Recovered Revolver Balls

[arcticap]

Some may recall that I bought a used 1992 Armi San Marco
1851 .44 Navy Sheriff's Model that was already loaded.
I went to fire the balls out today and the old powder
loadings were anemic. Luckily they exited the barrel and
embedded into the thick foam target backing.
It doesn't look like they're still very round once they leave
the barrel. The forcing cone has some very pronounced lands
that these balls need to pass through which the pictures reflect.
While cleaning the gun I found the nipples were too frozen to
be removed, there was a minor amount of light to moderate pitting
mostly in the rifling grooves of the bore, and some minor
roughness in the chambers from oxidation. I'm sure glad that I
didn't need to pull a ball due to a misfire.
This revolver is for sale in TFL's Black Powder Buy, Sell Trade
Firearms & Accessories sub-forum:

http://thefiringline.com/forums/showthread.php?p=3108197#post3108197

 

[Donny]

I you were to keep it you could try soaking the cylinder in penetrating oil to free the nipples. But it sounds like you've given up on the gun at this point.

Don

 

[dispatch55126]

The nipples are frozen on my 1851 Navy so I ask you this question, "do you really need to remove them?". I can still adequately clean the chambers and have never thought the cylinders are toast because of this.

 

[1858rem]

i had a stuck nipple form the time i got my revolver, the gun was fine, figure if you can't wrench it off it sure isnt gonna back out when your shootin it. you could get a spare cylinder too if you could find one for that model an that'd resolve your problem too.

 

[BHP FAN]

Can I be third in line?

 

[grey8833]

Loved those pictures of the recovered balls!

 

[4v50 Gary]

How long was it loaded? Those balls don't seem to have any oxidation from being stuffed so long into the gun.

 

[BADUNAME37]

Neat!

 

[arcticap]

I'm not exactly sure how long it was loaded and put away in a pistol case, maybe years. The Bore Butter applied over the loaded balls had turned brownish.
Also, the balls got cleaned when I wiped the gooey lube off after gathering them. The camera flash could have also brightened their appearance.
I'm curious if the depth of the engraving rifling in the balls is normal?
Quickly measuring a few of the ball diameters across the engraved portions (which represent the barrel lands) seem to be .443, .4435, .445.
Measured from top to bottom the balls are ~.4625.

 

[mykeal]

Undersized balls - undersized with respect to what?

They look much the same, with respect to depth of grooves and striations as .457 balls I used to slug the barrels on three of my .44 cal revolvers (two 1860 Armys and one Ruger Old Army).

 

[dispatch55126]

Looks perfectly normal to me. I've recovered a few from a dirt mound and they looked like that.

 

[arcticap]

Aren't the lands and the bore diameter normally larger [looser] than the chambers and the loaded balls?
If so, why is the engraving on these balls so uniformly deep? Doesn't that mean that the balls are getting squeezed passing through a bore that's narrower than they are?
Isn't that [apparently slightly] the opposite from the norm though?

 

[oneiron]

They look like the balls I pushed through my barrel with the handle end of a shot gun cleaning rod. I see nothing wrong with them.

 

[Voodoochile]

Those balls are just slightly smaller than the actual grove diameter of the barrel.

The striations you see are the result of the lands as the ball is engraved by the rifling during firing or as they were pushed through the bore with a dowel & as you can see from the rear "powder side" of the ball the lands spots have a slight curl or push to the lead as it finished the engraving of the rifling.

The grove portion is not touched by the ball because the ball will also show some striations as it passes through the barrel & all I see is where the ball was loaded into the chambers.

Probably only .001 - .003 smaller chamber than the grove diameter but not bad.

 

[Hellgate]

Put penetrating oil (Liquid wrench) on the nipples from the chambers and from the tops so the threads get soaked. Leave it overnight. Put the cylinder in a PADDED vise (thick leather is good) and then take a nipple wrench to them. Select a nipple close to the vise jaw so the cylinder doesn't tip as you bear down on it. I have removed stuck nipples by first turning them a little to tighten them (without really tightening them) and then as I turn the wrench to remove them I tap the wrench with a small hammer. It is a twist as I taptaptaptaptaptaptap on the wrench. The tapping with a hammer can jar the rust and crud loose and free up the nipple. A high quality wrench is very helpful.

 

[mykeal]

The relationship of chamber, forcing cone and bore lands and grooves is an interesting topic. Ideally the chamber should be .001" larger than the grooves, and some feel there should be no difference between them. As to whether that's 'normal' is a matter of much debate, involving issues such as the quality control of various manufacturers.