PSL vs. Saiga

[Nightcrawler]

Okay, with the Vepr no longer being imported, there are two long-action Kalashnikovs on the market right now. One is the Romanian PSL, marketed in the US as the "FPK" or "Romak-3", and the other is the Saiga .308.

Both can be hand in long barreled and carbine format. The PSL is chambered in the 7.62x54R cartridge, whereas the Saiga is in .308.

Romanian PSL from Tennessee Guns

Saiga .308 from Russian American Armory

The PSL has 10-round magazines, whereas the Saiga comes with 8-round magazines that can be converted to hold 10 rounds.

Both have pretty thin barrels. I'm wondering if there'd be any appreciably accuracy difference between the two? Anybody know? Anybody guess? The Saiga has a much more lefty-friendly stock, which is important to me.

 

[EricTheBarbarian]

well the ammo for the romak is really cheap right now. mags are really expensive at about 30 dollars each or more. Ive been doing some research on them but dont have the cash for one at the moment. itd be nice to have a semi auto that shoots the same rounds as my mosin. .308 surplus is really hard to find and definetly not cheap for commercial ammo. 762x54r you can find for about 10 cents a round. supposedly the light ball 147 grn rounds shoot better than the heavy ball in the romak and the light ball is easier on the gun. my mosin doesnt seem to care too much heavy or light ball. ive never heard anyone say anything bad about saiga and alot of people think their guns have excellent value. I do not own either but this info is what I have found from doing research on the net. you have to admit the romak looks alot cooler though.

 

[jagdpanzer347]

To me, the PSL just oozes "coolness". A poor man's Dragunov, I suppose. I've come close to buying a .308 Saiga twice at local shows. But, with a STG58C and a Galil on order, economic reality set in. What we NEED is a 54r Saiga, with some FBMG produced twenty-rounders!

-jagd

 

[Nightcrawler]

I'd actually want the Saiga converted to pseudo-dragunov appearance, with one of those ATI stocks and with a scope. Always wanted an eastern block sharpshooting rifle.

The AK I really want is a VEPR II in 7.92mm Mauser, with an 18" barrel, Ultimak mount with an Aimpoint, and 20-round steel magazines. Oh, to dream...

 

[jagdpanzer347]

That sounds cool, but 8mm seems to be drying up. Why oh why didn't I buy about five more cases of '70s Yugo when it was readily available? I guess it was because of all the SA 7.62 I was buying at the time. That stuff is like freaking gold now. People are paying sixty bucks plus for a battle pack. Insane.

-jagd

 

[Logan5]

I know somebody on the board has the "para" PSL, but don't recall who. I vaguely recall reading about it turning out to be kind of a hacksaw + PSL = carbine situation at the importer's. The PSL only comes out of the factory full length. I'm happy with mine, but if you want carbine length the Siaga might be the better option.

 

[chrisslamar]

A thing to remember is that just about all of the 7.62x54r ammo out there is corosive ammo. So you'll have to strip it down and make it squeeky clean to prevent it from crapping up on ya. I had a friend who had an SVT-40 and complained about having to clean the gas tube, piston, etc... Just something to keep in mind.

--Chris

 

[MatthewVanitas]

@ Nightcrawler: how about you save even more money on ammo, get the .223 Saiga, and then convert that to a Drag lookalike?

I'm assuming you saw the recent posts of some really neat look-alike Saiga mods.

Or is the .223 insufficiently macho for a FALmeister?

-MV

 

[grimjaw]

I haven't heard glowing reports of the pinpoint and consistent accuracy of either of them. One thing I'd consider is this. Yeah ammo for the PSL is can be cheap, but you're going to have to clean up diligently and thorougly every time you're out. Shooting .308 from the Saiga is more expensive, but you don't have to worry about becoming a rusted heap if you don't clean it every trip to the range. Honestly since I'm terrible at maintenance, I love AKs just for that reason.

I like shooting 7.62x54R out of a Mosin because it's very simple to maintain. It might take me fifteen minutes to clean three Mosins at the range and feel confident that I didn't miss the piston, or spring, or gas tube, etc.

As much as I like the looks of the PSL, I voted Saiga on the condition that it's converted.

jm

 

[TheDisturbed1]

I enjoy cleaning guns anyway, so my choice would have been PSL anyway... they do make .308 Dragunovs in china and I would pawn all my computer stuff and then some to afford a TIGR or a C&R SVD

If i had to choose saiga for something, it would either be a converted AK (7.62x39) or the SAIGA 12k... I love that concept

 

[mrcpu]

That PSL just looks cool, no matter what you like or dislike about 'em...

 

[busy_squirrel]

I will have BOTH before the summer, though I'll prob. shoot the Saiga more...

 

[michiganfan]

the saiga has 20 rounder available now

 

[Nightcrawler]

I have no use whatsoever for anything in .223, save as a plinking gun for teaching new shooters.

I know the Saiga has 20 round magazines. So does my FAL, so that's not the point. I'm not looking for another battle rifle. I'm looking for something I can scope and gussy-up into a not-Dragunov Commie-style pseudo sharpshooter's rifle, that's all. I'm mainly wondering if either of these rifles is more accurate than the other by any appreciable measure.

 

[texlurch]

Reports on the PSL don't give it super great accuracy. Plus, what is out there for accurate, non-corrosive ammo?

You can shoot commercial or surplus out of the Saiga

My 21" Saiga does one hole groups at 100 yds, with SA surplus.. and looks ok also..

 

[PercyShelley]

Is there any reasonably inexpensive way to re-barrel either rifle? I dislike thin barrels, even if replacing them means more weight.

As far as reloading goes, is 8mm mauser the same diameter as .338 Lapua? I've seen some rather nice looking bullets I'd love to try, and I like autoloaders, and I don't know of any .338 Lapua autoloaders!


Edit: Nevermind. Sometimes before I have coffee, I say really, really dumb things.

 

[JWarren]

I haven't heard glowing reports of the pinpoint and consistent accuracy of either of them.

That kinda surprises me. I've read numerous accounts on THR of Saigas doing 1 MOA groups consistently. Mine does 1.0-1.5 MOA depending on shooting conditions (1.5 is more likely off the hood of a Jeep). It surprised me so much it's forced me to table my purchase of another Remington 700 for a while.


While I like the PSL's looks, I'd take my Saiga over it any day-- and many other comparable rifles.

John

 

[texlurch]

Mine does 1-1.5 MOA, until you start rapid firing. Then it will start stringing in a perfect vertical line. I should have kept that last target. 5 slow fire (5-10 sec) went in one ragged hole, probably cover with a quarter.

5 rapid (2-3 sec) went in a perfect vertical string, 1st one in the bull, then about 1/8 -1/4 between the holes.....

 

[JWarren]

texlurch,

I haven't tried rapidfire with mine yet. I've got about 1K rounds of SA surplus and it breaks my heart to fire any of it as I see the gaping void of 7.62 NATO surplus out there.

That's going to change when I get set up for reloading and can get my hands on some "somewhat" affordable reloading components.

I am such a hoarder...


John

 

[EricTheBarbarian]

Plus, what is out there for accurate, non-corrosive ammo?

Midway sells Winchester and Wolf Ammunition in boxer primed cases. havent shot any of it yet to know for accuracy myself, but it gets good reviews.

 

[MD_Willington]

VEPR no longer imported?

Check Gilberts guns, they have the newer sporter version of the VEPR, waste of a good VEPR however...

MD Willington to contact
show details Mar 12 (1 day ago)

Had some questions regarding the new VEPR, will they accept full capacity magazine or are they built like the SAIGA rifle for low cap.

Also will the older VEPR furniture fit the new VEPR receivers?

Thanks


"GilbertsGuns.com" to me
show details 7:56 am (6 hours ago)

These will not accept the older mags.I don't think the other stocks will interchange

New imported VEPR are just like the SAIGA... why waste money on a newly imported VEPR

 

[jagdpanzer347]

TEXLURCH

How about some details on that Saiga? Looks pretty sweet.

-jagd

 

[Gene_WI]

I have a PSL in 7.62x54R, a fantastic gun for the money. I get about 2MOA form mine with surplus (and I am not a great shot). Cleaning is very easy, it is after all an AK. Mags are "cheaper", i bought 4 mags with a pouch for $99 form copes distributing.

My only complaint is that the PSL tends to be ammo sensitive. Mine does not function well with some surplus ammo. Polish and Albanian (Chinese) ammo tend to stove pipe in the gun. However the ever abundant Czech silver tip functions flawlessly and is very accurate.

I recommend PSL.

 

[Shane333]

If I could I would buy a Saiga and do a conversion like JWarren has.

 

[Evil Monkey]

I vote for the PSL.

Mags are $30 each. Cheaper than saiga 8rd for $35+ and FBMG 20rd for $45 each.