RCBS .45 ACP die advice

[dreamer56]

Well I have been reloading for just a year - everything is great - learned a lot. But the one thing I have not solved is a smiley face indentation (or crease) on my 230grRN bullets when using my RCBS dies - see the pic below.

The seating die came with two inserts - one for flat nosed and one for round nosed - when I use the round nose seater I get this smiley face - obviously pressure on the bullet does not remain centered and the edge of the seater is marking the bullet.

You can see in the photo below that the bullet does not fit snugly into the round nose seating insert but I figured if it was started into the case straight then it should not matter right? I have carefully started bullets - checked the alignment of the die - etc... advice please...

Do I need to look for a different brand of 230grRN bullets? just load with the flat insert?

Thanks in advance!

 

[Galil5.56]

I have used that style of 230 RN bullet, and as I recall I used the seating stem (Dillon) for SWC bullets. It does slightly mar the bullet, but I am more concerned with a concentric slug. Might also try a bit more flare/longer guide time into the case from what I saw in the first picture.

 

[Chief-7700]

Dreamer, Try flaring the case mouth a tad bit more and see what happens.

Chief-7700

 

[ReloaderFred]

Remove the seating stem from the die and then you can chuck the seating stem in a drillpress, or even a hand drill and take off the sharp edge at the opening of the concave opening of the seating stem with a Cratex wheel, or even a small fine file or small knife sharpening stone. Just bevel it a little and it won't hurt the seating stem at all, and will probably solve your problem.

Hope this helps.

Fred

 

[CBS220]

Is it causing a problem with your loads?

 

[joneb]

Remove the seating stem from the die and then you can chuck the seating stem in a drillpress, or even a hand drill and take off the sharp edge at the opening of the concave opening of the seating stem with a Cratex wheel, or even a small fine file or small knife sharpening stone. Just bevel it a little and it won't hurt the seating stem at all, and will probably solve your problem.

This is what I have done to some of my seating plugs, I was getting that mark on LRN and LRNFP. If the bullet started cattywampus it would have a harder time getting inline with the case.

 

[Walkalong]

What Fred said. It will fix it.

 

[dreamer56]

Thanks all - first I will flare a little more - and if that has no effect I will do a little work on the seating stem today - or maybe I will find it will take a combination of both things.

and CBS220 - no, it did not seem to affect my loads in any way - I even shot a group that had the smiley and then one without to compare and really there was no difference that I could tell.

it just bothered me that the symmetry of the projectile was no longer correct and in my brain that says less accuracy - I also figured this was not going to get any better and might even get worse over time so I needed to address it now.

Thanks!

 

[Jim Watson]

Once upon a time you could send a bullet to RCBS and they would make a seating plug to fit its nose properly. I don't know if they still will, but you could call and ask.

 

[ranger335v]

"...the symmetry of the projectile was no longer correct and in my brain that says less accuracy..."

Your brain is right but perhaps for a difference reason than you suspect.

What's happening is the bullet is starting in the case cock-eyed, the tilted bullet is catching the rim of the seating plug and that's making the smiley. You already know that but have you considered what it's doing to the base of the bullet as it enters the case out of line? It is highly likely the base is shaved a bit on the opposite side of the dimple, and damaged bases sure affect accuracy!

The only (pistol) exanders I like are Lyman and Redding (who copied Lyman's). They have a double diameter expander, the main part is just under bullet diameter and the second, upper part, is just over bullet diameter. That allows us to seat the bullets straight up before moving the ram and insures they enter correctly. And next time, buy Lyman or Redding handgun dies to start with!

Polishing the rim of the seater plug WILL improve or eliminate the dimple but won't do much, if anything, for the damage from beginning bullet seating out of line.

A little more flare will help but it's likely you need a different expander that insures the base of the bullet won't be shaved or deformed when seating. Find someone who sells the Lyman "M" dies for your cartridge.

It's a puzzle to me why the other die makers don't also copy Lyman's great expander design, the patent on it ran out long ago. Perhaps it's just the "not invented here" syndrome. But, then Hornady's sliding sleeve seater guide is also a copy of an old Lyman design. And RCBS's current Competion Seater is simply a copy of the old Vickerman design, so .... what's the reluctance with the expander?

 

[jeepmor]

What Fred said +3.

 

[dreamer56]

Absolutely great information! Great board- really have learned a lot reading and appreciate the expertise. I did adjust for a little more flare and polished the seater - that helped - but I suspect I still need to check out the base.

Really good thoughts on the base of the bullet - geez - why didn't I think of that? - I will pull one apart and check that out - that makes perfect sense to me now - next time - different dies - thanks.

 

[bamacisa]

A simple way to fix this is to put a small amount of paper in the seating plug. This will cause the bullet to not go into the seating plug so far that the rim of the seating plug mars the bullet. This sounds crazy, but it works everytime.

 

[243winxb]

you could send a bullet to RCBS and they would make a seating plug to fit its nose properly

 

[dreamer56]

Paper - or maybe some of that blue masking tape you use for painting cut to fit?

So those of you who sent a bullet off to RCBS - what did it cost to have a plug made to fit exactly?

Thanks in advance.

 

[243winxb]

http://www.rcbs.com/questions/ask.aspx Ask RCBS, they can give you current prices on fitting a custom seating stem to fit your bullets style