Questions for LEOs

[AJChenMPH]

Got two quick ones for ya:

1. Other than the standards (Glock, Sig, S&W, HK), what other makes are out there as authorized for duty carry? I think I saw something about some agencies carrying Springfield, and others CZ. I'm considering a 9mm pistol next, want to keep it to something fairly common out in the LEO world.

2. When you travel on airlines and take your weapon with you, do the airlines give you less hassle if you identify yourself as an LEO?

If there's information that's considered privileged, feel free to PM me the answer, or if you want to know why I'm asking before you answer. It's too complicated for me to post out in the open.

Thanks in advance...

 

[USAav8r]

1. Department policies vary obviously, but pretty much any modern handgun in 9mm and above will be authorized for duty carry by someone, somewhere. Some exceptions may be the Desert Eagle .50, and other not so common sidearms, however I have heard rumor of these being authorized by some agencies.

2. As far as checking weapons in baggage, there should be no less hassle. All the same hoops have to be jumped through. That being said, I have checked weapons several times and have not had it take more than 10 more minutes of my time, and not had any problems.

 

[stillaftermath]

IANALEO, but I can tell you the same - It varies widely by city, state, and department. Here in NC, for instance, our city cops, sheriffs department, SBI, etc, all carry different sidearms. Really... just ask. Most LEOs, in my experience, are moderate gun enthusiasts too, and if you ask a question and don't sound like a complete idiot, they'll be happy to answer.

Regarding travel, LEOs have no special privileges, but traveling with a firearm isn't a hassle anyways. You show up, declare the firearm, they will ask to inspect it to ensure it's unloaded, then the case will be closed and locked. You maintain the key. They tag it as a firearm. One thing to note is that once that thing is in transit, you never, ever open the case or take possession of it until you arrive at your destination, regardless of what any airline or TSA agent tells you. Doing so puts you at high risk of committing a felony. Be especially careful if traveling to NJ or NY.

There was a case not too long ago of a County Sheriff here in NC who tried to travel with his sidearm without declaring it. He raised a bunch of a hell on it, "I'm the goddamn Sheriff!" etc. It uh... didn't work out well for him. Air Marshals are the only LEOs with blanket exceptions regarding firearms in air travel.

 

[GRIZ22]

1. Policies vary as has been said. It can vary from you can only carry your issued handgun to almost anything.

2. If you're checking your gun as an LEO there is no difference in scrutnity by TSA than a private citizen gets.

I've been retired 4 years now but I think the following still holds true. State and local LEOs can carry on the plane if they have taken a TSA training course and have a letter from their chief stating they need to be armed as soon as they arrive at their destination. I don't have any experience doing this

Federal LEOs (FBI, DEA, ICE, ATFE, etc) take an annual training course from TSA and can carry on the plane after some paperwork and ID verification is done before they enter the secured zone of the airport. This would also apply to state and local lEOs who are assigned to a federal task force and have the proper ID.

 

[TexasRifleman]

When you travel on airlines and take your weapon with you, do the airlines give you less hassle if you identify yourself as an LEO?

Do you get hassled when traveling with firearms?

I've never had any real problem and I do it all the time.

 

[AJChenMPH]

Thanks for the all the replies.

I haven't been hassled yet, but I was approaching it more from the perspective of the airlines (not TSA) giving you less of a problem with their own policies (i.e., ammo has to be in the original box vs. letting you carry the mags loaded but secured in mag pouches, etc.).

 

[AirForceShooter]

Tag it as a firearm?
That's against the rules.

AFS

 

[TexasRifleman]

I haven't been hassled yet, but I was approaching it more from the perspective of the airlines (not TSA) giving you less of a problem with their own policies (i.e., ammo has to be in the original box vs. letting you carry the mags loaded but secured in mag pouches, etc.).

No offense but it seems you're looking for trouble where there is none or you're just not familiar with the rules in place currently.

What you describe is allowed already.

From TSA

You can't use firearm magazines/clips for packing ammunition unless they completely and securely enclose the ammunition (e.g., by securely covering the exposed portions of the magazine or by securely placing the magazine in a pouch, holder, holster or lanyard).

AA places no extra restrictions, United just says "in a suitable container", Southwest allows for loaded mags as well so I guess I'm missing something.

As for letting LE get away with anything different, here is what the Feds say to their own sworn officers:

Ammunition. Ammunition must be securely packed in boxes or other packaging specifically designed to carry small amounts of ammunition. Ammunition clips and magazines must also be securely boxed. This restriction does not apply to ammunition being carried in the passenger compartment when an LEO is traveling with an accessible weapon under the provisions of 49 CFR § 1544.219.

 

[chris in va]

I'm not LEO. But the first time I flew with my P11 and declared it at the counter for TSA inspection, the flustered counter guy handed me a form that asked for my badge number among other things.

I politely handed it back to him stating I wasn't a police officer, then he REALLY got fidgety and called his supervisor over from the back room.

Everything was fine after that, but the look on the guy's face was priceless.

 

[stillaftermath]

Tag it as a firearm?
That's against the rules.

AFS

Sorry, I worded that badly. The tag is a card insert that goes into the case, not an exterior tag with "GUNS INSIDE!" in flame orange.

 

[9mm+]

I flew back to NC from Florida and had no real issue with the process. It was on Southwest and the counter agent seemed a bit flustered and yelled to the nearby TSA agent, "Got another firearm here!" So much for being discreet. The TSA agent was very friendly and helpful, and overall the process was easy.

 

[WC145]

I can carry anything I want that I can qualify with. My choice is a Beretta 8000D Mini Cougar. It fills the needs of both plain clothes and uniform carry with just a mag change.

I've flown numerous times with weapons in my luggage but I never identified myself as a LEO, never saw a need to. In each case the airlines and TSA personnel were courteous, professional, and knowledgable about the declaration process. To be honest, it's so easy I don't understand why anyone that can legally carry when away from their home state or jurisdiction would not.

 

[AJChenMPH]

No offense but it seems you're looking for trouble where there is none or you're just not familiar with the rules in place currently.

None taken. I have the TSA page bookmarked, so I'm familiar with what they want, but I remember seeing a page somewhere (should've bookmarked that one, forgot) that rated the airlines on how well they treated passengers transporting firearms, and I remember Continental didn't do very well because of their own policies. Since I tend to fly Continental a lot (EWR is the closest airport to where I live), I was looking for a way to reduce any hassle they might give, not that TSA might give.

Hey, I'm a Fed, just not a Fed LEO (as I said in my OP, it's complicated) -- I'm not trying to cause any problems. But if I can find ways to make my life easier without breaking any laws...

 

[WC145]

I've mostly flown Delta and they've been great, no troubles.

I don't know what hassle Continental would give you, it's a pretty simple process - tell them you need to declare an unloaded weapon, sign the card, let TSA look at it if they want to - how does Continental hassle people about that?

 

[NightStalkerTX]

Checking firearms when traveling by air

The process is very simple, but it is disheartening the number of airline agents and TSA officers that do not know their own rules. I travel with my firearms frequently and have encountered a wide variety of interpretations of both the airlines' and TSA's own rules. The most frequent misinterpretation that I encounter is that when traveling with a handgun, the ticket agents will sometimes want the declaration card to be placed within the handgun case, which is then locked with a non-TSA lock. I've verified with TSA supervisors that this is incorrect, as it logically should be. If the card is inside the gun case, when the baggage inspector x-rays the bag, sees the firearm, and opens the bag to inspect, he will not see the declaration card, thus concluding that the firearm was not properly declared. Since the emergency contact information is also on that card, he cannot contact the passenger to open the gun case, leaving the only option to destroy the lock. Once inside the gun case he will find the declaration card, but it is too late. The gun case cannot be relocked, thus will not be put on the plane. The solution I've adopted to this common situation is to complete 2 copies of the declaration card, placing one inside the gun case to satisfy the ticket agent, then placing the other atop the case laying in my baggage.

The statement that AA doesn't impose any special restrictions is incorrect, by the way. AA insists that the ammunition be in the original packaging, not in an enclosed magazine, which is allowed according to TSA rules.

 

[9mm+]

The one time that I did this (on Southwest), I checked the hard case for the pistols as a separate bag (not inside a suitcase). The TSA agent and I both walked over to the baggage screening and I waited until I received the thumb's up from them. The declaration was inside the case and locked, but if they needed to inspect anything, I could open the case right there.

Having two declaration forms as NightStalker suggests makes a lot of sense. If you only have one copy and its locked in the case, you could be out of luck if they need to get inside and they can't locate you.

 

[WVMountainBoy]

If you are traveling in the course of duty you can receive permission to fly armed via NLETS, I've heard of off duty officers also receiving said permission however not seen it done.

 

[AJChenMPH]

Here is a summary of the airline policies:

http://www.deviating.net/firearms/packing/report.html