Reloading 45/70

[gubowner]

I'm a bit confused, When I look up reloading charts I use the category for modern lever action rifles. The charts only mention the Marlin lever gun. I have a Winchester model 71 manufactured in 1946. (Yes it's chambered in 45/70 with a factory model 71 barrel.) Is it considered modern? I wonder why the Winchesters are not mentioned. I'm using IMR 4895.

 

[Charlie98]

Well, then it's not a Model 71, it's an 1886. If it's a 71 action, standard 'modern lever action' rules apply...

You got any pictures of that rifle?

 

[ArchAngelCD]

Manuals can't list every rifle made, especially rare chamberings. I can't prove the action strong enough but I have a feeling you won't want to shoot ammo at the top end anyway.

 

[gubowner]

Well, then it's not a Model 71, it's an 1886. If it's a 71 action, standard 'modern lever action' rules apply...

You got any pictures of that rifle?

 

[gubowner]

It's not a 1886 it is a 71. I posted pics several months ago.

ts.

 

[AJC1]

I would see if you can find any original paperwork that came with the rifle. That may give you some insight. A collector may also be a good source. Have you shot trapdoor loads and found them not acceptable for your needs. Gunblue did a review of the 45-70 where he discussed all 3 loadings and his findings were 150 fps on average from trapdoor to modern lever. I stay in the TD loadings with my modern marlin, because I shoot a lot for fun. Are you hunting bear or dangerous animals?

 

[Charlie98]

Calm down... I was just funning. But what I said was true... standard 'lever action' rules apply.

 

[gubowner]

I'm a target shooter, mostly steel. I reload to moderate pressures, no full power for me.

 

[AJC1]

I'm a target shooter, mostly steel. I reload to moderate pressures, no full power for me.

Have you used trail boss? A 385 bullet behind trailboss will take down a ram every time at 200.

 

[gubowner]

Calm down... I was just funning. But what I said was true... standard 'lever action' rules apply.

Not upset at al,l didn't mean to sound angry. Sorry, I did post a picture of the barrel roll marks. It's a odd duck, but a great shooter. Unfortunately I can't get any info from Winchester or the Cody museum.

 

[Charlie98]

BTW... my reference is... I have a Browning 71 in .348. It's a very strong action. I also owned a Browning 1886... for the Miroku/Brownings, same-same.

Depending on what bullet you choose, IMR4895 will work, but it may produce some significant recoil... along with reasonable velocity, at least for a .45-70. I shoot only steel meself with my 71, I use cast bullets loaded over IMR3031 or IMR4198 (or AA5744.) IMR4895 produces hunting velocity loads.

Same with the .45-70.... cast bullets over IMR4198 (or AA5744) or even IMR4227.

 

[gubowner]

Have you used trail boss? A 385 bullet behind trailboss will take down a ram every time at 200.

I will make a note and try it after using my 405 cast boolits.

 

[MEHavey]

Winchester Model 71
"...A slightly modified version of the Browning designed Winchester Model 1886,
it was only chambered for the .348 Winchester round; except for an extremely rare
45-70 Government and .33 WCF...."

(ahem...)



"...loyal following for what is arguably "the finest big bore lever gun that has ever been"

 

[Charlie98]

I will make a note and try it after using my 405 cast boolits.

Personally, I use IMR4198 with both 385 and 405grn .45-70 bullets. I've gotten out to 700yds easy with that powder.

Does your rifle have a half-magazine? Sorry, I missed your previous post on it.

 

[troy fairweather]

Your shoulder will give out be for that 71 will, trapdoor loads are fun, I like to use trailboss as well.

 

[gubowner]

BTW... my reference is... I have a Browning 71 in .348. It's a very strong action. I also owned a Browning 1886... for the Miroku/Brownings, same-same.

Depending on what bullet you choose, IMR4895 will work, but it may produce some significant recoil... along with reasonable velocity, at least for a .45-70. I shoot only steel meself with my 71, I use cast bullets loaded over IMR3031 or IMR4198 (or AA5744.) IMR4895 produces hunting velocity loads.

Same with the .45-70.... cast bullets over IMR4198 (or AA5744) or even IMR4227.

Thanks for the info. I will try the other IMR powders to soften the recoil. I also have a Browning 1886 in 45/70 (beautiful gun). I'm always looking for quality lever guns in 45/70.

 

[gubowner]

Personally, I use IMR4198 with both 385 and 405grn .45-70 bullets. I've gotten out to 700yds easy with that powder.

Does your rifle have a half-magazine? Sorry, I missed your previous post on it.

Yes it has a half magazine. I did talk to the old guy at Winchester and he told me it could have been special ordered but all records for the 71 are gone so he couldn't verify it.

 

[Charlie98]

My current reference for .45-70 is a single-shot Pedersoli 1885, but I owned a Marlin 1895 previously, too. Starting 'lever-action' loads with IMR3031, 4895, and 4064 and a 350grn bullet were punishing. So much so, that I actually pulled over 100 cartridges rather than just shoot them up... I would rather have a root canal without anesthesia over pulling bullets. Just saying. I really think, based on my experience shooting cast bullets at steel over distance, that a powder in the IMR4198 range is the way to go. That is not to say Unique, TrailBoss, and 2400 aren't avenues as well, or reduced charges with something like IMR3031 or H4895 (Hodgdon provides reduced loads with H4895 specifically...) Just my .02 worth.

BTW, you have yourself quite a rifle there. Good job!

 

[AJC1]

My current reference for .45-70 is a single-shot Pedersoli 1885, but I owned a Marlin 1895 previously, too. Starting 'lever-action' loads with IMR3031, 4895, and 4064 and a 350grn bullet were punishing. So much so, that I actually pulled over 100 cartridges rather than just shoot them up... I would rather have a root canal without anesthesia over pulling bullets. Just saying. I really think, based on my experience shooting cast bullets at steel over distance, that a powder in the IMR4198 range is the way to go. That is not to say Unique, TrailBoss, and 2400 aren't avenues as well, or reduced charges with something like IMR3031 or H4895 (Hodgdon provides reduced loads with H4895 specifically...) Just my .02 worth.

BTW, you have yourself quite a rifle there. Good job!

I have plans to try the 2400, and even some 4227 loads. Trail boss is just so nice...

 

[Old Stumpy]

My Lyman 48th Reloading manual has three loads categories for .45-70:
1873 Springfield, 1886 Winchester and 1895 Marlin only, and Ruger #1and #3 only.
No mention of replicas or dates of manufacture.
Loads are limited to 28,000 CUP maximum for the 1886 and 1895 category.

A load considered maximum for this category lists a 405 JSP at 1702 FPS with IMR-3031 (26,200 CUP)
No listings for IMR-4895, just H-4895.

Your modern Model 71 should handle this easily.

 

[troy fairweather]

Some 45/70 shooter have a 4th class of loads. They can over all some 458wm loads.