Reloading misconceptions.

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Lol, "boutique hunting". Funny you call it that....it's just the way it is in AZ. We have literally people all over the world applying for our Elk hunts... I get drawn for the archery bull hunt maybe once every ten years. If you're wondering why it's so hard to get drawn for elk in AZ......take a look at the Pope and Young top 50... I don't chase horns, and am perfectly happy taking a raghorn as I am a 6x6......but at powerball level odds......just can't get the opportunity. We can take only one deer or one elk a year.....and that's only if we get drawn. We don't have a feral pig population, javelina taste like crap and are draw also.......if I want to hunt, it's going to be expensive. The only cheap and easy hunt here is coyote.......lol, but even the buzzards won't eat a coyote. I've visited other states with friends and family to hunt......and yeah, different ball game...here, anybody telling you in AZ that they are saving grocery money by hunting is either poaching, or a liar.
I got an uncle who retired from the Navy to AZ - said he was sick of being surrounded by water and Merritt Island was basically just like living on an aircraft carrier but with less to do. He drives down to TX to hunt and sometimes goes down into Mexico. His wife is a Mexican citizen so somehow it works out. He never invites me because I just don't cotton to hunting Javelina either. You're right, they taste like wormy possum.
I said it was a misconception that nobody save money hunting. It sure is! Some of us who have jobs with mandatory paid leave time actually make a little hunting. I also said it was a misconception - the TOPIC is misconceptions, right? ;) - that handloading never saves. Surely it does! Compare the price of box ammo to reloads and it's pretty obvious. Also, compare the price of a whole elk - butchered and packaged - from your local grocery store's meat department to what you pay to hunt your own. You obviously CAN buy a whole elk at the local meat grocer (I see them using elk and bison and farm-raised "wild boar" - which is just strange to me - on TV cooking shows all the time).
 
I "could" shoot deer everyday on my property and save grocery money.....but I'd be poaching;-( We have no process for harvesting big game on our own property for nuisance control
Well dang! Time to move! That's just stupid. Whoever wrote that law needs to be hanged and put somebody in office who'll overturn it because that's just unAmerican. Can't hunt your own land or it's poaching? That's weird. Sorry but, now I see why folks are moving in hoards to Florida, Texas and Alabama. We've even got a little mini-invasion of Texans going on according to the population mechanics folks at the university. Used to be we always saw tags from up Nawth but lately I'm seeing tags from out west, too.
 
I have to drive an hour to shop at Fry's, 2 for cosco. I live on 10 acres in BFE...I "could" shoot deer everyday on my property and save grocery money.....but I'd be poaching;-( We have no process for harvesting big game on our own property for nuisance control...still can only take one deer a year.
I think you can shoot one a day in Tennessee
 
Well dang! Time to move! That's just stupid. Whoever wrote that law needs to be hanged and put somebody in office who'll overturn it because that's just unAmerican. Can't hunt your own land or it's poaching? That's weird. Sorry but, now I see why folks are moving in hoards to Florida, Texas and Alabama. We've even got a little mini-invasion of Texans going on according to the population mechanics folks at the university. Used to be we always saw tags from up Nawth but lately I'm seeing tags from out west, too.

Well, I can see why they do that......there'd shortly be no deer, lol. We don't have a lot down south. Of course, having 5K square foot home with an indoor pool, a 8K sq foot steel shop with a finished apartment (my reloading "room") above it, and two full bays large enough to park 18 wheelers in, a vehicle lift, a partially indoor range, a 3K sq foot green house with mature lemon, grapefruit, apricot, and orange trees in it, 1500 sq feet of raised and irrigated garden beds, and a pond, on 10acres........all for 350K is why I don't move to Florida. Plus humidity sucks.
 
Well dang! Time to move! That's just stupid. Whoever wrote that law needs to be hanged and put somebody in office who'll overturn it because that's just unAmerican. Can't hunt your own land or it's poaching? That's weird. Sorry but, now I see why folks are moving in hoards to Florida, Texas and Alabama. We've even got a little mini-invasion of Texans going on according to the population mechanics folks at the university. Used to be we always saw tags from up Nawth but lately I'm seeing tags from out west, too.
I think he was saying taking more than one deer from his property in a year would be poaching.
 
I had a buddy who shot six gun competitions with two match 686s and he would literally mix whatever batches of H110 and 296 he had, mix them together, and just keep his hopper full of the mix for months at a time. Shooting, reloading, shooting, reloading ... all pre-pandemic of course but he always assumed what you just suggested ... it all comes down to batches. I dunno, makes sense.
If, as the manufacturer states, H110 and W296 are the same powder, why is there a $6/pound difference in price? Not questioning the assertion they are the same, just wondering what the marketing principle is here.
 
Fascinating discussion re: hunting. Here in the people’s republic of Fairfax (1 million+ population straddling the beltway) we have a significant deer population/problem and a registered bow hunter deer management program.

Registered hunters (using a tree stand only) can hunt in backyards with homeowners’ permission or at their request during the designated “season.” Mostly this is done adjacent to streams and parkland and not spur of the moment—must be scheduled in advance.

I frequently have deer in my backyard devouring my azaleas and hostas. Have seen a seven point buck, yesterday just four large doe eating an azalea salad. Unfortunately it’s not hunting season and if I dared “hunt” them (if I had a bow) I’d be locked up quicker than a smash and grabber at Louis Vuitton.
 
Fascinating discussion re: hunting. Here in the people’s republic of Fairfax (1 million+ population straddling the beltway) we have a significant deer population/problem and a registered bow hunter deer management program.

Registered hunters (using a tree stand only) can hunt in backyards with homeowners’ permission or at their request during the designated “season.” Mostly this is done adjacent to streams and parkland and not spur of the moment—must be scheduled in advance.

I frequently have deer in my backyard devouring my azaleas and hostas. Have seen a seven point buck, yesterday just four large doe eating an azalea salad. Unfortunately it’s not hunting season and if I dared “hunt” them (if I had a bow) I’d be locked up quicker than a smash and grabber at Louis Vuitton.
Love your Smash & Grab analogy to hunting prison time. For people who never seen a S&G, it’s very quick and violent. Don’t be a hero, just walk away fast
 
My response was to buy shooters world heavy pistol
I think some of our accepted "this powder is just like that one" verses are really reloading misconceptions. Accurate No. 9 and Shooters World Heavy Pistol/Lovex D037-02 are "comparable," not the same and definitely neither one is the same as Ramshot Enforcer/Accurate 4100 or even really comparable in a practical sense. Now, thing is, if we follow the rule of road - "when changing any major component, always drop back to a listed starting load and work up..." - then hoe comparable or near identical gets to be almost unimportant. But I've seen way too many questions recently about swapping powders and starting with people's "pet" loads that exceed published maximums. Its a misconception that different powders - even when they're "the same powder" - are interchangeable. Or am I picking nits, now? o_O:cuss:
 
I think some of our accepted "this powder is just like that one" verses are really reloading misconceptions. Accurate No. 9 and Shooters World Heavy Pistol/Lovex D037-02 are "comparable," not the same and definitely neither one is the same as Ramshot Enforcer/Accurate 4100 or even really comparable in a practical sense. Now, thing is, if we follow the rule of road - "when changing any major component, always drop back to a listed starting load and work up..." - then hoe comparable or near identical gets to be almost unimportant. But I've seen way too many questions recently about swapping powders and starting with people's "pet" loads that exceed published maximums. Its a misconception that different powders - even when they're "the same powder" - are interchangeable. Or am I picking nits, now? o_O:cuss:
If never loaded sw hp yet but for the about the same burn rate for 33% less I'll work up a new load.
 
I think some of our accepted "this powder is just like that one" verses are really reloading misconceptions. Accurate No. 9 and Shooters World Heavy Pistol/Lovex D037-02 are "comparable," not the same and definitely neither one is the same as Ramshot Enforcer/Accurate 4100 or even really comparable in a practical sense. Now, thing is, if we follow the rule of road - "when changing any major component, always drop back to a listed starting load and work up..." - then hoe comparable or near identical gets to be almost unimportant. But I've seen way too many questions recently about swapping powders and starting with people's "pet" loads that exceed published maximums. Its a misconception that different powders - even when they're "the same powder" - are interchangeable. Or am I picking nits, now? o_O:cuss:

Lovex D037.02 and Heavy Pistol is the same powder. Shooter's world get's it in bulk containers labeled D037.02, takes it out, and packages it as Heavy Pistol for their consumer cannister powder business. If you work with SW's OEM side, you won't get these powders labled with the SW names....you'll get bulk Lovex names. In fact, they will make a point of this...if you're a retailer, you buy consumer labeled cannisters, if you are an OEM, you get Lovex labeled jugs. This is also the same powder that ***was*** AA#9 prior to the Western Powders contract moving to General Dynamics. Certainly there is some drift in the ensuing years, no different that if you compare a lot from a decade ago to a lot today of any brand....and when you look at a current batch AA#9 and Heavy Pistol, you'll see a different color......but GD makes it to the same spec as Lovex makes it......and the load data works up exactly the same in my guns. If you are willing to buy enough, you can also buy most of the AA powders direct from GD, and they will be called something else entirely.

When talking powder similarities, there are two considerations......is the specification the same used to produce it...IE, AA9, and SW Heavy Pistol are made to the same specification by two different companies and the load data is the same.......and secondly, can it be mixed (tailed). These aren't always the same answer.....a powder can be the same or very close spec, but not tailable, or not tailable by anyone sane I should add. I personally would NEVER tail AA9 and Heavy Pistol. They are the same spec.....but different plants, countries, QA process, storage process, different sources of nitro cellulose, etc, they do share the same load data however. I would also confirm the same load behaved as expected, if I had batches of both ( I don't, I see no reason to pay 2x more for the same thing). Win296 and H110 as a another example, ARE the same powder, not two different powders made to the same spec, but the same powder, made in the same plant, by the same people, on the same equipment, using the same ingredients...and are completely tailable, and regularly tailed by many many shooters and have been for many years, and Hodgdon support will tell you they are the same powder as well. So if you don't tail powders, then it doesn't really matter......but if you tail H110 regularly......there is no reason at all not to tail W296 with it, if you have cannisters of both.

I'll also add, if you work up a new load because you used up the 10lb Jug of Unique you bought 10 years ago, and you just bought another 10lb jug you'll use over the next 10 years......then by all means, completely redo your loads switching from AA2 to Cleanshot. If however, you crack that new jug and load up a batch using your tried and trued load you've been using for a decade.....then you might as well use the same load data from a jug of AA2 that you've been using for Cleanshot....because your variance is going to be about the same..spec is spec.....whether it's the same brand 10 years later, or the same spec made in two places. Sure, we all know guys who rework an entire load for a new lot of powder, and if you load low volume, or you are always on that Elmer Keith edge, then that's what you do.......but a high volume loader, using standard loads.....he ain't gonna do that. He'll shot a sample batch, and verify it's the same quality as his past ammo, and shooting to the same POI, with the same velocities and performance (if he's smart, he's always doing that all the time), but he's not going to start over.
 
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Misconception pet peeve;
"If it ain't cheaper than white box ammo from the box store, it ain't worth reloading." Totally ignores the quality to cost factor and the pride of craftsmanship.

"You should include the cost of your time in your reloaded ammo." In other words, a lawyer's reloads are worth many times more than a fry cook's ammo or, your 3-over par golf game is worth $200 per hour while my 1-over par golf game is only worth $20 per hour.

All I know is, wild game killed with my reloads tastes better than game killed with factory fodder.
 
Misconception pet peeve;
"If it ain't cheaper than white box ammo from the box store, it ain't worth reloading." Totally ignores the quality to cost factor and the pride of craftsmanship.

"You should include the cost of your time in your reloaded ammo." In other words, a lawyer's reloads are worth many times more than a fry cook's ammo or, your 3-over par golf game is worth $200 per hour while my 1-over par golf game is only worth $20 per hour.

All I know is, wild game killed with my reloads tastes better than game killed with factory fodder.
my time is worth $500/hour but I can only get $12.25/hour
 
I think some of our accepted "this powder is just like that one" verses are really reloading misconceptions. Accurate No. 9 and Shooters World Heavy Pistol/Lovex D037-02 are "comparable," not the same and definitely neither one is the same as Ramshot Enforcer/Accurate 4100 or even really comparable in a practical sense. Now, thing is, if we follow the rule of road - "when changing any major component, always drop back to a listed starting load and work up..." - then hoe comparable or near identical gets to be almost unimportant. But I've seen way too many questions recently about swapping powders and starting with people's "pet" loads that exceed published maximums. Its a misconception that different powders - even when they're "the same powder" - are interchangeable. Or am I picking nits, now? o_O:cuss:

I was told that the reason everything powder related is falling inline at higher prices is because Hogdgon controls it all these days. Big corporate monopoly type control. No different than any other big corporation publicly traded monopolies are concerned.

I'm going by memory here, which means I am probably about to make a mistake, but off the top of my head doesn't Hogdgon now own IMR, Western, Accurate, Ramshot ... maybe another whose name escapes me at the moment. Plus a black powder provider I think they just drov'em out of business and shut the plant down .... they are the cerebus (Remington) of the powder business.

It's not a pleasant realization. It will not end well for any of us concerned. How many independents are remaining and how much is still being produced in this country?

Edited: big thumbs, bad grammar lol "**** the plant down ..." lol
 
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I was told that the reason everything powder related is falling inline at higher prices is because Hogdgon controls it all these days. Big corporate monopoly type control. No different than any other big corporation publicly traded monopolies are concerned.

I'm going by memory here, which means I am probably about to make a mistake, but off the top of my head doesn't Hogdgon now own IMR, Western, Accurate, Ramshot ... maybe another whose name escapes me at the moment. Plus a black powder provider I think they just drovem9ut of business and **** the plant down .... they are the cerebus (Remington) of the powder business.

It's not a pleasant realization. It will not end well for any of us concerned. How many independents are remaining and how much is still being produced in this country?
Monopolies and greed are the death of anything. Throw in corruption and we have corporate birthdays party
 
I was told that the reason everything powder related is falling inline at higher prices is because Hogdgon controls it all these days. Big corporate monopoly type control. No different than any other big corporation publicly traded monopolies are concerned.

I'm going by memory here, which means I am probably about to make a mistake, but off the top of my head doesn't Hogdgon now own IMR, Western, Accurate, Ramshot ... maybe another whose name escapes me at the moment. Plus a black powder provider I think they just drovem9ut of business and **** the plant down .... they are the cerebus (Remington) of the powder business.

It's not a pleasant realization. It will not end well for any of us concerned. How many independents are remaining and how much is still being produced in this country?

Globally Hodgdon isn't that big of a factor, and while they own a lot of US brands.....they don't own the production facilities that supply the powder for most of those labels. Until recently, Hodgdon didn't actually own any production facilities, I think that's only happened in the last decade with some of their acquisitions. Lots of Hodgdon powders come from plants all over the world, some of their most popular powders come out of a plant in Australia which was forced to shut down for a while during the pandemic. The biggest factor affecting smokeless powder was a global nitrocellulose shortage beginning in 2019. Note: NC is also used in other areas, notably Covid testing kits. Both General Dynamics and Explosia reported idled powder plants because of interrupted NC supplies. Other raw element shortages have impacted a LOT of areas relating to shooting.......copper, zinc, lead have all gone up several hundred percent, and shortages impacted brass companies, primer companies. If you can't get NC, you can't make powder. If you can't get the raw material for NC, you can't make powder, if you can't get copper, you can't make brass. If you don't have these things, your production idles. If you want to make product, you HAVE to pay market rate for the raw materials, and you're competing globally for an in demand product in a classic case of demand exceeding current supply, and unfortunately, that has to be passed on to the consumers. To compound matters, when you price products right now, you can't price based on what it cost you to buy supplies last week, you have to price them to cover your best guess on what supplies will cost next week...which contributes to inflation cycle. We're bumping 7.5% inflation economy wide in the US now.......certainly has nothing to do with Hodgdon.........everything is more expensive, and will likely not start coming down for a while. Last week, I got cold offered 55K for my 2018 Ram 2500, which was 10K over what I paid for it new 4 years ago! Did I sell it? Nope.....because It would likely cost far more to replace it, if I could find a replacement. Sign up for your "free" covid test kits? Guess what, that contributed to the NC shortage, and the high cost of powder. Just sayin'.
 
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