Recommendations on SW442/642 or Taurus 85UL

[aHFo3]

Getting her to a range or going with friends who have options for her to shoot is really important. I thought my wife would love my 442, but she hated it. It was uncomfortable and the recoil was too harsh...even with lightly loaded wadcutters.

The last gun I suspected was her favorite: The LCP. She loves it and carries it on her person daily. It fits her hand really well, and she is quite skilled with it.

If she does go with a revolver option, get a hammerless model. It really simplifies everything. It forces one to train DAO become skilled at DAO. It also allows for a higher hand hold.

Don't overlook the Ruger LCR. They're on par with the 442/642.

As far as quality goes, I've owned 2 S&W's that were manufactured post 2000. Both of them were returned to the factory for repair. One had a canted barrel and the other had an issue with the yolk retention screw. Both were taken care of in less than 2 weeks and neither cost me anything to ship. If I had to pay for shipping ($50ish) like I would with a Ruger or a Taurus, I'd be extremely irritated. I'm reluctantly okay with having to ship new S&W's back to be repaired since the turn around is quick and the cost is zero.

My brother has my 442, so I currently carry a Ruger SP101. The extra 10 or so ounces makes the SP101 much easier to handle. It is very pleasant, but let her try some.

 

[aHFo3]

If she likes the 442, but would like a heavier one, look for an older .38 special only 640. The pre-magnum 640's were amazing. They weighed about 20 oz. and were the same size as the current 642's They have the same shrouded hammer and are very smooth. I wish S&W still made them. The extra weight will make them easier to practice with. Buy both the old 640 for practice and the 642 for carry!

 

[jahwarrior]

Thanks jahwarrior, I looked at the Glocks at the last gun show, and they are a bit heavy at 20+ ozs, my lady is small at 5', petite. Not saying that she'll want something TOO Light, but a bit lighter, thanks

a Glock is heavy?



well, i guess a 1911 or a Ruger SP101 is out of the question, then...

 

[weregunner]

You're welcome Stayfrosty.

We're all in the shooting culture together.

McGunner knows of what he speaks.

 

[Stayfrosty]

Thanks everyone for your inputs, will post again after we try some different guns

 

[Elmer]

If you're picking between the two, S&W. But please heed the advice of the previous posts about ultralight revolvers. IMHO, far too many novice shooters (new to concealed carry) are steered toward popular, very small, very light revolvers. Those features that seem so rational at the LGS are the VERY same features that frighten, shock & pain the shooter right out of practicing, gaining experience & becoming a experienced, competent handgunner. Merely having a gun WON'T save your life. Only HITS count.

Part of the problem with the lightweight revolvers, is the insistence of some to use heavy loads in them for novice shooters. A 642 with factory 148 grain wadcutters, or one of the better non +P 110 or 125 loads, is not a particularly hard gun to learn to shoot. While you're right that just having a gun isn't enough, having it with you is definitely the most important factor, and a heavier gun is more likely to be left at home, in the car, etc.

I'm a big guy, and can easily carry one of my larger/heavier guns, (and usually do), but an Airweight Smith is a gun I will always carry, even when I don't feel like carrying the bigger one.

Rule One still applies.

 

[weregunner]

Luckily women are getting more of an education on handguns now. The NRA and National Shooting Sports Foundation are seeing to that.

It seems that the flyweight revolvers are dropping by the wayside to a degree by the females and for good reasons as already stated well by your folks.

There are plenty of females who are probably more than able to handle the flyweight guns. Just that the flyweights as a rule are not good starter guns.

 

[Stayfrosty]

I carry a LCP myself, and might switch out with her for the revolver. Friend of mine mentioned a Glock 27, 40cal for her, but it's about the same size as my Springfield sub-compact XD9 and she feels it's too heavy of a carry for her.

 

[oldfool]

Topic being CCW snubbies current manufacture NIB guns), the S&W 442/642, Taurus 85, and Ruger LCR are all obvious very good choices. Amongst those, it really just comes down to individual user preference, there is no "best". Just holding in hand is insufficient, need to shoot 'em to pick 'em.

Brand wars aside, the Taurus 85 has more loyal fans than most Taurus models, and not without good reason.
Most who have tried the Ruger LCR believe it to have the best trigger of all.
442/642 flavors are amongst the best selling snubbie models ever made, reason enough.

ULs vs all steel
You seem committed to UL weights, but I think that just might be a mistake, and it has nothing to do with gender or lady size. "can handle" has nothing much to do with "like".
Carry comfort most certainly counts, but THE ultimate reason for carrying one is 'shootability'.

Do the lady a big favor and let her shoot any two comparable size snubbies side by side, same loads, one all-steel gun and one liteweight. I cannot predict what her weight preference will be, but pretty sure she will have one, which is all that counts.
Shooting 'em is the only way to know.

PS
the blocky-Glocky may well be more about ergonomics than weight. They don't fit everybody's hand well.
The LCP is cute, light, and convenient (own one myself); some people can shoot them well, but most people do not, and there are a lot of big, tough guys who don't like to shoot more than 25 rounds thru 'em in a range session re: hand bite (my personal limit is ~50 rounds per session). Cute & lite only goes just so far. Guns are for shooting.. the carrying is just for the in-betweens

always check Bud's on-line as a price guide before shopping

 

[Haywood]

As long as you are going to try a few, let her try the LCR with Tamer Grip. The trigger is great and the grips absorb the recoil.

 

[ArchAngelCD]

Hello All,

Wanted to get some inputs for a female carrying a CCW using either an SW-442/642 or the Taurus 85-UL?

Both guns weigh approx 15-16ozs each, SW is hammer less and Taurus is shrouded hammer? Thanks for your input.

Just as a slight side, if you like a shrouded hammer and decided you like the S&W revolver better you can get a shrouded hammer revolver from S&W. S&W has a J frame revolver with a Bodyguard frame (not the Bodyguard revolver) in the M438 and M638. Both are just as good as the M442 and M642. They weigh 15oz like the M442/M642 too.

 

[Stayfrosty]

Just as a slight side, if you like a shrouded hammer and decided you like the S&W revolver better you can get a shrouded hammer revolver from S&W. S&W has a J frame revolver with a Bodyguard frame (not the Bodyguard revolver) in the M438 and M638. Both are just as good as the M442 and M642. They weigh 15oz like the M442/M642 too.

Didn't know that, I'll check them out, thanks!

 

[Water-Man]

From the standpoint of quality and shootability, it would be a mistake not to consider the Ruger LCR in your selection process.

 

[Viper225]

I am with Haywood and Water Man try the Ruger LCR. I have owned a 638 for several years. I got it before the LCR 38 came out.
I now also have the Ruger LCR 22 and LCR 357, and I really like them.

When working with new lady shooters at the range, I like to start them with my S&W 617. It is a very user friendly platform. With no recoil a new shooter will get comfortable and accurate pretty quickly. After getting comfortable shooting the K Frame 22 I move them on to either my 4" 64 or my 4" 686 Power Custom Combat.
The LCR 22 will give them another option to try out a small carry gun with a good trigger, and no recoil. Again after getting comfortable with the LCR 22 one can move them on to a light 38 special load.

The LCR grips are a little bulkier than a 442/642, but the Hogue Tamer grips really soak up recoil. This is a big deal for a lady shooter. Most do not like shooting a gun that hurts them.
Another thing is using very light recoiling ammunition for her to practice with. I normally reload soft shooting ammunition for this application.

Another Plus with the LCR 38 and 357 is the pinned on front sight. The XS 24/7 Standard Dot Tritium night sight is $60 and I installed mine in the shop in 10 minutes. If you have no tallent with tools I am sure you can find someone local who can install it for you.
NOTE: The XS 24/7 LCR sight will not work with the LCR 22. The 22 version front sight is .038 shorter. Hoping Bo Wallace at XS Sights will find a way to cure this. It would be nice to have your practice and carry LCR's equipped identical. I applied 4 coats of Green Sight Bright sight paint to the LCR 22 front sight. It is plenty visible for day time range work now.

The only problem I see with letting her shoot the LCR 22 is she may decide to carry it with CCI Stingers, instead of getting a 38/357 version.

In my opinion Ruger got it right with the 3 models of LCR's.

Bob

 

[Stayfrosty]

thanks Bob, I hadn't thought of the LCR---but will rent and shoot that one---thanks

 

[ArchAngelCD]

If you're going to consider the LCR then look at the S&W Bodyguard 38 too. (but I really like the M442 and M438)

 

[Indifferent]

I have a smith 642 and I had a Taurus 85... The Taurus honestly felt tighter then my smith in terms of fit and finish. The smith I think has a bit lighter trigger pull. Either one is adequate, I hear smiths hold their value better.

 

[MCgunner]

keeping your finger off the trigger often solves that problem.

Ever hear of Mr. Murphy? He works overtime with beginners.

 

[Stayfrosty]

Just as a slight side, if you like a shrouded hammer and decided you like the S&W revolver better you can get a shrouded hammer revolver from S&W. S&W has a J frame revolver with a Bodyguard frame (not the Bodyguard revolver) in the M438 and M638. Both are just as good as the M442 and M642. They weigh 15oz like the M442/M642 too.

We looked at those models with shrouded hammer, and well- you know how women's purses can be, they have so many things in there that the shrouded hammer is just one more thing to get snagged when she's going for a quick draw. Hopefully that won't be the case, and she'll carry on her person, not in the purse.

 

[MCgunner]

There are purses with holsters in separate holster compartments built in, however. A woman is always ready for a new purse, right?

 

[Stayfrosty]

I am with Haywood and Water Man try the Ruger LCR. I have owned a 638 for several years. I got it before the LCR 38 came out.
I now also have the Ruger LCR 22 and LCR 357, and I really like them.

When working with new lady shooters at the range, I like to start them with my S&W 617. It is a very user friendly platform. With no recoil a new shooter will get comfortable and accurate pretty quickly. After getting comfortable shooting the K Frame 22 I move them on to either my 4" 64 or my 4" 686 Power Custom Combat.
The LCR 22 will give them another option to try out a small carry gun with a good trigger, and no recoil. Again after getting comfortable with the LCR 22 one can move them on to a light 38 special load.

The LCR grips are a little bulkier than a 442/642, but the Hogue Tamer grips really soak up recoil. This is a big deal for a lady shooter. Most do not like shooting a gun that hurts them.
Another thing is using very light recoiling ammunition for her to practice with. I normally reload soft shooting ammunition for this application.

Another Plus with the LCR 38 and 357 is the pinned on front sight. The XS 24/7 Standard Dot Tritium night sight is $60 and I installed mine in the shop in 10 minutes. If you have no tallent with tools I am sure you can find someone local who can install it for you.
NOTE: The XS 24/7 LCR sight will not work with the LCR 22. The 22 version front sight is .038 shorter. Hoping Bo Wallace at XS Sights will find a way to cure this. It would be nice to have your practice and carry LCR's equipped identical. I applied 4 coats of Green Sight Bright sight paint to the LCR 22 front sight. It is plenty visible for day time range work now.

The only problem I see with letting her shoot the LCR 22 is she may decide to carry it with CCI Stingers, instead of getting a 38/357 version.

In my opinion Ruger got it right with the 3 models of LCR's.

Bob

Why are those Ruger LCR's more expensive than the SW 442/642? I saw all these at the Orlando gun show, the .38 Ruger LCR'S sold for $399- Firm, whereas the SW 442/642 have an MSRP of $449, but we're selling at the show for $359...? Is supply exceeding demand on the SW's versus the Ruger LCR?

 

[jahwarrior]

Hello All,

Wanted to get some inputs for a female carrying a CCW using either an SW-442/642 or the Taurus 85-UL?

Both guns weigh approx 15-16ozs each, SW is hammer less and Taurus is shrouded hammer? Thanks for your input.

Stayfrosty, did you even consider your wife's input? the biggest mistake men make when buying a gun for their wife or girlfirend is not asking them what they want to try in the first place. there's this logical disconnect that syas women are smaler than men, and therefore should like smaller guns. the truth is, lighter guns are NOT good for beginners, since the recoil with lightweight .38s is more noticeable than with a compact of full size 9mm. i've owned the 642, and recoil with self defense rounds was much harsher than shooting .45ACP through a 1911.

my own girlfriend started off with a revolver, which she didn't care for. she moved up to a Glock 19, which she liked a lot, and then a Springfield Armory GI model 1911, which she loves more than any gun. a bulk of her shooting experience is on the 1911 platform, which is her preference.

the revolver was the gun she was advised to get. the 1911 is the gun she chose on her own. let your wife make up her own mind. take her to the gun shop, shut up, and let her ask the questions. let her pick up different guns. remind her that the lighter the gun, the harder the recoil will be.

 

[Stayfrosty]

Hey Jah,
Funny you say that, we are heading back to the range tomorrow to fire off some Auto's. What does your lady friend think about panicking at the moment of action when using an auto--does she worry about jamming? That's a question on her mind. thanks

 

[jahwarrior]

Hey Jah,
Funny you say that, we are heading back to the range tomorrow to fire off some Auto's. What does your lady friend think about panicking at the moment of action when using an auto--does she worry about jamming? That's a question on her mind. thanks

my girlfriend doesn't worry about jamming, because her gun works fine. her 1911 has a over a thousand rounds through it of all types of ammo, and has yet to fail, and the Glock...is a Glock. show me a Glock 19 that jams up using factory ammo, and i'll show you a unicorn.

 

[MCgunner]

my girlfriend doesn't worry about jamming, because her gun works fine. her 1911 has a over a thousand rounds through it of all types of ammo, and has yet to fail, and the Glock...is a Glock. show me a Glock 19 that jams up using factory ammo, and i'll show you a unicorn.

I could show you TWO 1911s that would feed nothing, but ball even after I paid for polishing and porting. I COULD, but I got rid of the crap. Neither was that accurate, either. I swore off 1911s.