Prohibited from using or possessing firearms while on probation?

[Howland937]

If this is inappropriate, please lock and delete.
An immediate relative had been charged with OVI a couple of months ago. He had no firearms with him and doesn't have a CHL. The charge stems from a traffic infraction and the individual has had struggles with substance abuse. No prior OVI, possession, or firearm related charges.

Per his probation, he must abstain from alcohol and drugs and cannot use or be in possession of any firearms or ammunition for the entirety of the 2 years. He's also got to attend a 3 day class. This is a done deal, so I'm not looking for advice. I'm just curious as to whether this is typical for an OVI conviction, or if the fact that it wasn't a drunk driving charge has any bearing. Is it possible that he's considered a "user of illegal drugs" until his probation ends based on federal restriction?

Just curious how the court could/would arrive at the point of restricting his ability to possess a firearm on a non-violent, misdemeanor OVI charge when there were no firearms present.

 

[onibaba]

Please define OVI... thats not a term used in my state...

 

[unclenunzie]

Apparently OVI in Ohio means Operating Vehicle Impaired. https://codes.ohio.gov/ohio-revised-code/section-4511.19

 

[Howland937]

Please define OVI... thats not a term used in my state...

Apparently OVI in Ohio means Operating Vehicle Impaired. https://codes.ohio.gov/ohio-revised-code/section-4511.19

Yes. Used to be DUI, but they've since determined that impaired has a different threshold than intoxicated.

 

[earlthegoat2]

Many years ago, I was once on probation. This was also for a reduced DWI type charge. I remember reading my probation restrictions and them mentioning firearms.

I could not carry a firearm whether I had a license to carry or not unless I was hunting (legally of course)

I could transport firearms in a vehicle In a case.

That’s all I can remember. I remember being relieved I could still go hunting.

 

[Hillbilly Hydrographics]

Its just how they do its not necessarily because of the ovi/dui but the probation requires no firearms as part of the terms. I had some probation for a dui many moons ago and they expected me to give up my guns. Or move them to someone else's house for the year of my probation. Alot of my collection are hand me downs from my great grandpa and I wasn't goin to move them anywhere. What I had to do was lock them all up in the safe and give a family member the keys so I did not have access to any firearms. Problem was solved.

 

[jmorris]

”It“ is whatever they wrote down and he signed. We all know that is dependent on what someone did, who they are and who charges/represents them.

Edit: and now what party the Judge sides with…

 

[lemaymiami]

"the terms of your probation" are whatever they are.. The alternative is jail time (and if violated and found out - serious jail time...). This is not something that any convicted person can change if in fact they'd prefer probation to incarceration...

I'm many years out of law enforcement but I can remember on more than one occasion when we found someone in violation of the terms of their probation - then noted the justice system's response - which was actually more harsh than a conviction for a new violation... Yes, there are places where the laws have been seriously weakened (or just not enforced at all...) but in most places I'm aware of nothing in that regard has changed much at all...

 

[Howland937]

but the probation requires no firearms as part of the terms.

Thanks. That's what I was wondering...if it a probation thing, somehow related to the charge, or something they threw in knowing most people will sign off on about anything to avoid jail.

I fully understand that the terms are what was agreed to and are legally binding. Just trying to understand how firearm possession became relevant to this situation.

 

[Spats McGee]

Thanks. That's what I was wondering...if it a probation thing, somehow related to the charge, or something they threw in knowing most people will sign off on about anything to avoid jail.

I fully understand that the terms are what was agreed to and are legally binding. Just trying to understand how firearm possession became relevant to this situation.

The terms and conditions of probation are likely a cut-&-paste job from felony probation. Probation officers do a lot of home visits & they don’t enjoy the thought that their probationers might have guns in the home.

 

[RetiredUSNChief]

The terms and conditions of probation are likely a cut-&-paste job from felony probation. Probation officers do a lot of home visits & they don’t enjoy the thought that their probationers might have guns in the home.

As a resident non-attorney here, it seems to me that regardless of what the probation terms are, an OVI (or any similar conviction) is not necessarily a felony conviction that would have anything to do with a person's gun rights. It's simply part of the probation terms. Having a prohibition listed on a probation does not necessarily mean the person has committed or been convicted of any kind of criminal act(s) related to the prohibition.

Which would mean the probation terms would not necessarily have anything to do with a person's future RKBA.

Now, if this were the result of a felony OVI conviction, the felony conviction itself would affect a person's RKBA beyond the probationary period.


Would this be an accurate assumption?

 

[Spats McGee]

As a resident non-attorney here, it seems to me that regardless of what the probation terms are, an OVI (or any similar conviction) is not necessarily a felony conviction that would have anything to do with a person's gun rights. It's simply part of the probation terms. Having a prohibition listed on a probation does not necessarily mean the person has committed or been convicted of any kind of criminal act(s) related to the prohibition.

Which would mean the probation terms would not necessarily have anything to do with a person's future RKBA.

Now, if this were the result of a felony OVI conviction, the felony conviction itself would affect a person's RKBA beyond the probationary period.


Would this be an accurate assumption?

I would agree with that. Once probation is over, the terms and conditions go away. As you noted, if it were a felony, that'd be a different kettle of fish.

 

[Arkansas Paul]

As a resident non-attorney here, it seems to me that regardless of what the probation terms are, an OVI (or any similar conviction) is not necessarily a felony conviction that would have anything to do with a person's gun rights. It's simply part of the probation terms. Having a prohibition listed on a probation does not necessarily mean the person has committed or been convicted of any kind of criminal act(s) related to the prohibition.

Which would mean the probation terms would not necessarily have anything to do with a person's future RKBA.

Now, if this were the result of a felony OVI conviction, the felony conviction itself would affect a person's RKBA beyond the probationary period.


Would this be an accurate assumption?

I would say yes that's a likely accurate assumption.
They are not legally a prohibited person (at least for the purpose of charging a new crime), so possessing a firearm likely wouldn't be a new criminal charge.
It is simply a condition of their probation (at least here in Arkansas). They do that with several things such as not partaking in alcohol or being in an establishment where the primary source of revenue is the sale of alcohol. Also, keeping the company of convicted felons is often prohibited while on probation. Things that are otherwise legal can be imposed as a condition of probation.

Here what I have seen is misdemeanor courts give suspended jail time on the condition that certain conditions are met, such as no new similar charges for the next year, and adherence to the terms of probation.
For example a DWI in the county I work in often results in 1 or 2 days in jail, then 30-90 days in jail, suspended on the condition that they follow the court orders regarding payment of fines and not having a similar arrest for a year.
I've actually never seen a probation sentence for DWI here, though I know it is a thing in other places.

In Arkansas if you get your 4th DWI within a 10 year period, or your 6th or more within a 20 year period, it's a felony.
Once you get convicted of the felony version, then it becomes a separate criminal offense to possess a firearm.
For misdemeanors, it would just be violation of probation, which could result in jail sanctions or revocation of probation.

 

[CapnMac]

I have this memory, which may be faulty, that courts may, as a punitive measure of a crime, impose loss of rights due to the temporary nature of the imposition.
That there is a corollary in those crimes that, by legislation, cause a Permanent loss of rights.
Perhaps our resident attorneys can better speak to this.

 

[hdwhit]

Its just how they do its not necessarily because of the ovi/dui but the probation requires no firearms as part of the terms. I had some probation for a dui many moons ago and they expected me to give up my guns. Or move them to someone else's house for the year of my probation. Alot of my collection are hand me downs from my great grandpa and I wasn't goin to move them anywhere. What I had to do was lock them all up in the safe and give a family member the keys so I did not have access to any firearms. Problem was solved.

Provided the authorities accepted that that particular family member wasn't going to simply pass the keys back to you as soon as they were out of sight.

Fifty years ago, that would have worked where I am now. Not anymore.

 

[Hillbilly Hydrographics]

Provided the authorities accepted that that particular family member wasn't going to simply pass the keys back to you as soon as they were out of sight.

Fifty years ago, that would have worked where I am now. Not anymore.

Even a felon can live in a house with guns as long as said felon doesn't have "access" to said guns. By means of them being in a part of the house that person isn't allowed in or locked up in a safe that they can't access. Like if I was to rent a room in my house to a felon I could keep my guns in my room locked up and everything is ok and legal.