Quality Reblueing - How do gunsmiths do it?

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John Galt

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I'd like to re-blue the barrel on a hunting rifle I have. I fell quite a few times a few years ago and banged it on rocks and such.

I mainly want to do it just for the experience. I like to learn new stuff.

What is the very best process & chemicals to use to do this?
I'm leary that many of the products "for home use" are for touch up and for doing a lame job. How do the real pro's do it?


I know I have to degrease, sand out blems, polish to a certain grit (how shiney is best?), then clean and do the blueing.
 
Thanks.

I guess that I'll skip that education!

I'll just do all the prep and either send it to someone or do a cold blue just to preserve it until I bang it up some more.
 
You're better off allowing a professional re-finisher do the polishing.
The difference between a good blue job and a crappy blue is about 99% in the polishing.

It takes a pro who's done enough polishing to develop the skill and "feel" to do a good polish job.
Even most local gunsmiths don't do enough to get good at it, which is why most local shops send the work out to a pro refinishing service who can do it right.

Until then, look into the Brownell's "Spray and bake" gun finishes.
These are spray-on finishes you apply to a thoroughly degreased gun, then bake in your oven to harden the coating.

These come in several different types, in a number of colors, and are surprisingly tough, durable, and good looking.
 
Personally I just can't abide spray paint on a firearm.

If you want a decent finish with a cold blue product try Brownells again for a product they sell called OXPHO-BLUE.

Polish the metal as best as you can.

I like denatured alcohol as a degreaser with cold blue products.
Wear clean cotton gloves when handling the metal at all times.

The OXPHO-BLUE will produce the best cold blue whole gun finish, better than anything else on the market and the stuff is just as durable as a hot blue if it is applied correctly.

The only real drawback is OXPHO-BLUE takes many, many coats.
As each coat is applied you must use slightly less blueing solution than the previous coat and continue to polish and degrease the metal with each coat.

Once you get the finish you want you must allow the finish to set and cure in oil for at least 48 hours.

Soak a strip of flannel in good gun oil and wrap the gun up with it.
Do remove the wood before you do this,,,,,
 
If you have a long enough or deep enough vessell that would allow your barrel to be totally submerged, I'd go with a hot-water blue like Herter's Belgian Blue. I understand that Brownell's Dicropan is similar, but I've never used it. The Herter's is superlative stuff.
 
That was a terrible suggestion. That would likely compromise the heat-treatment of the barrel or any other heat-treated part being blued with the above caveman method.
 
Ah, it was meant in jest.

Let's just hope that John Galt has a sense of humor, otherwise he might have ruined his barrel by now if he's as humorless as we are.
 
I have learned the hard way to be careful with the humor on these sites. There are just too many newbies who might believe what I say and really get in trouble.

Professional bluing involves highly caustic and very dangerous chemicals. Recently, some folks have posted a "simple, home style, DIY" bluing but the formula is still those same chemicals and is still extremely hazardous unless you know exactly what you are doing.

A word on polishing. If you want to retain the original factory look, either polish the gun yourself, or make sure the gunsmith knows what he is doing. The fact is that most gunsmiths polish the gun too much, using too fine a grit, having been told that a "mirror finish" is the best. The result is that the gun is a deep dark shiny black, almost like enamel, rather than the type of finish seen on most factory guns.

The reason is that few factories took the time to put on a "mirror finish" (Weatherby and a few European makers being exceptions). If not very careful, polishing also rounds corners, dishes out screw holes and markings, and generally ends up looking like Hades.

One technique is to use blue remover instead of a polishing wheel to remove old blue, then polish by hand with a very fine grit (e.g., crocus cloth) just enough to remove oxidation and provide a good surface.

Jim
 
Jim,

That's what I was planning.
Blue remover, then sand out the scratched areas, then a fine paper.
I would aim to be a little more polished than original, but not much.

All this labor and expense is making it seem something to put off until I'm extremely bored!

Thanks guys.
 
Well, as mentioned, normal hot bluing is an complicated and expensive process.

I have had very good luck with some of the cold blues, and have done entire (cheap, and not worth much $$$) guns with it, and it can hold up pretty well...As mentioned surface preperation is is the key...lots of elbow grease and time, but not much $$$
 
I have told this before, but it is a cautionary tale on hot tank bluing. A friend, a professional (if not very experienced) gunsmith, once set out to blue a Browning High Power.

He had been used to bluing .45 pistol magazines by just polishing them and tossing them in the tank, so he did the same with the BHP mag.

I guess he knew that bluing salts dissolve aluminmum, but he didn't know that the BHP magazine follower is aluminum. Part way through the process, while he was looking at the tank, the follower let go and the spring threw its remains and a batch of hot salts into his face. Fortunately, the stuff missed his eyes, and the shop had a quick shower arrangement right next to the tank, so he was spared the worst burns.

That illustrates what old fudds like me mean by a "proper setup" for bluing, not just a couple of tanks and a propane cylinder.

Jim
 
Hi John,

For touch up, I recommend Birchwood Casey's Super Blue and also the Brownell's Oxpho Blue.

As previously mentioned, most gunsmith's use the hot blue method, but some have to touch up parts and use the same solutions as most of us "do it your selfer's do". The key is degreasing the metal with denatured alcohol and then using a hair dryer to warm the metal. It speeds up the chemical reaction.

If you use your rifle hard, you may want to just take the barreled action from the stock and touch up blue the exposed barrel by itself. That way you get the same shade of bluing across the entire barrel.

That way you can keep your rifle looking nice from season to season.

Good luck and Merry Christmas!!!!

Chris
 
I've used the Blue Wonder system and have had pretty good results. It it tougher than all of the cold blues that I've tried and is quite easy to work with. Just follow the directions and be patient. You can either do just simple touch ups or an entire gun. Doesn't stink or make a mess, either.
BTW, I do use a torch and oil dunk method for misc. screws and pins that get scarred up over time. Just the heads, mind you ( don't want to mess up the threads ).
 
cold blue

I personally have not found one cold blue that meets my standards of quality in a finish. I absolutely refuse to go with the "rust blue" system because of cost and labor sooo...I learned how to parkerize some 6 to 8 years ago. I'm pretty good at the zinc phosphate (gray to gray/green) but I've got to try some more manganese phosphate (black) soon. I did learn where I made mistakes before so I should be able to pull off a decient black the next time I try it. It can't be that hard...Bushmaster does it (just kidding).:rolleyes:
 
I for onelove that deep, high polish blue. With the exception of my milsurps, I want a finish that looks like black/blue glass.

I have done entire guns with cold blue; I still have my first rifle, a sporterized '03 Springfield that I cold-blued. Still has the finish on it, and it still looks good--and I blued it close to 20 years ago.

Here are some tips for polishing:

1. Learn the proper wheels to use for the proper results. There are three basic types: the felt wheel (hard or soft), the loose muslin wheel and the sisal wheel.

The sisal wheel is for rapid rust and flaw removal. This wheel can be BAD JUJU--with polish on, it WILL cut metal fast!

The hard and soft felt wheels are used for a mirror finish. However, they can also round out screw holes and remove factory marks if used with the improper polish.

The muslin wheels are good all around wheels. When used properly, you can use them all the way from start to finish.

There are some guidelines, though.

First, make sure that you have the proper motor for the job. A good bench motor, developing at least 1/3 hp is a must.

6 inch wheels are good, but the work area is greatly reduced. You can also double up on the muslin wheels to polish a greater area.

After mounting the wheels, get and use a good wheel rake to true and even the wheels prior to use.

I use and recommend the Brownell's Polish-O-Ray series. It is specially formulated to polish gun steel, and it does a great job, too. Here are the polish grits I use:

If I just polishing to blue without flaw removal, I'll use 400 grit, then go through 555 black, gray, and finish with white. If I have done work or flaw removal, I'll start with 220 grit, then to the 400.

Start your wheel first, then load it with polish. Use a light pressure, let the wheel take the polish slowly or else you'll be flinging great chunks of the stuff all over your shop area. Also, don't wear your best clothing when polishing; I recommend a good shop apron.

Use a separate wheel for each grade of polish, and put your wheels in plastic bags between jobs. Keeps them from picking up dust and dirt and other garbage, too.

Finally, when you do polish, use only LIGHT pressure. Just hold the work against the wheel; let the motor and the wheel to the work for you.

For cold blues, I like the Birchwood Casey Perma Blue paste. I prep the metal by first polishing, then wiping with denatured alcohol. Do NOT touch the metal with your bare hands after the alcohol, it will affect the bluing. Also, after the alcohol evaporates, rust will start almost immediately. Blue immediately.

Use a propane torch with a spreader tip and a low flame. Carefully heat the part to be blued; not too hot, you're looking to warm the surface only. After this, apply the Perma Blue. Be generous with it, too! I have found that a big piece of felt is ideal for applying the bluing.

After the paste is applied, let it sit for about 1 minute. Now, polish with a crumpled up brown paper shopping bag (No, I'm NOT joking!)

Apply about four coats, polishing with the bag between coats.

When you're finished with the fourth coat, hand buff with 0000 steel wool. You'll LOVE the depth of the finish!

IMPORTANT!!! Immediately apply a good light oil, such as 3-in-1 liberally. Let it sit for about 30 minutes, then wipe off the excess.

Now comes the hard part:

DO NOT TOUCH OR HANDLE THE GUN PARTS FOR AT LEAST 72 HOURS AFTER BLUING. This gives the bluing a chance to mature.

Finally, re-oil and assemble, and the job's done. :)
 
powderman- that was a good post...
i am getting ready to send a rifle off and i want the end product to be a very deep blue... i want it to look like you are looking into the metal, not at the metal.

unfortunately, this sort of work is well beyond my abilities - but now i have a better idea of what to tell the smith i want. the gun will be going out next week, so it sure was a timely post!

(i hate mailing a gun off... the mailing isn't so bad, its the blasted wait to get the thing back! has to go 2 states away, so it isn't like i can just pop in and have a peek, either...)
 
I know this may be asking a bit, but does anyone here have a site or a thread with pictures of the process? I have been reading about this all day and now I know there are a myriad of options, but now I have less of an idea then before.

My plan I have derived so far is....

Completly disasemble the gun (A cheap Charter Arms BULLDOG .357), do the white vinegar/salt bath trick to remove the rust and blue, rinse, boil, dry and polish then cold blue.

Is this close?
 
dfariswheel said:
You're better off allowing a professional re-finisher do the polishing.
The difference between a good blue job and a crappy blue is about 99% in the polishing.
It takes a pro who's done enough polishing to develop the skill and "feel" to do a good polish job.
Even most local gunsmiths don't do enough to get good at it, which is why most local shops send the work out to a pro refinishing service who can do it right.

Until then, look into the Brownell's "Spray and bake" gun finishes.
These are spray-on finishes you apply to a thoroughly degreased gun, then bake in your oven to harden the coating.

These come in several different types, in a number of colors, and are surprisingly tough, durable, and good looking.
Click to expand...
Exactly!
 
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