Realistic Progressive Reloading Setup for a Newbie?

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Taurus44

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I am tired of paying outrageous prices for factory ammo, so I've decided to take the reloading plunge. Initially I plan to setup for reloading my pistol ammo (9mm/.40S&W/.44MAG/.45ACP), but I'd eventually like to branch out into my rifle calibers as well (.223REM/6.5 Grendel/.308WIN/.50BMG).

I am setup for reloading 12ga shotgun shells, so I'm not a complete newb. But it seems that shotgun shells are a little less demanding than handgun/rifle ammo so I'm looking for some help.

I've been reading a LOT about presses over the last week or so, and I've pretty much decided on the Hornady Lock-n-Load AP. It does everything the Dillon 550 does, but it has the extra stage, and it's a bit cheaper.

Where my decision making process breaks-down is with the extras... So many choices... What do I need besides the obvious shell plates, dies, powder, primers, etc? For general use range (pistol) ammo, do I need to trim cases? Is a case feeder worth all that extra money? Can I use the same equipment for my rifle rounds (except .50BMG, of course) eventually?
 
I cant help you with the hornady l-n-l but no need to trim pistol cases, I have some .45 cases have been loaded 10+ times still feed and work fine. I have a friend and when he is loading for a big match he will only use new brass. He has crono'ed ammo and he says there is to much varience in velocity with used cases.

If you get the dillon 550 no need for the case feeder I can run 400rnds an hour pretty easily without it { right hand loads the case, left hand sets the bullet }. Yes the 550 will load rifle rounds.

If I remeber right the l-n-l you use your left hand to load the empty case and the bullet so it maybe worth the $ on that machine.

Good luck you will enjoy it
 
You generally don't have to trim pistol cases.
A case feeder will speed things up, and keep your hands off your freshly tumbled cases. How important are clean hands and clean cases?

You absolutely, positively NEED a scale, calipers, and safety glasses. Always make sure your measure is throwing the correct charge, and you'll need calipers to make sure you're seating to the correct depth to avoid overpressure, mag issues, and feeding issues. Safety glasses are to help prevent debris getting in your eye in the event you ignite a primer while loading.
 
I just bought a LNL-AP press. I really like it. I'm glad I don't have the automatic case feeder because then I wouldn't be able to keep up with the thing. I've already used up all my .45 Colt brass.

It's powder measure comes with a rifle drum and no micrometer adjustment. It is useless for most pistol cases, although it does OK with .45 Colts, .44 Magnums, .357 Magnums, etc, with bulky powder. You'll need to (I need to) buy the pistol drum for it for another $25 or $30. The micrometer adjusting stem is extra.

None of my dies (various brands) will work in the 5th station unless I flip up the ejector wire and remove the finished rounds by hand. Even the .38 Special die is too long when crimping .357 Magnums. This is annoying, but not really a big deal. I've been just using the first 4 stations and leaving the last one empty, but I would kind of like to add a "powder cop" die. Hornady sells special crimp dies that will work in the last station. If you trust the powder measure (I don't yet) you do not really need to check the powder in each round; the case-activated powder dump and the auto-indexing will keep you out of trouble.
 
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considering how many calibers you listed, I would get a Turret setup. I would suggest a Lee classic cast turret.

You can change calibers in seconds with a turret press as the dies are all mounted. A fella can load about 150 rds per hour on a 4-hole turret, maybe 200 on a three hole turret, but I like the four hole better myself because you can adjust the crimp a little easier for pistol rounds.

The whole shooting match should run you about $150 for everything for Lee stuff, which I bought a long time ago when I started reloading and have yet to find a replacement that is worth the extra $.

I did have a lee progressive, which I tinkered with for two saturday afternoons before I got it set up (it was used, didn't think to look on the internet for instructions) and got it working. I really enjoyed it for a little while, then it was having trouble feeding primers (found this out after loading about 20 rounds without a primer in them) and I gave up on progressives.

I also enjoy reloading as much as I do shooting, so the convenience of the progressives are lost on me.
 
I have the Lee Classic Turret Press and reload lots of different rifle ammo and 45acp with it. It is not a progressive but works great! With all the dies you will need to reload for all those pistols and rifles...Lee dies will save you a ton and I think they are some of the best dies on the market.
 
Taurus44, I don't really see much difference between the Hornady and the Dillon; One looks almost like a clone of the other. Even the nomenclature is similar. I've got a pair (well, a trio) of Dillons; the oldest is about 15 years old. I think you should reconsider.

On the front end you need a shell plate and dies for every caliber-some shell plates work for multiple calibers. Primer flip tray and primer pick-up tubes large and small. Case lube and some form of tray to hold cases while spraying--cookie tray with tall lip. During operation a good light! Caliper and scale for quality control. Eye protection. On the back-end, extra bins to catch finished rounds. A good tumbler/vibrator case cleaner and a case-media separator is also required--plus polish.

Plan on a maintenance kit and spare parts combo at about 1 year or 20,000 rounds.

The real extras on the Dillon include extra powder funnels and tool heads. These are a real plus! One screw on the shell plate, two pins on the tool head, insert the proper primer feed tube and reconnecting the funnel safety rod constitutes a caliber change. 90 seconds if you're slow.

Extra pick-up tubes equates to longer production runs. Whistles and alarms add some extra measure of safety--it comes with a low primer (count remaining) buzzer. They can also be a real annoyance! Strong stands, case feeder, 2nd gen handle, tool stands, covers, special wrenches and holder--all amenities----like good stocking stuffers for family members without their own gift ideas. A good set of scale check weights is a good idea, too.

As to Service: top notch: call, ask, receive! I once sent them a press that fell from a truck and got run-over by a following car. The laughed on the phone, rebuilt the unit and sent it back to me in 10 days--no charge!
 
I'd say start with the Lee Classic Turret and safety prime (large and small) Buy extra turrets, one for each caliber, the Auto Disk powder measure, its riser, and Lee deluxe dies for all your pistol calibers. The press can also do rifles, but IMHO is best used with the indexer rod removed and worked as a single stage press. The scale, safety glasses, and case cleaing equipment have already been mentioned.

Later, if you find one caliber dominiating your shooting, like .45ACP does for me, get a Dillon 650 with case feeder and use the old Lee turret for your low volume calibers. Changing calibers with the Lee Turret takes longer to describe how, than to do and requires no tools once your dies are setup and stored in the spare turrets. Changing from large to small primer loads with the LnL or Dillon is a PITA, as is changing shell plates.

Nobody mentioned than the Dillon extra tool heads cost about the same as the Lee Classic turret press!

Don't get me wrong. love my Dillon 650, but IMHO unless you are married to a single caliber its not the place to start. Loading the primer tubes for the Dillon or LnL is the bottle neck for me with these presses. With the Lee Safety Prime its basically same operation as the Dillon or LnL in terms of primer flipping but once they are flipped, you put on the cover and are ready to load again -- you'll be making ammo while they are playing pac-man with the primer tubes. Helps keep the real world thruput much closer than the advertised numbers would indicate. If youl goal is to make 50-200 rounds of each of your four calibers for an outing the Lee Classic turret will be the fastest, unless you spend a ton of extra money on extra Dillon tool heads and powder measures. But if your goal is a 1000 rounds of a single caliber, the Dillon rules.

I ruled out the Dillon 550 for its lack of auto indexing and the SDB for its requirement for Proprietary (Dillon) dies. YMMV. Forget about the Lee Loadmaster or Pro-1000 unless you are a mechanical ninja, like to tinker as much as reload and want a challenge :) I also have the predecessor to the LnL, and a Loadmaster so I speak from experience.

The LnL looks like they've addressed the major issues I have with my Pro-7, but the price of a Dillon XL650 with case feed is basically the same as the LnL with case feeder, so I went with Dillon for their customer service and support.

Lee is good about sending spare parts for free during the first two years, but there is just about nothing to break on the Clasic Turret other than the index rod slider which lasts a long time and costs a whopping $1.99 from Midway after your two years are up (press comes with a spare one initially).

--wally.
 
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Good post Wally. I don't own a progressive yet but from the people I talk to, they load just like you said. They use a progressive for the high volume and a turret for the lower volume calibers that they are having to change a lot. I load 9mm, 38/357 and 223 on a Lee Classic Turret but don't shoot high enough volume to go progressive yet. I can load 800 rounds + of any one caliber in a couple of days easy or 300 of each. I also enjoy my time in front of the press so I'm not in a big hurry to just crank them out and be done with it.
Rusty
 
Wether I load 50 or 500 I use my Projector. I sold my Lee Turret press as soon as I bought the Hornady progressive. :)

Nothing wrong with the Lee Turret press. It will keep up with most folks needs. It would do mine. I just wanted that shiney, speedy looking, new Projector. :D
 
Wally. Midway manufactures and sells a neat tool for loading the primer tubes for about $35 or so. They call it the Vibra Prime. It is quite handy.
 
Scale calipers safety glasses and plenty of time and extra money. Because you are going to start shooting so much once you get to reloading.

buy bullets in bulk 1000 or 2000+, because I tried buying the 500 bullet pack and even with my single stage I loaded them all in a matter of weeks.

I am one of the start small first but You have reloaded before so you should be ok switching to a progressive. I do not think that you will ever need to trim pistol cartridges unless you are running some max or over max loads in them.
 
Wally. Midway manufactures and sells a neat tool for loading the primer tubes for about $35 or so. They call it the Vibra Prime. It is quite handy.
Click to expand...

I have one and use it, it helps, but its also been discontined. Dillon makes an auto primer tube filler if you got a spare $300 laying around -- its gotten mixed reviews so far, as did the Vibra Prime.

--wally.
 
Great post Wally, looks like your in Houston too. Im new to reloading and think after your review and a few others ive seen over the past 3 weeks, i will get myself a Lee reloading set. :)

I like to shoot my P226 in 357Sig and P220 in .45ACP but what i really want is to start loading for is my new rifle, SHR 970 in 300 win mag. :D
 
Dillon 550B

I'll stick with my Dillon 550B. I've had it for about ten years, loaded maybe 100,000 rounds with it (yeah, I shoot a lot by some people's measure). It's a great product and their support is even better.:)

Good luck if you go elsewhere - I've had mixed results with others in 35 years of reloading. :scrutiny:
 
I have a LnL AP, and it was my first press ~6 months ago. It's a great press, only issue I've had was the ejector wire hanging up on some rounds, but that can be dealt with fairly easily. It's a good beginner's press, and the 1k free bullets don't hurt the budget either.
 
I've resisted commenting on this thread as long as I can. See what I mean about the the blue crowd . . geez.

Taurus44,

Get the LNL, Midsouth has them for like $319 right now. Don't take the Dillon comments to seriously, most of those guy are infected with a virtually untreatable form of the blue flu. :D I've run the numbers on the LNL and it's a good choice in my opinion.

Bins to store empties - The little plastic shoe boxes from Lowes are dirt cheap, durable and hold a lot of pistol brass.

Boxes to store loaded rounds - endless selection, including the box they came in. Label them with load data.

Tumbler and media. If you have a feed store near you go ask them for a 50lb bag of ground up walnut shell. It will last you a long time and is dirt cheap. Add a teaspoon or two of Mineral Spirits to each load you tumble.

A good, accurate caliper.

A powder scale.

Cleaning primer pockets is a waste on pistol rounds.

Get a powder check die. Since you are getting an LNL you only need one and a bushing for it.

Get a case feeder after you learn how everything is working and you can spot a problem by feel. Simple to add, no savings buying it up front.

Extra Primer tubes - you'll want at least 5 of each size unless you want to stop every 100 rounds or so to fiddle with primers.

I think that should get you going.
 
I've resisted commenting on this thread as long as I can. See what I mean about the the blue crowd . . geez.
Click to expand...

I've seen this a lot and simply assumed I started reading the forum after the kool-aid crowd had left. More recently, I've started wondering if people are seeing stuff that simply isn't there.

Count the Dillon recommendations above and contrast to the Lee Turret count or, for that matter, those with the LnL-AP. I'm assuming the link to the GT thread doesn't count as it washes with the pdf link, right?

Phantom posts, maybe?
:)
 
I've resisted commenting on this thread as long as I can. See what I mean about the the blue crowd . . geez.
Click to expand...
I've seen this a lot and simply assumed I started reading the forum after the kool-aid crowd had left. More recently, I've started wondering if people are seeing stuff that simply isn't there.

Count the Dillon recommendations above and contrast to the Lee Turret count or, for that matter, those with the LnL-AP. I'm assuming the link to the GT thread doesn't count as it washes with the pdf link, right?

Phantom posts, maybe?
Click to expand...
Could you guy elaborate or be more specific?

I haven't bought my progressive yet, but every time a "drink the blue koolaid" comment comes up I just get turned off. Does the "other side" have anything better to come back with (like features, price or experience)?

An experienced reader can tell the difference between FACT and OPINION. I love reading the FACTS, and store the OPINIONS for future comparison. personal attacks get the whole posters thoughts thrown out for animosity. If a FACT is false, say so and post a reference.

Please state the FACTS and OPINIONS if you want to. I appreciate all of either you can give as I don't have 5,10,20,30+ years of reloading experience (yet :D). I don't think personal attacks are within Forum Rules...

Justin
 
Boxes to store loaded rounds - endless selection, including the box they came in. Label them with load data.
Click to expand...

I've started buying new empty gallon paint cans to store the loaded rounds. They hold a *lot* of ammo, and have nice wire handles. I store the empty brass in 3# coffee cans that I get from work, and bullets in peanut butter jars.

I just need a good place to store lead ingots...

Bob
 
For ROCCOBRO: I have posted this before so some may have seen it. However, here is my Blue/Red comparison:


The Dillon has been on the market a long time and have great customer service, as a result, Dillon users are very dedicated to their blue presses. The Dillon's are EXCEPTIONAL presses and do an exceptional job in reloading. The guys that have Dillon’s are very satisfied. The primary competition to the Dillon is the Hornady Lock and Load Auto Progressive. Because most of the Dillon users are so satisfied I was swamped with comments like, "The Hornady L-n-L is Junk!" I asked if they had ever loaded on the L-n-L and 99% said no. When I did find someone that had experience with both presses, most liked the L-n-L and many had sold their Dillon's and bought the L-n-L.

IMHO the Dillon has one major shortcoming and most Dillon owners will agree if they are honest. The Dillon powder measure is sorely lacking in ease of use and adjustability. It meters ball type powder very well but flake type powder less so. And, extruded stick type powder is VERY troublesome and not all that accurate. To be fair, extruded powder is difficult in all powder measures. But, the L-n-L powder measure handles all types of powder MUCH better than the Dillon. Also, it is a pain to swap out the Dillon powder measure to another die plate. As a result, many owners have several powder measures on separate die plates for changing calibers. This significantly drives UP the COST.

Also, the Dillon gets filthy as the old primers are caught in a cup after they have rolled off the side of the press. The L-N-L spent primers are dropped thru a plastic tube and into the trash or bottle or whatever you want to use. The point is, the dirt off the spent primers does not foul the workings of the press. As a result, the L-N-L IS MUCH CLEANER TO USE THAN THE DILLON.

The Dillon 550 has 4 die stations and the L-N-L has 5 stations. The Dillon 650 has 5 stations but, costs significantly more. Also, the Dillon 550 does not auto index, the L-n-L does. The Dillon 650 DOES auto index, but again, at more cost.

Next, the L-N-L uses a really slick bushing system for mounting loading dies to the press. It makes changing calipers and SNAP. After a die is adjusted for whatever you are loading you can remove the die from the press with an 1/8 turn and insert a different die. Each die has it's own bushing. The Dillon uses a die plate. The Dillon die plate costs more than L-N-L bushings. Another neat feature with the Hornady is that you can buy a bushing conversion setup and use the same bushings on your RCBS, Lyman or other single stage press and the L-N-L!

Additionally, the L-N-L seems to be built like a tank! The ram is about 2"+ in diameter and the basic press is similar in construction to the RCBS Rockchucker. I would say that a side-by-side comparison to the either the Dillon 550 OR 650, the L-N-L is at least as sturdily built. And, In some areas I think the L-N-L is better built. i.e., The massive ram, powder measure, and primer system. The head/top of the press is solid except for where the dies are inserted. The Dillon has a large cutout that is needed for their die plates. By just looking, it would seem the L-N-L would be stronger. But, of course, that may not be the case.
There is one piece that can get damaged on the L-N-L. There is a coil spring that holds the cases in the shell holder that can get crushed if you improperly change shell holders. That's the bad news. The good news is that they are only about $2-3 and they won't get crushed if you change shell plates correctly. The other good news is that this spring is the primary reason that while loading you can easily remove a case at any station. With the Dillon you have to remove pins in order to take a shell out of a shell plate.

You can load anything on both the Dillon and L-N-L from .25 ACP to 500 N.E. Realistically, I would say that people with progressive loaders mostly load pistol ammo about 99% of the time. After using the L-N-L for while I feel confident that my Grandkids will be using when I'm gone.

In summary, the Hornady L-N-L has all the features of the Dillon 650 but is much cheaper. Changing calipers is faster and cheaper. The powder measure on the L-N-L is VASTLY SUPERIOR TO THE DILLON, at least in my opinion. I bought the L-N-L and am very satisfied. A shooting buddy of mine is a long time, dedicated Dillon user. He has three! After giving me a ration of "stuff" about my choice, he came over and used my L-N-L and sheepishly said, "That's a very nice setup!!"
 
Waldog,
You gotta admit the Hornady LNL-AP ejector is pretty bad...

Other than that, I really like mine, and I'll get used to the ejector.
 
Waldog- Thanks for the scoop, I hadn't seen your write up before.. Have you used or owned a Dillon? That would lend the perfect credibility as you seem up to speed on them. And last, isn't there a fix or replacement ejector coming for the L-N-L? I don't look forward to tuning a machine AND learning how to reload at the same time.

I might be sold on an L-N-L now. Whats this I hear about free bullets???

Justin
 
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