peacebutready
Member
Is Armor All, the car product or something like it good for protecting AR magazines from the sun and even when stored.
Protecting polymer AR magazines from sun?
- Thread starter peacebutready
- Start date
- Status
rcmodel
Member in memoriam
I'm thinking fair wear & tear from using them will take it's toll way before the sun will.
rc
rc
peacebutready
Member
Not planning to leave them in the sun purposely. They could be exposed to the sun from being in the house, in a vehicle, etc. Also, IIRC, it isn't known how the polymer mags hold up for 20 or 30 years without being worn out from use. This issue is for people who want to stock up on mags for many years into the future.
With Armor All or other versions of the same thing, it prevents things like auto dashboards and other interior stuff from cracking due to the sun. I think silicon spray is recommended for weather stripping on cars.
With metal AR mags, rust is the culprit, and we all know the prevention is your choice of lubricant/protectant.
With Armor All or other versions of the same thing, it prevents things like auto dashboards and other interior stuff from cracking due to the sun. I think silicon spray is recommended for weather stripping on cars.
With metal AR mags, rust is the culprit, and we all know the prevention is your choice of lubricant/protectant.
rcmodel
Member in memoriam
Well, I have a GI .50 cal ammo can full of new 30 round M16 mags I brought home from the army in 1970.
I just checked them last winter for the first time in years.
Guess what?
They are still new M16 magazines from 1970, just like they were in 1970.
For long term storage, dark, mosture proof storage is all that is necessary.
And a GI ammo can provides exactly that.
BTW: The only part of a GI mag that could possibly rust is the spring and the base plate.
And I have never ever had a problem with that in 50+ years.
rc
I just checked them last winter for the first time in years.
Guess what?
They are still new M16 magazines from 1970, just like they were in 1970.
For long term storage, dark, mosture proof storage is all that is necessary.
And a GI ammo can provides exactly that.
BTW: The only part of a GI mag that could possibly rust is the spring and the base plate.
And I have never ever had a problem with that in 50+ years.
rc
If left in a hot vehicle or other situation where exposed to bright light for long periods of time I wouldn't be surprised if you don't eventually see some deterioration of the plastics. I also think it would take a VERY long time for any problems to come up. Glock has been making plastic pistol frames for a very long time. And at least to a point any detachable magazine is a disposable part of the weapon if it does have a problem..
Jackal
Member
I'm thinking that if they somehow degrade over the years from long term sun exposure, throw them away and spend $10 on a new one.... 
hemiram
Member
i wouldn't put Armor All or anything similar on anything I cared about. Putting it on your car's dash is asking for trouble, as it will soon crack. Best thing is a damp rag for both your dash and your mags.
Could be worth an email to Magpul.
If you are trying to stock up for decades to come, I'd just leave a bunch of them in the wrapper and in a dark closet or maybe ammo cans or something similar like RC said. Also the standard metal mags are aluminum, so they should not rust much except for spring and floor plate. You could stock up on spares of those too if that is something you are worried about. And I still think spray paint could help. We often thing of painting things for cosmetic purposes but in heavy industry, it is all about protection from the elements.
If you are trying to stock up for decades to come, I'd just leave a bunch of them in the wrapper and in a dark closet or maybe ammo cans or something similar like RC said. Also the standard metal mags are aluminum, so they should not rust much except for spring and floor plate. You could stock up on spares of those too if that is something you are worried about. And I still think spray paint could help. We often thing of painting things for cosmetic purposes but in heavy industry, it is all about protection from the elements.
JohnBT
Member
Don't use it on your mags or guns.
"Can I use Armor All® Protectants on leather; including car seats, furniture and shoes?
Armor All® Leather Care Protectant products are perfect for use on your treated leather home furnishings. Our specially formulated leather products condition your leather, whether in your car or house, helping to keep your leather looking like new. These products, however, are not designed for use on suede, buckskin or fabric. They are also not designed for use on bench or cycle seats due to slipperiness."
It's some slick stuff. Once upon a time, my now ex-wife Armor All'd my car's steering wheel and shift knob. And the rubber pedals. Holy...thought I'd never get it off.
"Can I use Armor All® Protectants on leather; including car seats, furniture and shoes?
Armor All® Leather Care Protectant products are perfect for use on your treated leather home furnishings. Our specially formulated leather products condition your leather, whether in your car or house, helping to keep your leather looking like new. These products, however, are not designed for use on suede, buckskin or fabric. They are also not designed for use on bench or cycle seats due to slipperiness."
It's some slick stuff. Once upon a time, my now ex-wife Armor All'd my car's steering wheel and shift knob. And the rubber pedals. Holy...thought I'd never get it off.
Lord Teapot
Member
i think if you put a polymer magpul and any steel magazine side by side in the elements; sun, rain, whatever, any element, any condition, the polymer would still be sitting there when the steel was dust. the spring and buttplate would probably be dust, but the polymer body would remain.
Polymers need UV protection to prevent chemical breakdown. Check Little Tykes yard toys for that - they are decent quality but will fade. Cheaper variants will break down as the long chain molecules start unraveling.
Magpul kept that in mind and it's not be a problem - military grade polymers don't break down from UV exposure.
The real issue is something different. One full auto range operator no longer uses Pmags - his range fires up to 400,000 rounds a year and Pmags demonstrated too many failures by cracking around the feed lips. He now only uses Brownell's metal mags with tan followers.
Worrying about environmental degradation of Pmags is less a worry than them being up to harsh use and impact. While there are some who would stand by theirs, others have found out differently and won't. Whether they sun fade or not is the least of the issues.
Magpul kept that in mind and it's not be a problem - military grade polymers don't break down from UV exposure.
The real issue is something different. One full auto range operator no longer uses Pmags - his range fires up to 400,000 rounds a year and Pmags demonstrated too many failures by cracking around the feed lips. He now only uses Brownell's metal mags with tan followers.
Worrying about environmental degradation of Pmags is less a worry than them being up to harsh use and impact. While there are some who would stand by theirs, others have found out differently and won't. Whether they sun fade or not is the least of the issues.
chicharrones
needs more ammo
Fully agree. Armor All or Silicon spray is super slick. I wouldn't put it on anything I had to grab and need control of.
Speaking of use on cars, back before seat belt laws were in effect here, I Armor Alled the vinyl bench seats in my car. I had to hang on to the steering wheel to keep from sliding all the way to the passenger door in turns to the left. Never again.
benEzra
Moderator Emeritus
Your car dash cracks after years of sun exposure because it is probably made of polyvinyl chloride (PVC, aka "vinyl") treated with chemical softeners (plasticizers) to make it flexible, and over time the heat drives out the plasticizers causing the vinyl to become brittle and crack under stress. Keeping your dash cool and protected from direct sunlight will reduce the rate of outgassing and make your dash last much longer. FWIW, plasticizer outgassing is a big component of what makes a new car smell new. Leather dashes can also crack after years of heat exposure, and for basically the same reasons.
http://pslc.ws/macrog/work/dash.htm
Car weatherstripping is made of rubber and degrades when exposed to UV, oxygen, and especially ozone. Treating it with silicone protects it from all of the above. (I personally prefer tubes of silicone grease as opposed to silicone sprays, due to the difficulty in keeping overspray off your glass.)
Unless your AR magazines are made of vinyl, leather, or rubber, those processes really don't apply.
As far as I know, PMAGs and Glock frames are both made from glass-fiber-reinforced nylon 66 with UV stabilizers already incorporated. Putting Armor-All or silicone grease on them is only going to make them slippery.
I'm going to test this.
I have a broken polymer mag from my Saiga 12. I'll put it outside and see how long it lasts. Now, this will only show how long this particular manufacturer's poly mag lasts, but some data is better than none. Maybe it will help determine whether any extra UV protection is even necessary.
EDITED TO ADD:
I couldn't find the broken mag (I must have wised-up and thrown it away). But I did find something better; this fiberglass reinforced polymer hand guard. I'll put this outside and check it periodically for deterioration.
I have a broken polymer mag from my Saiga 12. I'll put it outside and see how long it lasts. Now, this will only show how long this particular manufacturer's poly mag lasts, but some data is better than none. Maybe it will help determine whether any extra UV protection is even necessary.
EDITED TO ADD:
I couldn't find the broken mag (I must have wised-up and thrown it away). But I did find something better; this fiberglass reinforced polymer hand guard. I'll put this outside and check it periodically for deterioration.
Last edited:
peacebutready
Member
chicharrones
needs more ammo
I'm going to test this.
I couldn't find the broken mag (I must have wised-up and thrown it away). But I did find something better; this fiberglass reinforced polymer hand guard. I'll put this outside and check it periodically for deterioration.
I bet the sun side of it gets somewhat bleached in a year. 5 years later it gets bleached more and maybe some surface cracking. I think some patience will be required to see what happens after that.
In a previous life I was a design engineer responsible for power tools. One of the other groups in the same company was going through an exercise to change the colorant in their polymer parts to comply with new European rules on metallic compounds in colorants. Some of the "green" colorants ("green" as in environmentally friendly, not as in the color green) would fade badly after 6 months in direct sunlight but the polymer was still perfectly good so you can't always tell by looking at something.
I concur that Armor All is great for vinyls, less so for true leather (there are products specifically designed for leathers) and basically worthless on rigid plastics. Just as a side note, one of my hobbies is building scale models. The plasticizer in soft vinyls will actually leach out and melt rigid styrene that the vinyl parts are in contact with over time. Now styrene is not particularly chemical-resistant in the first place but I would still give very careful consideration before flooding anything other than plasticized vinyl with additional plasticizer then letting it sit for a long time.
I concur that Armor All is great for vinyls, less so for true leather (there are products specifically designed for leathers) and basically worthless on rigid plastics. Just as a side note, one of my hobbies is building scale models. The plasticizer in soft vinyls will actually leach out and melt rigid styrene that the vinyl parts are in contact with over time. Now styrene is not particularly chemical-resistant in the first place but I would still give very careful consideration before flooding anything other than plasticized vinyl with additional plasticizer then letting it sit for a long time.
They're too cheap to worry about. I'd guess there being no plethora of complaints about sun damaged polymer magazines, we all know how gun owners are, sun damage is a non problem.
But since it's been mentioned on an international forum, I bet we'll soon see products to stop it.
But since it's been mentioned on an international forum, I bet we'll soon see products to stop it.
Jackal
Member
Thats my thinking as well. $10 magazines are a consumable. A Pmag costs about the same as 30rds of ammo. If one breaks, toss it.
cslinger
Member
The mag is a consumable assuming it can be replaced. With bans and state laws and other natural predators of firearms such as politicians I can totally see taking precautions and care to make your gear last as long as possible.
In a perfect world I could give a crap about the longevity of a 20 dollar part. In the real world I want to know if I stash some parts simple age will not destroy them.
That being said unless you are storing your mags in direct sunlight 24 /7 and running them hard all day every day I cannot imagine any major problems. Easiest way to put your mind at ease is buy some aluminum mags as well.
Glocks are 30 years old and seem to be generally doing fine not to mention vp70s and nylon 66s. I am sure there are exceptions but on the whole it doesn't seem to be a major issue.
In a perfect world I could give a crap about the longevity of a 20 dollar part. In the real world I want to know if I stash some parts simple age will not destroy them.
That being said unless you are storing your mags in direct sunlight 24 /7 and running them hard all day every day I cannot imagine any major problems. Easiest way to put your mind at ease is buy some aluminum mags as well.
Glocks are 30 years old and seem to be generally doing fine not to mention vp70s and nylon 66s. I am sure there are exceptions but on the whole it doesn't seem to be a major issue.
RetiredUSNChief
Member
What he said.
Ever notice how your windshield always seems to get that light foggy coating on it, no matter how well you keep your car clean? This is exactly why...the plastics in your car are doing this.
The polymers used in magazine manufacturing aren't the same as the ones used in vehicles, for a variety of reasons.
Still, if someone wants to conduct an accelerated test of polymer magazines, it would be easy enough to toss one or two under the backglass of a car and keep them there for a summer or three and see what happens.
- Status
