Range Report: Browning Mk III 9mm w/Novak Sights....

[Stephen A. Camp]

Hello. Rightly or wrongly, the 9x19mm has seen "duty" in military, police, or plain, ol' honest citizen scenarios for the majority of the last century and continues to this day. It's been present in very public wars all over the globe as well as "private unpleasantness" perhaps known only to involved SAS personnel or other special operations groups around the globe.

A 9mm pistol that's seen a good deal of such might be Browning's Hi Power in one variation or the other. No longer one of the few choices in a "high-capacity" 9mm, Browning's Hi Power remains a most popular pistol with many and remains my favorite all-around handgun.

I bought a Mk III a few years ago and had it customized a bit even though the unaltered Mk III did everything I asked once the hammer spur was bobbed and the less-than-grand trigger pull, addressed.

The Pistol: Bought NIB by me, this Mk III 9mm still has its original factory "matte" finish, but has had a Cylinder & Slide hammer and sear fitted, magazine disconnect removed, bbl blued, Novak sights added, skateboard tape added to the front grip strap, and Butler Creek (Uncle Mike's) black, checkered rubber grips replace the nylon thumb rest grips that came on the gun. The trigger breaks very crisply at just over 5 lbs. While I like the factory extended, ambidextrous thumb safety, ambis get in my way with the Hi Power so I had the right side removed with the safety pin rounded off.

Unlike all of the HPs that I'm aware of in the past, this newer version of the Mk III's bbl does NOT have the protrusion at the rear upper end. So far as I can tell it makes no difference, but the breech face still retains the cutout for it, meaning that older barrels could be used if desired or needed.

This older Mk III bbl shows the protrusion.

The Mk III bbl in the pistol fired today does not. Both worked well and fed well with a variety of bullet shapes due to the factory treatment of the feedramp. Case support can also be observed.

There's also a slight cutout at the bbl's chamber such that the glint of a brass case can be seen, I suppose as a form of loaded chamber indicator.

Here's the pistol tested today in the form described above. All firing was done with a KRD SA 17 round magazine to see how it functioned with this particular Hi Power that's been reliable with all Mec-Gar and Browning factory magazines to date.

Note that the chambered round can be seen outside the pistol.

This pistol has a Wolff conventional 18.5-lb recoil spring in place as well as a brand new Buffer Technology's buffer.

The only change made to the factory 1:10 bbl was that it was blued. No accurizing has been done to this pistol.

Novak rear sight as installed by gunsmith, Lou Williamson. This is the version originally designed for the Hi Power and it works well. It's my understanding that today, some use the slightly larger Novak's intended for the 1911 such that a higher front sight can be used for a possibly quicker sight picture. I did that very thing when having a set of Novak fixed sights put on a Pre-B CZ-75 as the front sight would have been particularly low w/o doing so.

The C & S hammer is also clearly shown. This one, commonly referred to as the "Type I ring hammer" does alleviate hammer bite for me.

Plain, black, serrated front sight...

Continued...

 

[Stephen A. Camp]

Mk III w/Novaks, continued.....

Ammunition: The following factory and handloaded rounds were fired for testing:

Left to Right: Federal 115 gr JHP, Federal 124 gr M882 FMJ, handload using a Rucker 122 gr Cast Truncated Cone or Flat Point, handloaded Rainier 124 gr Plated Rnd Nose, handloaded Hornady 124 gr XTP, and handloaded round using Speer's 124 gr Gold Dot Hollow Point.*

*Handloads were as follows:
Hornady 124 gr XTP
6.0 gr Unique
Federal Small Pistol Primer
New IMI cases
LOA: 1.11"
Average velocity: 1243 ft/sec

Speer 124 gr GDHP
6.0 gr Unique
Federal Small Pistol Primer
New IMI cases
LOA: 1.12"
Average velocity: 1234 ft/sec

Rucker 122 gr CFP
6.9 gr Blue Dot
New IMI cases
Federal Small Pistol Primer
LOA: 1.075"
Average velocity: 1140 ft/sec

Rainier 124 gr PRN
6.9 gr Blue Dot
New IMI cases
Federal Small Pistol Primer
LOA: 1.155"
Average velocity: 1090 ft/sec

For those interested, Federal 115 gr JHP averaged 1130 ft/sec while the M882 ball did 1146 ft/sec.

Shooting: Shooting today was done at 10, 15, and 25 yards. I did not have access to the 50-yard range today; it was already being used when I arrived at the range. All shooting today, except for the rapid-fire stuff at 10 yards was done sitting and with my hands/wrists resting on sandbags.

15 Yards: Each group consists of 5 shots.

You'll note that two groups were fired with the Rainier's. I just didn't "do it right" in the first group.

The Hornady XTP/6.0 gr Unique load is the load this pistol was originally zeroed for, but the others hit pretty close at 15 yards. The very similar Speer GDHP load hits almost exactly the same point of aim as does CCI/Speer's 124 gr +P GDHP factory ammunition. It averages 1199 ft/sec from this pistol.

I cannot yet tell if which is the more accurate of the two loads. The horizontal spread on the Gold Dot load is me.

25 Yards: Groups consist of 10 shots each.

The three shots at the lower left of the group hit there because I slightly jerked my shots and knew it when I did. There was not time to reshoot.

...and with the Gold Dots...

10 Yards: From a Weaver, 5 sets of controlled pairs were fired.

No timer was available, but the shots were fired quickly. I'll get a timer in the near future and will be better able to present time-frames in which shots are fired.

Observations: First, the KRD magazine is a bear to load when brand new. I'd cheated and left this one loaded for about 8 days before today's session. The magazine worked fine with all of the rounds shown today. The magazine was loaded to full capacity for some shooting, loaded with 5 for others, and 10 for yet other shooting. I've purchased several of these and have had but one that gave problems. Disassembling and stoning a burr on the metal follower solved that problem. This magazine was specifically chosen as many folks wanting more than 10 rounds buy them and I wanted to do a bit of a "test" for them in this article as well. For more data on factory and aftermarket magazines for the P-35, I highly recommend the following site:

http://www.ont.com/users/kolya/bhpmagfaq.htm

The brand new Buffer Tech buff caused zero problems as did the heavier Wolff recoil spring. (I'm not surprised as I've been using this combination in several 9mm HPs for a good while now.)

Not designed as a target pistol, I find that this Mk III as well as the vast majority of others I've shot has very decent accuracy and it's better than I can do off-hand or under field conditions. I have not seen the need to have a Barsto bbl fitted to any Mk III even though it might tighten groups a bit, but have zero problems with folks who do opt for this upgrade.

The pistol is easy to shoot did NOT display the sometimes seen "one wild shot and then the group" effect; any errant shots are my fault. Ejection was positive and the standard pressure rounds landed about 4' to my right with the hotter two handload cases landed about 3 or 4 feet farther away. Cases were not swelled near the bases and firing pin strikes were plenty hard and well-centered.

Not nearly so nice as actual stippling, the skateboard tape did a very fine job of offering additional purchase to the grip and the rubber copies of the Spegel grips was both comfortable and less costly.

I like the pistol, but in all honesty, I do just as well with Mk IIIs using the factory fixed sights. They do add a little extra panache to an already grand handgun, but I leave it to you to decide if they're needed.

The barrel changes mentioned at the beginning appear to have zero affect on either reliability or accuracy.

Almost, but not quite forgotten, here's the "scientific" mud expansion test which was done on the handloaded Speer and Hornady 124 gr hollow points. The Gold Dot is on the left.

I own and use several Browning Hi Powers with both fixed and adjustable sights. Though all are special to me, the Mk III remains a favored shooter. Nothing special compared to many, this one suits me fine. It's cleanly taken quite a bit of smaller game animals in recent years and has been carried legally concealed on occasion. By going the route mentioned in the article, total costs can be held down quite a bit with you still winding up with a pretty nice shooter.

It does all I ask of it.

Best.

 

[Dacos]

Stephen,

I'm so glad you decided to continue your excellent reviews here post-TFL. As always you offer insightful reviews and I value your opinion highly, sir, after reading your many posts.

Curious what you think of the CZ-75 and Sphinx line of pistols? They're my favorite 9mm's and I basically consider them the double action variant of the Browning Hi Power.

Shoot well!

Dacos

 

[isaidme]

Thanks for all your time and effort in putting these reviews together.You inspired me to buy my BHP and Im sure more to come.

 

[Stephen A. Camp]

Hello and thank you. I cannot intelligently comment on the Sphinx as I've never even held one, much less fired it! I do like the CZ75 pistols quite well and own/shoot a couple of Pre-B pistols.

Best.

 

[Wildalaska]

Steve, no wonder the idiot internet portals in this world consider guns to be pornography, Im sitting here panting AND fondling my HP..

Excellent, excellent, excellent review!

PS...Im gonna put a SFS kit into my C series....how about that one???

 

[Stephen A. Camp]

Hello, Wildalaska and thanks. I've never tried the SFS system so I cannot comment on it. I don't think I care for it, but can see that were one carrying a HP in public view as would a peace officer, it might have potential for keeping complaints from the ignorant down. If and when you do have this done, please post your impressions of how it works.

Best.

 

[10-Ring]

Stephen - man, the more I see your reports on the Mk III, I start to think I need another 9mm pistol ( like 5 isn't enough!)
Keep up the great work...next time tho, could write about something I already own?

 

[Stephen A. Camp]

Hello, sir. I'll be happy to if we happen to own some of the same things!

Best.

 

[Marshall]

Hmmm Ok, so maybe I don't need to spend $1,500.00 on a C&S Pathfinder. I 'll just keep reading this and save my money!

Thank you for the post Stephen! It's evident you put your best foot foreward in these range reports! Very helpful!

 

[Stephen A. Camp]

Hello, sir, and thank you. Sometimes "need" and "want" can equal the very same thing. Sometimes I just have to try a new gun, that doesn't do anything at all that my "old" one(s) don't do, but I need to try it. Please, do not get me wrong; I have absolutely zero problem with folks customizing to the max if that's what they want. My point, if there is one, is that sometimes we might think we can much better performance than is the case.

For example, a fellow having trouble getting a Browning Hi Power to group as he knows it should might have a poor crown on his bbl and if a gunsmith recrowns, the gun will most likely group better and that fellow did buy some accuracy and that was money well spent...in my opinion. The pistol shown in the report hit POA with the factory fixed sights, but I just flat wanted to try some Novak sights. So, I did, but in this case, I didn't really gain any practical accuracy as I don't shoot any better or worse with this pistol than I did before. It might be different for others and I don't pretend to know what's best for anyone but myself, and then sometimes I wonder!

On the other hand, I have a Pre-B CZ-75 that has the smallish fixed sights. I had a set of Novaks installed on that pistol and I did buy accuracy! With my 51 yr old eyes, I just flat couldn't see the smallish original sights well enough to do what I knew the pistol would do, particularly at any kind of practical shooting in which there's speed. The much more visible Novak sights did help in that case.

You get the idea....

Best and thank you again.

 

[WhoKnowsWho]

I missed picking up a FN Manufactured High Power last week for $249

Thanks for the review and rubbing some salt into my wound!

 

[Blackhawk]

Stephen, your reviews and followup comments are priceless! Thanks so very much for taking the time and trouble to do them!

But (and there's always a "but" hanging around, isn't there?), they make me LUST for more and for the previous ones you've done. Obviously, I don't even KNOW what or where the previous ones you've done are.

Is there any chance that you have a list of the URLs where you've posted them or a list of the titles or something?

I'd like to make a searchable database of them because, as I said above, they're priceless!

 

[Stephen A. Camp]

Hello, Blackhawk, and thanks very much. Several of them are over at www.pistolsmith.com under "Gun Tests."

Best.

 

[CZF]

WOw! The Speer GD 124 +P really shines. What is your
'accuracy load' for your Cee-Zeds?

As you know. i'm a real fan of the P-35 Browning.
Just went to the CZ75 for the larger controls...
the entire gun is a bit larger in all areas...
it fits my long fingers better.

The Mark III adressed the controls and sights.
In the hands of a great shot (as yourself) the
P-35 is a real tackdriver.

 

[Stephen A. Camp]

Hello. The Hornady XTP/6.0 gr Unique will group very, very well out of all CZs and HPs I've tried it in.

Best.

 

[Rob McCormack]

Thank you Mr. Camp for your continued, valuable insight on the P-35. I bought a LNIB Mk III Std four years ago and have only recently come to appreciate the truly fine qualities of this pistol. I have been considering some upgrade packages (specifically those offered by C&S) and after your review, I have developed a clearer picture of what I hope to accomplish. Thank you again for your efforts and keep those excellent pictures and detailed explanations coming.

Ciao, Rob

 

[Stephen A. Camp]

Hello. Thank you and glad to've been of help.

Best.

 

[Dobe]

Question Mk III

Great field report, thanks.

Question: Besides the appearance, what makes a MK III a MK III? Are there any internal differences? Is the frame beefier, etc?

Thanks,

Dobe

 

[Stephen A. Camp]

Hello. The MkIII version of the Hi Power differs from the earlier "classic" version in the following ways:

1. The fixed sight version has higher visibility, larger fixed sights.

2. Both front and rear sights are dovetailed into the slide.

3. Ejection port shape differs from the earlier "classic" Hi Power in that's it's more "squarish," similar to that of a 1911.

4. Early versions of the MkIII had forged frames while latter ones have cast frames.

5. They have internal firing pin safeties except for some special order ones to Israel that do not.

6. They have extended ambidextrous thumb safeties.

7. Like the MkII, they come with black nylon "thumbrest" grips.

8. Some of the commercial Hi Powers toward the end of the 70s and early 80s had the bushing that entended a bit farther out from the muzzle of the pistol. So did the MkII which replaced what I call the "classic" HP. The Mk III does not; it's nearly flat at the muzzle.

9. Most of the time, the Mk III is found in what Browning describes as a "matte finish." This is a baked on epoxy over parkerizing where the old, "classic" HPs came in either blue, nickle, or on occassion, hard chrome. There's a specific designation for the Mk III available in bright blue; it's called the "Standard."

Best.

 

[JeepDriver]

I have a MK III Hi-Power that I haven't picked up yet due to the gun a month law. But I also haven't shot it nor do I intend to until it's "ready". I'm thinking about Robar or Novak for the customization(sp?) work. Any thoughts on which is better?

This is my first Hi-Power and I'm looking foward to shooting it but I can wait.

 

[Stephen A. Camp]

Hello. I'd shoot it a while before having anything done just to see if I really needed/wanted anything. Either of the two 'smiths you mentioned do fine work. I've only seen some of Novak's work and not Robar's, but Novak's left nothing to be desired on the HPs I handled.

Best.