Recoil Reality

[BigFatKen]

When I moved to Wisconsins farm country, you could shoot a slug shotgun or a handgun at deer. I bought a T/C in 7mm Waters which I loaded as you could not buy pointed bullets loaded for it. I think the most accurate load was about 35 gr. of 4064 and a 100 gr. bullet. After about 150 shots over a month, there was a piece of me floating around under the skin of my right hand in the area of the thumb-index finger web.

I never saw a doctor and it went away after a year or so. After that appeared, I shot it twice while deer hunting, then sold it.

The US Army issued reduced .45-55-300 ammo to mounted troops as the .45-70-405 was knocking them off their horses. At least that is the story I heard.

 

[brnmuenchow]

Sometimes I have wondered in the past if for some people it is the overall blast and their precieved recoil that is really the issue? Even though in reallity the recoil may not be that much but sometimes psychologically they get it in their heads "it's gonna hurt!" that makes it worse than what it really is.
ex.- My brother in law loves to shoot gun's but anything bigger than a 9mm pistol or .22lr and after a shot or mabye two he tends to shy away from it. He recently came over and was asking about my Mosin Nagant M91/30 and Marlin lever-action .45-70 Gov't rifles and thinks he would be interested in trying them out. He then asked to see what kind of round it fired so I showed them to him and his eyes visibly got larger and then the hesitation set in. I think he still wants to try them out, but I am willing to bet after a couple of shots from either one he will go and pick up the .22lr rifle or pistol, and put as much distance between he and myself. I know this after the first time I went with him to shoot, after shooting my Colt "Python" he seemed very uncomfortable and everytime he pulled the trigger he seemed to jump/flinch and then to the .22 he went. (The recoil on a 6" "Python" barrel just is not that much IMO, but then I am not sensitive to recoil.)

 

[Armored farmer]

recoil doesn't bother me. It is part of shooting. If you can't handle recoil from shooting, stay home and play with dolls.....chris3

If you punish yourself enough with recoil, your subconscience brain will refuse to pull the trigger. That will grossly effect your shooting. Ever hear of a release trigger??

I am only speaking from experience....If you shoot often...you had better do what you can to MANAGE recoil. I guess you won't avoid it

 

[Steel Horse Rider]

I think one of the chief factors (apart from the caliber) of "felt recoil" for long guns is the area of the butt stock. Something with a broad stock cross section has much more area in which to transmit the force of the recoil to your body while a stock such as the Mosin puts that recoil force in a very small area thereby heightening the sensation of "felt" recoil. Just my $.02.

 

[LoonWulf]

felt, or perceived recoil causes a flinch...sever and repetitive recoil WILL cause harm.
There are ways to mitigate felt recoil. Proper rifle fit, decent recoil pad, gun weight, longer barrel, proper stock design. These all add up to make a gun that SHOULD be uncomfortable bearable, or even fun.
Reducing actual recoil makes a big difference also, breaks, light loads, recoil reducers and gun weight, are pretty much the only option to do this.

I dont like being hurt, or loud noises, simple. The nastiest gun i own is a .300WM wearing a boyds thumb hole laminate, and limbsavers recoil pad. Ive shortened the forend and shaved and cored the stock, so that the whole gun weights less then 8Lbs scoped and loaded. I will happily bang away with it for most of a box, but as I progress it becomes a duel between the urge to flinch and my concentration. My 7mm remington magnum weights quite a bit more, that gun i can shoot all day. The loads are similar, 168s driven to about 3100 fps, the .300 uses quite a bit more powder, but the 7mm has alot more bearing surface on the bullet.
My other load for the 300 is a 180 driven to 3100....Ill only fire 5 shots before switching to something else.

Another instance i can think of for issues with felt recoil. A friend of mine owns a Benelli Nova, very nice shotgun, but the stock has rubber crap that grabs my cheek. 10 shots and im done.

 

[oneounceload]

recoil doesn't bother me. It is part of shooting. If you can't handle recoil from shooting, stay home and play with dolls.....chris3

It is immature and uninformed statements like these that have kept ortho surgeons driving Mercedes' for years

 

[x_wrench]

yes, i do think they are exaggerated also. my guess would be because early on in a gun writers career, he or she wrote about a fairly heavy recoiling gun, and said it was manageable. then 20 of the next 4000 people who bought that gun, wrote that writer, SCREAMING about how it broke their shoulder in 17 places, knocked aunt jenny's pie off the window sill 300 paces away, and so on. negative comments early on could cause that writer to be a little shy. or, of course, there is the probability that the writer did shoot 20 boxes of ammo at tin cans somewhere, and their shoulder is sore as he**!

 

[Armored farmer]

At the ripe old age of 12 my Mod12 trap gun had a Jess Edwards recoil reducer in the stock, and a Bill Staub Mercury Inertia Control in the magazine tube.

 

[blarby]

So, when someone tells you about recoil, it's like he's telling you what a meal you've never had was like: he can say what he thought of it, but you'd have to taste it to know for yourself.

Thats flippin perfect.

 

[Marlin60Man]

Personally I kind of felt it was really underrated the first time I felt the recoil of a rifle and it was only a .30-30. Really wasn't expecting that much of a jolt from it, and it left my shoulder very sore after only a few magazine fulls. It was a '94 Winchester repeater though, so maybe just not the friendliest recoil. In contrast, my friend had a 8mm Mauser that I could have shot for a long time without it becoming too painful, but I could tell I would get quite sore if I kept at it for too long.

The recoil from hand-guns... I don't know, can't say much, the hottest load I've shot was a .357 out of a 2" snub nose that was a full 2 lbs. It was pretty comfortable... I felt it more the next day than I did at the range.

The worse recoil I have felt is from a .12 ga pump gun. Something about the shotgun is just completely unforgiving to me. On the other hand, I think the hottest rifle load I've shot was a .300 Win Mag and I barely felt it when compared to just one shot from the shotgun.

I think it's just a subjective thing, and then there's other factors... I mean... The .357 I shot was a hefty little snub-nose. I'm pretty sure that one of the lighter snub noses wouldn't absorb the recoil quite as well.

 

[dmxx9900]

Shot a 20 gauge single shot with 2 3/4 slugs it had more recoil then the 870 12 gauge I shot with 2 3/4 slugs but it was manageable more of a big push but left a good bruise after shooting 30 slugs.

The mosin nagant m38 carbine is even worse since the recoil is quick and sharp plus the steel plate on it does not help either only takes a handful of rounds to start bruising but I like to shoot it once in a while because its so loud and cool to bring to the indoor range.

The recoil does not bother me its when my shoulder wears out from being bruised to the point that I want to stop and call it a day is what bothers me so I will make sure to put a good rubber pad on them to reduce the damage.

The worst pistol I shot so far was a Model 60 38 special snubnose but again the recoil of it didnt bother me its the fact that the grips were too small and my hand was too big that everytime I fired the recoil would cause the gun to flip back and cause the cylinder release to hit my thumb causing a cut after a few rounds.Had to sell it because I couldn't hit a thing with it since the grip was bad and it was more of a collectors gun then a run of the mill carry gun so I will opt for a newer smith and wesson snubnose with a good grip on it like the crimson trace grip or the pachmyr grips.

 

[The_Next_Generation]

First shot I fired was out of a Remmy 740 in .30-06. Steel buttplate, 180gr Core-Lokts from a bench. Wasn't too bad, but I really appreciate that .22

It seems that recoil really is more about personal perception, rather than actual ft-lbs involved. I find that when I am in a good mood, I really enjoy heavier recoil, lets you know what kind of power you have. On the other hand, if I feel rushed, bummed about something, or my mind is thinking about something in the background, recoil is not as "pleasurable".

Attitude and form have been and will continue to be the determining factors of felt/perceived recoil.

- TNG

 

[TexasBill]

The heaviest rifle round I have fired is a .375 H&H Magnum, Authoritative but survivable. I have owned .44 Magnums, .45 ACP pistols and a number of .357 magnum revolvers. Put lots of rounds through them all. My only shotgun experience is Remington/Mossberg/Winchester 12 ga. pumps with 18 to 20-inch barrels and one Remington 1100 12 ga.

The most objectionable recoil of any firearm I have ever owned is putting full-house +P loads through my Smith & Wesson Model 637 J-frame Airweight with the standard boot grip. I haven't tried, nor do I intend to try, one of the S&W Scandium Magnums or the Ruger LCR .357.

It's not the snub-nose per se: it's the light weight. I have owned and put many rounds through S&W Model 19s and Colt Pythons with 2.5-inch barrels.

I found that by backing off to standard .38 Special ammunition and installing a slightly larger set of grips (I use the wood grips from the Model 60 Pro), the shooting experience is much improved. Though my M637 is still a handful, it is easier to control for multiple shots and I can put 50 rounds or more through it without winding up with a battered hand. The extra .56 inch of grip length also lets me use both ring and pinkie fingers, maximizing my grip strength.

How much difference have the changes made? My M637 is my most frequently carried handgun.

I have always felt the recoil descriptions were simply the writer's experience and understood that my experience might be different.

 

[jgiehl]

As a guy who likes to shoot high horsepowered rounds.
Let me tell you anymore I can get about 8 in.
Then I have to leave the range.
But before I leave I'm generally using my forearms to pick stuff up because I can't use my hands.
I'M ONLY 28 YEARS OLD!!!!
So yes recoil is becoming a serious issue.

 

[buck460XVR]

Recoil is subjective and relative to the gun. Some guns are just painful while another in the same caliber is a pussycat. Thank goodness none of us HAS to shoot what we don't like in a civilian scenario.

 

[Flopsweat]

Perception to me goes hand-in-hand with anticipation. Anticipation can make you tense up or put a death grip on the gun. When you do this you cannot absorb the recoil properly and one way or another it's going to hurt more. With a firm, confident grip you will handle recoil the way the gun was designed: your body absorbs it by moving backward slightly. The trouble is, when you're anticipating a lot of recoil you're more likely to tense up. Which make the recoil worse, and so forth. This is why I always bring a bottle of Jack Daniels to the range. (No, no, no, it's a joke for Pete's sake) Actually I just step away from the gun for a minute and try to relax. I may check my grip, position, etc just as I do when I'm trying to focus on tight groups.

I get a big kick out of some serious recoil every now and then, but mostly stick to calibers in the the 9mm and .223 range. I really like shooting a good .22 rifle at 100 yards too. There is something very relaxing about that. Nothing wrong with a little 50 cal fun every now and then though.

 

[Sulaco]

I didn't realize recoil was a problem until I started reading gun forums on the Internet. It's just something we always knew about, dealt with, ignored, whatever. It just doesn't come up in my circles.

 

[lizziedog1]

I don't know if this is true, but I have heard that people that are built lighter are less effected by recoil.

The theory is that their whole body moves with the recoil. A big person will absorb most of the recoil in their shoulder, thus feeling it more.

 

[Ranger30-06]

A like pretty much everyone else has said, I feel recoil is about 80% mental and 20% physical. I met a guy that flinched to death with a .223 AR, but have also seen a guy throw 200 rounds of .45-70 in a short, light, custom single shot. (He let me take a shot, and one shot was plenty enough).


I'm a big guy; 6' 220lbs and plenty of muscle. Recoil usually doesn't bother me in rifles, but I've never had a chance to shoot anything over .357 Magnum so I don't know how well I could tolerate the larger calibers. On the other hand though, I had a chance to take a shot with some old FBI loads my grandpa had let me try, and holy cow, I know why the FBI dropped the .357...

 

[sugarmaker]

Very individual thing, I don't even bother to remotely consider what someone else's opinion on recoil is, and I don't expect them to consider mine. I appear to be very insensitive to big heavy recoiling things like my .375HH shooting 300's at 2650 (can do 20 rounds offhand before it starts to be enough) or 6.5" 500SW with 450's at 1200 (at 50 rounds I'm still OK but usually stop). I found my AR-15 and .243 started to bother me with a tee shirt on after 40 rounds or so, and a pachmyer gripped SW629 4" with hot 240 loads does me in at 25 rounds, even though it's less than 1/2 of the 500 in foot-pounds.

 

[J-Bar]

Much of my reaction to firing a shot is the noise. I suspect that the sudden loud report of a gunshot contributes to the person's perception and reaction to recoil.

I suggest an experiment: At your next range session, if you do not already, insert earplugs and then put your mickey mouse ear muffs over them. Try to eliminate as much of the report as possible and see if your perception of recoil changes.

That said, when I shoot hot 38s from a J-frame the trigger guard punishes the second joint of my middle finger, and I really don't enjoy it. Gun fit is critical.

 

[flatlander937]

The very first gun I shot was a "Baby Desert Eagle" in .45acp. I was anticipating a lot more recoil than I actually ended up getting(heavy gun helps a LOT). I also shot his Kimber 1911 which is an aluminum framed gun so it was felt a bit more... but it was also managable, though I just couldn't hold it steady as easily.

By comparison I shot a CZ 2075 Rami in .40 and I really just don't like that caliber. I seem to be bothered by quick snappy recoil more than harder but more gradual recoil. I'm going to try a few other guns in .40 before I really write them off, as that's the only thing I've shot in that caliber. I think I may have arthritis starting :-/


I am not bothered by any 9mm guns I've shot... the smallest being a Glock 26... my only gripe with that was how small the grip is for my hand(no pinky support) and the edges of the grip pattern really digs into my hand with recoil... if it were my own I'd probably sand it down to smooth the edges some.


I have a Mosin that I have yet to shoot... it will be my first long gun so we'll see what my arm thinks of a few hundred rounds through that when it's not so cold out.

 

[Route666]

I agree mostly with the OP - and the second poster - it is a big thing for the easily intimidated, which I think would be the vast majority of people concerned with recoil from those listed. It is all a mindset unfortunately, the big noise really throws people off, they know how hard things can hit / pull without making near as much noise, so if it makes that much noise it must be X times as scary / hard hitting / unmanageable.

If you can clear a new shooter's mind and get them to see recoil for what it is from the start, they will be years ahead in becoming a good shooter. If you can get them to realise that it's only going to make a loud noise (which is a non-issue with proper hearing protection) and push on your hand for an instant, and that's it, then they will become better so much faster.

It's going to make a big bang, jump in your hand and that's it. Now you know that, forget about it, and use brainpower that would otherwise be wasted on worrying about the recoil to get on with focusing on grip, sights, trigger.

Funnily enough, this is why I prefer the longer, sweeping trigger of a beretta 92FS or glock to the short sharp trigger of my 1911s as you need to concentrate more to keep that trigger moving and hold the sights right on that it goes off before you know it. The 1911s however have a lot more definite break point, which is easier to know, and easier to see coming / subconsciously anticipate / flinch.

 

[cdb1]

As a teenager I shot heavy recoiling shotguns and rifles and never noticed it. Now that I am 52 with two shoulder operations I notice it big time. I where an EVO-Shield shirt that really works well. I also believe the stockier you are the more you feel recoil. I am 5'10" and weigh 225 but am in very good shape. When I see lanky people shoot, their body seems to move more with the recoil which I think mitigates it somewhat.

 

[xfyrfiter]

The military snipers that are using the super long range rifles, like the 338 Lapua, 416 Cheytac 50 BMG etc. are finding that they are having problems with eye damage such as detached retinas.So yes recoil can and will cause permanant damage.