The perfect balance between vaporizing sparrows and minimal damage on mice and fleas could/might/perhaps/possibly/maybe be found. ?