Removing lead from bore

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Captain Capsize

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I just read the thread on this subject and am puzzled as to why no one has mentioned the easiest way to do this. I use it on all my firearms and find no harmful effects from it.

A 50-50 mix of white vinegar and hydrogen peroxide, plug the bore with a rubber stopper, pour into the chamber carefully, let soak for 5 minutes, drain, swab with clean patches a few times, lead is gone, run a few water wet patches through, run a oiled patch through the bore, done. Can reuse the solution many times. Am careful not to get on bluing, don't know what would happen, don't care to find out.

Criticisms welcome.
 
That mixture creates peracetic acid , which, as you say, does a good job removing lead. However, be very careful of the post cleaning waste fluids - it will contain lead oxides that can be absorbed by skin and are the most dangerous source of lead poisoning.
 
Actually, "The Dip" was alluded to in that other thread, but no one brought it up because cleaning a barrel with it is sorta like getting rid of the ants around your house with TNT.

"The Dip" creates Lead Acetate, which unlike regular lead, is water soluble and can easily pass through human skin. It must be either disposed of as hazardous waste or chemically converted back to lead before disposal.

Believe me, the LEAST of your worries is any damage it'll do to your blueing. It can mess up an adult pretty quickly and permanently destroy a child's brain with one heavy exposure, the solution is also said to be sweet tasting. Lead Acetate is also known as "Sugar of Lead".
I have used it occasionally to clean stainless steel, inconel and titanium suppressors, but I wear full protective gear and turn in the resulting solution as hazardous material.
My understanding is that it should never be used on regular carbon steel since the acid can etch the steel.

In the interest of safety, you should probably inform people of the hazards of using any product or process you recommend.
 
a simpler and safer way to remove leading is to simply wrap some strands of copper "chore boy" scrub pads around a appropriate for caliber brass bristle brush and swab the bore several times.it works very well.

it may be hard to find the actuall copper scrub pads.some are copper plated steel which yu do not want.i got a lifetime supply off ebay for like 12 bucks.
 
+1 on ridgerunner1965's chore boy method. As someone who has dealt with lead poisoning... trust me, It isn't worth it.
 
I mentioned it in the other thread but did not give the formula for a good reason.

I am afraid someone will use it incorrectly (as in leave it in to long) and put it in their barrel and destroy an expensive gun.:rolleyes::eek:

It was used for smooth bore cannons.

If someone does make some, drop a lead bullet in it and leave it. The bullet will eventually dissolve and disappear.

Consider yourselves warned and use at your own risk.
 
Thanks for the tips gents. I use it very carefully and infrequently and only on my pistol barrels. What I was fishing for was exactly what I got. Confirmation that it produces dangerous by products. I have used the Choreboy/brush method with poor results that is why I went to the vinegar/h202 concoction.
 
I have used the Choreboy/brush method with poor results
Click to expand...

Sorry to hear that.
My method is to clean the gun normally - Hoppe's #9 on a bore brush.
Run dry cleaning patches thru til it comes out clean.

Then run a mop with copper stranded around it maybe 6-7 times.
Run a dry patch thru.
Using a bore light check again.
That almost always gets the job done.

Once in a great while I have to repeat.

Just make sure the copper stranded mop/brush has a very tight fit.
If it's loose it won't help.
 
I don't know anything about using a 50-50 mix of white vinegar and hydrogen peroxide in your barrel but I do know of a very easy way to remove lead if you get it.

An old-timer told me a very long time ago I can use any commercial solvent that removes copper to also remove lead. He said the solvent works by getting under the contaminating metal which loosens it enough to be swabbed away. He said the solvent doesn't care which metal is in the barrel, it works just as well against lead. All I know is, on the rare occasions I do get leading in a barrel I let lead removing solvent soak in the barrel for an hour or two and all is well. I used to use a solvent with a copper remover before I knew about lead specific removers and it worked just like the old-timer told me it would.

No muss, no fuss, no added expense and no possible damage to the barrel. Quick and easy IMO.
 
I run one patch with Hoppes to get the loose stuff out. I then run a patch of Remington 40-x bore cleaner and let it sit 10 minutes. A clean patch then a bore brush soaked in Hoppes a few times. A clean patch and no more lead.
 
I use the 50/50 a lot. A few things...

1. Stainless only. Keep it off carbon steel and definitely keep it away from aluminum. Kinda sucks for those of us with aluminum-bodied suppressors, but them's the breaks.

2. Verify your exit strategy. Do not pour the spent solution down the drain or out in the back yard. Dispose of it properly. If you don't have a way to dispose of it properly, use another method. Don't be that guy. (If your county or city has a househould hazwaste disposal facility, start with them. If they won't take it, they will probably know who will.)

3. Personally, I only use my solution once - it's cheap enough that there's little reason to recycle it. Everything that needs to have lead removed goes in to one plastic container with solution. I don't plug bores or chambers - everything goes in and sits for a bit. Anything that needs to be wiped off or patched out receives that treatment over that container, as those are all hazwaste as well. The final step is a spritzing with water (again, over the container) to remove any lead acetate residue. After that, the container gets dumped into the five gallon bucket and the lid firmly applied, as I don't want this crap lying around. The bucket is properly labeled as lead waste.

4. PPE. I've read horror stories in other places about how some people use this stuff. Work in a safe place (ideally over a disposable, impermeable surface) and wear gloves at a bare minimum. Don't bare-hand it. When you're done, the gloves go into the hazwaste receptacle, not the trash can.

5. Respect what you're working with. Yeah, I'm perhaps overly cautious, but that may be because of what I do for a living. As one poster already mentioned, lead poisoning sucks. Lead acetate is a good way to receive a significant lead dose. I use the Dip, so I won't tell you not to, but I'd strongly urge you to do it correctly - especially if there are children in the house. (It might be time to get that tumbler away from the little ones as well.) Elemental lead isn't particularly dangerous, but when we make it soluable like this, we can get into trouble quickly.
 
A better solution is not to cause leading in the first place. By using cast bullets that are the proper diameter for your individual barrel, and the right hardness for the velocity you use, you can avoid the whole problem.

In a nutshell, leading occurs when the expanding gases are able to "cut" between the bullet and the surface of the bore; this melts the lead and deposits in in streaks down the barrel. A softer allow is sometimes better than a hard one, because it allows the bullet to obdurate, and seal itself tightly against the wall of the barrel. Slugging the barrel can help to identify if the bore is a thousandth or two over or under nominal for the caliber.

There's some good technical guidance on this subject here:

https://www.missouribullet.com/technical.php
 
Just read this thread and the plunk test thread, very helpful stuff.

Bought a "copper cleaner" in the past, don't remember brand, instructions say bore only, so I can assume this will work?
 
http://www.lasc.us/Fryxell_Book_Chapter_7_Leading.htm

Another reccomendation I recently read on castboolits.gunloads.com is to take an old coper bore brush that has a loose fit and is kind of wore out for that caliber. Use a single wrap of cotton patch around the brush (Or more to get a good tight fit), then wrap your chore boy around the patch. This gives a much tighter fit and is easier to remove the leading.
They also reccomended getting the stainless steel sponges to use if you cannot find the pure copper chore boy sponges. The stainless steel will not damage the barrel.
 
I have an unfortunately large supply of "moly" coated lead bullets whose coating does not prevent leading of my barrels. I have tried most of the products and techniques recommended here and other gunboards EXCEPT the H2O2 + CH3COOH "dip."
I haven't found anything to work really well, although I have not used Wipe Out brand "Lead Out" solvent enough to be sure.

I recall an old gunzine article on the use of plain vinegar, without the peroxide, to remove leading. The author was working from old accounts of cleaning leaded muzzleloaders with a then-common product. I'll try that before souping up the acetic acid with peroxide. It is still going to produce a lead acetate solution, so I will have to handle and dispose carefully.
 
This got me concerned about the vinegar solution I have used to clean brass. Does anyone know if vinegar (without hydrogen peroxide) mixed with lead will produce lead acetate? From Wikipedia, which obviously isn't exhaustive, it appears the hydrogen peroxide is necessary. What do you think?
 
Jim Watson said:
I have an unfortunately large supply of "moly" coated lead bullets whose coating does not prevent leading of my barrels. I have tried most of the products and techniques recommended here and other gunboards EXCEPT the H2O2 + CH3COOH "dip."
I haven't found anything to work really well, although I have not used Wipe Out brand "Lead Out" solvent enough to be sure.

I recall an old gunzine article on the use of plain vinegar, without the peroxide, to remove leading. The author was working from old accounts of cleaning leaded muzzleloaders with a then-common product. I'll try that before souping up the acetic acid with peroxide. It is still going to produce a lead acetate solution, so I will have to handle and dispose carefully.
Click to expand...
Jim,
You can always go back to the old time tested method of using Mercury to remove the lead from your barrel. Mercury is much less dangerous than lead acetate...
 
Cump said:
This got me concerned about the vinegar solution I have used to clean brass. Does anyone know if vinegar (without hydrogen peroxide) mixed with lead will produce lead acetate? From Wikipedia, which obviously isn't exhaustive, it appears the hydrogen peroxide is necessary. What do you think?
Click to expand...
In theory, yes but the process takes a longer period of time. I still would not get any of the solution on my hands. Primers contain lead stearate which, although it is not soluble in water, it can be in alcohol or acids or bases (like acetone). I am not sure if it is soluble in vinegar or not but many things that are soluble in acetone are soluble in vinegar.

acetone is CH3COCH3
Vinegar is CH3COOH

You did give me something to find out though:)

Here is a short story version of lead+vinegar:
http://www.ehow.com/how_8709467_make-lead-acetate.html
 
I have heard of using Kroil penetrating oil. It's said to work its way between the lead and steel to free up the leading. Not sure if you have to give it time to work or not.

Somewhat controversial is also the use of jacketed FMJ to shoot out some or all of the lead. I've had pretty good luck with this in polygonal pistol barrels in terms of keeping leading in check. Less so with conventional rifling. Some people say it will KB your gun, ring your barrel, or make the sun explode. Proceed at your own risk.
 
Thanks, I've learned a lot from you all. After reading this as suggested :

http://http://www.lasc.us/Fryxell_Book_Chapter_7_Leading.htm

it looked like maybe the debris was lube, though not sure why it didn't come out the first time with a bore snake and some ammonia to clean the bore snake (Am I creating a dangerous chemical using ammonia?).

2 nights ago I left Breakfree CLP in overnight and last evening everything cleaned out with a cotton patch. I'm guessing the debris was probably not lead because that was too easy.
 
I have a .357 revolver that leads badly. I use a gizmo called a Lewis Lead Remover. It consists of an expandable cone shaped washer on a cleaning rod covered with brass screen. A couple or three passes and the lead is gone.
 
not sure why it didn't come out the first time with a bore snake
Click to expand...
Well, there's your problem!!

Get a good cleaning rod, solvent, bronze bore brush, and a jag & patches.

It's the time-proven method of cleaning guns.

Bore-Snakes are not.
And don't.

rc
 
Shooter's Choice Lead Remover.
Followed by lead wipe-away cloth (the yellow tacky cloth)

what lead?
what hazardous by-products?
what junior chemistry setup?
 
I just shoot out the lead with jacketed bullets. Around 12 jacketed removes most of the lead. Sometimes it takes more.
 
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