Question Regarding a CC Pistol

[Siggunner]

Hello all.

I started getting into shooting about a year ago and I came here to THR quite a bit to get info on where to start and everyone was very helpful then. So, I come back again this year since I'm looking at getting my CC permit soon and I'm wondering if anyone has any suggestions for a good CC pistol. My situation is that I got most of my friends into shooting and do not know anyone with a collection of guns for me to try. There is a local gunshop that lets you rent but they are rather expensive for my budget and I'm looking for a good list of 4-5 handguns to start checking out. Here's a few things that might help you all in your suggesting.

1) I own a Sig p220 right now and I love the feel. However, I'd rather not carry this gun as I got it mainly for home defense, and it is a bit big (I'm a smaller guy; 5'5", 165).
2) I've not handled many types of pistols, but I know the Glocks do not fit my hand and 1911's feel a bit..."chunky." My friend has a CZ-75 and I love it, but again, it is a bit bigger than I want to try and conceal.
3) Caliber is not as important to me as being able to conceal it. .45's can be thinner than 9mm's if they're single stacked, so I know it is not necessarily 'smaller calibers are easier to hide', but again, I don't have nearly as much information at my disposal as the collective whole of those that read this board.

The main reason I want another pistol for CC purposes is (heaven forbid) I was forced to use it, I know I'd not see it for at least a couple of years (possibly longer), and I want some kind of backup. Also, I would prefer it if the gun was used in the case, again, that I lost it due to having to employ it, I wouldn't be incredibly heartbroken if I never saw it again. So, to sum up, I'm looking for a concealable pistol similar in feel to a Sig/CZ/Browning type that is reliable and not going to break the bank. Thank you all for your suggestions and I'm sorry for the long post.

 

[El Tejon]

Handguns are so subjective that recommendations are mere reflections of personal opinion. I would rent or borrow and find what I like. Then buy another gun just like it and lots of mags and ammo. Maybe split the baby and look at something in the Kahr lineup? I carry a Kahr P9 as a bug.

It is my opinion that training will help you select your pistol. I always find it interesting the differences between those with many hours of training and those with 0 hours in pistol preference. Education allows one to sort out the factors that should go into a carry pistol.

As an aside, given that money is a factor, have you considered a used revolver? Used police revolvers used to go for $200 around here.

As to carrying and concealment, remember a quality holster AND belt go a long way to make carrying a "big" pistol easy. I, as well as many members of THR, carry full sized 1911s and we are not all built like middle linebackers (remember if you are short or skinny you can avoid incoming fire better). We have learned to buy quality holsters and belts.

In summary, get trained up, buy quality holsters and belts, buy multiple copies of your carry gun.

 

[Autolycus]

Check out some HKs. I recommend a P2000 personally.

 

[Stan_TheGunNut]

Here are my suggestions, in no particular order:

1) G19/23: You mentioned that Glocks do not fit your hand, but if you can, try shooting one. They are relatively inexpensive, good quality, and accessories (ie magazines) are relatively cheap. They are also easy to use under stress in that they have no external safety to operate.

2) Sig P239/229: Sig's are also good guns, and you should be familiar with their operation since you already have one. The can be had in DAO or DA/SA, but are more expensive than other brands. I consider the P229 to be similar to a G19. The 239 is a single stack, and is much thinner, so would likely be a little easier to conceal. They also make a 380 that might be good.

3) KelTec P32/P3AT: These are small, lightweight, and relatively inexpensive. The calibers are 32 ACP for the P32, and 380 for the P3AT. KelTecs are also available in 9mm and 40 S&W. I have had some issues with reliabilty from my P32.

4) Beretta: I think its' the bobcat, which is a 32 ACP. They also make a 380 (or used to) that has a flip up barrel. These are relatively small and Berettas tend to be of good quality. They also have make the Cougar (this might actually now be a Uberti product, or Stoeger), and other guns in various calibers.

5) Springfield XD: Supposed to be good reliable guns, and relatively inexpensive. I personally think they have too many 'safety' features, and don't like the LCI's, and grip safety. I do not own one, nor have I shot one, I"m just going on what I've heard. I've also heard some good things about CZ's, but have never even handled one, so I can't really speak to it.

6) HK: They make various guns, P2000, USP's, etc, that are good quality, but rather pricey. Magazines also cost quite a bit in my experience.

All of these guns can be had used, so you should be able to find one in your price range. Hope I've helped.

 

[ArfinGreebly]

CC Candidates

A couple that I've handled:

• Bersa Thunder .380, compact, smooth, reliable;
• Taurus Milleneum Pro PT111, 12x 9mm, DAO, very compact;
• XD series

The XD series is robust and reliable. That's one that I actually own. Mine is the 4" XD40, which is a bit large for CC, but they do a compact 9mm that's about right. Good mag capacity. Very good trigger.

Because the XD is single action, the safeties are a good thing. Don't worry, if you're actually holding the pistol in your hand and your finger actually pulls the trigger, it will actually go bang.

 

[brett30030]

Understanding how you plan on carrying may be helpful in making a recommendation.

I back pocket carry a Kel-tec P3-at in a guru dave, and occasionally a Ruger sp101 .357 snub, either IWB, or in a desantis pocket holster.

 

[RNB65]

Kahr Arms makes a whole family of compact pistols specifically designed for CC in both all-steel and polymer frames and in a variety of calibers (9mm, .40S&W, .45ACP). A Kahr P9 is my primary CC handgun.

The CZ Rami has a lot of fans. It's an all steel, subcompact in 9mm or .40S&W.

Springfield Armory has recently introduced a compact 1911 in .45ACP called the EMP.

Then there's always the butt ugly but totally reliable Glock 26.

At the cheaper in of the spectrum, the new Kel-Tec PF-9 deserves some consideration if you're operating on a tight budget. Taurus also makes a compact line of 9mm's.

 

[modifiedbrowning]

Check out Bersa. I have two Thunder 9 Ultracompacts and a T9 Fullsize. All three have perfect so far. One is now my CC piece. I paid $350 OTD for each.
www.bersafirearmsusa.com
For some more money look at the Walther P99 and P99 Compact. I carried a fullsize P99 for 5 yrs and it is one of my favorite pistols. The P99C will be easier to carry.
www.waltheramerica.com
Good luck.

 

[Lou22]

I've researched alot of CC guns over the past 2 years. My main criteria was conceability, reliability in a reasonably powerful caliber (at least .380) and not too expensive. Here are guns I own, in order of size:

1) Kel-Tec P3AT - tiny, reliable in .380, decent shooter for size and inexpensive (around $230 new). Not a range gun but fine for self-defense.
2) Kahr PM9 - one of the smallest 9mms, well-built and one of the best DAO shooters I've tried. About $550 new.
3) Taurus PT145 - about the smallest and lightest .45 auto made, reliable, also easy to shoot for DAO, 11 round capacity and inexpensive (about $350).

I use all 3 guns for pocket carry (though the Taurus only fits some pockets) and trust my life with them. There are other choices out there. I'm sure you'll hear from other folks.

Lou

 

[Siggunner]

Thanks everyone for the responses so far.

Brett,
I'm looking to carry on my right hip as I am right handed and that is where I'm most comfortable trying to conceal.

Tejon,
What holster brands are good ones if I want to carry a larger gun?
Revolvers are not out of question, but most of my experience with handguns has been with automatics. Any certain brands I should look at?

Also, I'm not against carrying a full-sized gun, but I've not found a holster capable of concealing the weapon on my body without the use of a larger jacket at this point. Any suggestions or websites to visit on holsters would be great. I have a friend that carries a Hi-power in a simple, inexpensive loop holster, but again, he always wears a jacket or bigger shirt over his gun. I'm looking into an IWB holster, but have no friends that use one.

Thanks again everyone.

 

[possum]

Springfield XD: Supposed to be good reliable guns,

they are definetly reliable, i have tested them in that area, they go bang everytime, no matter what i do to slow them down.
i would first recomend the xd series in any caliber, but also the sc lineup is a good place to look i have the .40sc and love it.

i would also recomend the kahr k series i have a kahr k-40, and my dad has a kahr k-9 elite and they are both sweet pistols, the polymer framed pistols are ok but i like the little extra weight of the steel frames myself. recoil isn't that bad for such a small gun, even the .40 cal only draw back is that mags are so expensive but for carry three should be plenty and 2 come with it.

i carry both the xd sc and the lahr k-40 just depends on the situation and the weather, at the time, ie what i am wearing.

 

[highlander 5]

Walther PPK 380 I carry a PP in 32acp yes I know mouse gun but no one has volunteered to let me put 3 or 4 hydra shock into them to see how they feel afterwards

 

[peacemaker45]

One best buy in larger carryable guns right now is the Taurus PT1911. It's their take on a 1911 with all the bells and whistles, for the same price as Springfield's most basic plain jane model. 750 rd's and counting through mine, 100% reliable with everything I've fed it. It's now my carry piece.

As far as holsters go, if price is a concern, I can't think of a better combo for not a lot of dollars or aggravation than Blade Tech's Ultra Concealment Holster (UCH), riding on one of Wilderness' Instructor Belts. Holster is about $70, and belt is $35 to $45. Being of Scots descent, and therefore having an apprecation of bang for the buck, that got my nod for the best way to shoehorn a largeish pistol into my life.

~~~Mat

PS. I noticed that you said that 1911s felt blocky to you. One nifty thing about the Taurus is that it comes with slimmer than standard grips, which make that issue much less of one.

~~~Mat

 

[Mandirigma]

I'm not against carrying a full-sized gun, but I've not found a holster capable of concealing the weapon on my body without the use of a larger jacket at this point. Any suggestions or websites to visit on holsters would be great.

I'm looking to carry on my right hip as I am right handed and that is where I'm most comfortable trying to conceal.

Just a suggestion. In my experience On your right hip (3 0'clock) is a bit hard to conceal I found that at around 1:30 or around 5 O'clock to be a bit better in concealing a fullsized 1911. But you should carry where it best suits you.


I personally use a

http://kytac.com/page3.html , and

http://www.crossbreedholsters.com/crossbreedIWB.html

That I bought from a friends drawer full of holsters while I'm waiting on a VM2 from http://www.miltsparks.com/

Are cheaper alternatives. But you got to watch the kydex, its hard on some finishes.

Also don't forget about the gunbelt. No a regular belt won't cut it. Heres where I got mine http://www.ligerproducts.com/

Hope this helps

 

[AK103K]

I'm 5' 6" around 165 and have had never had any troubles carrying and concealing a full sized pistol, including the P220. Right now I carry a P229 with a double reload.

With the right holster, in the right place, proper clothing and attitude, you can carry pretty much anything with little trouble.

I normally use a IWB holster at around 4:30, or just behind my hip, and a double reload on my belt on the off side. A light sweatshirt or fleece in the winter easily covers everything, so if you remove your heavier coat or windbreaker when you come in, everything is still undercover and you dont feel or look out of place. In the summer, an untucked oxford type shirt will do the same. You can actually keep the gun out of sight with nothing covering it, just with body position. I've answered the door in a tee shirt for the pizza boy this way, and they have never been the wiser. Once you get used to it, IWB is one of the most comfortable and as far as I'm concerned, the most concealable way to carry a large to medium frame pistol on a daily basis.

Personally, if your looking to get another pistol, why not just get another P220? That way you have a spare. I have duplicates of anything I carry. You already know the gun, spare mags are the same, and you dont need to buy new holsters.

One thing nice if you stay with SIG is, guns of different models can often use the same mags and holsters. My P220's mags, work in my P245, and the P245 also fits in the P220's holsters, as do my P226's. My P226's mags work in my P229's. Just buy the "railed" versions of the holsters.

 

[tegemu]

25% of the time I have a Bobtailed Smith & Wesson Scandium Commander,
.45 ACP, 1911 in a Brommeland www.brommelandgunleather.com Max Con V holster. The other 75% of the time I have a Kimber Ultra Carry II, .45 ACP, 3" barrel, 1911 in my pocket, in a Sam Andrews www.andrewsleather.com pocket holster. The 3" 1911 is surprisingly easy to pocket carry. It is about the same size as many of the other popular small Auto's and as the Snubby .38 - both of which, folks swear by. I like the firepower and shootability of the 1911.

 

[ezypikns]

Go to a gun shop and handle a Kahr PM9.

I believe it's the smallest 9mm pistol out there, certainly among the smallest. It's about .9 wide or slightly less than an inch. 6 rounds in the mag and 1 in the chamber. Less than 20oz. loaded and very compact. Great Double action only trigger and very accurate for such a small pistol.

I carry mine in a DeSantis Nemesis pocket holster, or in a Milt Sparks IWB holster. It just disappears, even in a pair of shorts. Extremely concealable.

If you end up getting one though, be sure to get the grip extenders from Pearce. They replace the floor plates in the standard mags (easily done), and really aid in controlling the pistol.

 

[Siggunner]

Again, thank you all so much. I now have quite a list to start checking out.
Special thanks to AK for the advice seeing as you're about the same size as myself. I think I'll start with the Sigs since I know I like those already and I've already got one, and see how that goes. If that doesn't work out then I'll start branching out into some of the other suggestions.

 

[Baba Louie]

Do not overlook S&W J-Frames as well for IWB or pocket carry (if you have big pockets). A 60, 442, etc might fit your hand (grips are easily changed to fit) and when carried in the proper holster, conceal well. Ruger's SP-101, while a bit bigger/heavier (ruling out pocket carry) is also a quality handgun. If used doesn't bother you, try to find a good, lightly used Colt Detective Special.

Speaking of quality holsters...
http://www.lightningarms.com/products.htm

edited to add this link to CCA and a Sig239DAK
http://www.coalcreekarmory.com/product_info.php/products_id/152