Run in with TSA today

[frankge]

Traveling back to Tampa from Atlanta had a "difference" with TSA while checking in with my G36.

I keep it in a locked metal container meant for a firearm. It was in my soft suitcase which was not locked. He stated that I had to have the suitcase locked also. I politely differed with him and while he called the supervisor I opened up my laptop with aircard and pulled up the TSA website.

I said that I travel all the time and always check my firearm in the same manner. She said maybe that how other airports did it. I stated that I'm in Atlanta every week and never had an issue.

She also stated "it" had to be locked. I politely differed with her and asked to see the rulebook. She said I couldn't see it but the agent would read it to me. He rambled through the paragraph not doing very well, I asked to see it, he showed me, saw where it said "locked hardcover case in with checked baggage". Then the supervisor said I couldnt see it and I asked her to read the three conditions.

1. Hardcase for firearms locked and checked spearately
2. Hardcase locked inside checked luggage.
3. unlocked case inside hard, locked suitcase checked.

Needless to say I was a little concerned having to stand my ground with TSA but quite frankly I've seen them in operation enough where I know they are not the most educated folks on thier jobs. Anyway, away I went with no ruffled feathers on either side.

 

[ny32182]

I've been through ATL with no trouble; just depends who you get I guess? This was TSA, not airline employees talking about airline policy?

 

[Sheldon J]

Read this a while back, some of our US military were on a return flight with their weapons, sans ammo, they (TSA) stopped one solder for.... get ready for it..... nail clipers.....

 

[frankge]

Yep TSA, I was extremely nice but stood my ground. He said that baggage might take the gun - I could have pointed out thats a TSA/Airport Security issue and I'd recieve a new one - but thats not the way

 

[Oyeboten]

Yes, this happened to me also, very similar condition.

In my instance, I had a Locked ( big Pad Lock on heavy Hasp ) Foot Locker as Check-in-Baggage, within which, was an unlocked snap latch Hardcase with my unloaded Revolver in it.


TSA had a conniption fit because the Revolver was not in it's own 'Locked Box' redundant to the secure Pad Locked 'Luggage' itself.

I felt that what was happening, was emotional, low level, relatively unintelligent personel, over-hamming their assertions in order to impress a Boss or to buy insurance against fault being found with them for 'missing something'.

I played it with basic sincere open-ness, and sympathy for their concern, and, with easy going respect handed them the print outs from the TSA sight, which had the guidelines.


A supervisor was called, and, in two seconds, the matter was settled upon acceptance of my Foot Locker and it's heavy Hasp and Padlock, being perfectly alright for containing the unlocked, snap-latch Hard Case, in which the Revolver was packaged.


I understand the 'levels' of personel, and or the ways things work generally in administrative systems.


Which includes the quality of intelligence usually found in those who insinuate themselves into such systems, for succour.


One must be prepared for handling these sorts of things...ideally, in a way which does not disrespect the dogmatic zeal and usual unstable emotional conditions of those personnel who may over-assert an incorrect interpretation of 'the rules'.


After that, I elected to have a redundant Baggage condition, in which the Revolver is in a Steel Locked Box, within a larger, very stout, conspicuously Pad Locked Check-In Baggage container.

So far, this has been met with very positively, especially with my presentation of it, in the 'inspection' ritual...and, of course, it eliminates what otherwise appear to be the inconvenient ambiguity in the minds of the initial personnel who are charged with evaluating the condition.


When I present this condition, I also state that it is intentionally redundant, and present the Print-Outs from the TSA Web Site, and, I make it clear that the TSA Rules only require that the outer Luggage item be "locked", ( in order to in-effect, as an incidental, contribute if possible to the improvement of the peronnel's understanding as well).


I hate hassles!

I do not like missing a flight, either!


Lol...

 

[royal barnes]

It doesn't make any difference to me what the rules say. It would appear to be just common sense to lock the soft suitcase as well as the gun case. Why even make an issue of it?

 

[BADUNAME37]

Wow, I was not aware I could take one of my weapons to another state - checked in luggage! I could easily find a locked metal box and a larger box with another lock! Do you check your ammo in your luggage going into the containers, or are you allowed to take NO AMMO whatsoever?

 

[ny32182]

It doesn't make any difference to me what the rules say. It would appear to be just common sense to lock the soft suitcase as well as the gun case. Why even make an issue of it?

Planes don't wait for you to run to the store looking to buy locks that are not required in the TSA rules.

If someone wants to steal your gun and has the opportunity they are going to do it. A little padlock or pistol case is just another feel-good measure. I wouldn't put anything that means a lot to me in a checked bag, pistol included.

 

[kingpin008]

Wow, I was not aware I could take one of my weapons to another state - checked in luggage! I could easily find a locked metal box and a larger box with another lock! Do you check your ammo in your luggage going into the containers, or are you allowed to take NO AMMO whatsoever?

Friendly - do a search for "Flying with firearms" and you'll come up with plenty of threads detailing the process and what you are and are not allowed to bring with you. It's been well covered.

 

[Matt 357]

How does locking a softside suitcase help?

Ever heard of a box cutter?

 

[W.E.G.]

must-watch video on traveling with firearms (long and worth it)

 

[frankge]

locked suitcases are a recipe for TSAto nreak open the lock or open it with thier master key anyway

 

[swinokur]

Almost every time I have flown, which is more than most people, the TSA lock I put on my soft sided luggage is either cut off or removed and not put back on. This has occurred both as part of a secondary search with the required TSA inspection tag inside my luggage and apparent entry into my bag by persons unknown.

I gave up locking my luggage with a TSA lock. Complete waste of money.

PS-I keep a copy of TSA Regs, USC 926 (FOPA), and the airlines rules in my firearms case for just these sort of situations. The level of ignorance on both the TSA and airlines employees parts is staggering to me.

I also agree that if you are going to stand up for yourself, that it be done in both a civil, quiet and friendly manner. Be firm but be polite. These folks can determine whether you fly or not.

 

[withdrawn34]

It's interesting to note here Deviant advises against the exact thing here, putting a smaller case inside a larger piece of luggage.

If you put your weapon inside your larger peice of luggage (not in a smaller case), then you can lock the whole friggin thing with a non-TSA lock. That is why I would recommend getting a quality piece of hard sided luggage and putting your pistol and such in there. If you can swing the cost, get something like a large Pelican case with wheels. That way you can store everything, firearms included, and lock it all up with a non-TSA lock.

 

[swinokur]

Watch this youtube video called "opening a zippered suitcase with a ballpoint pen." You'll never bother to put a lock on soft sided luggage again. If this guy knows it so does every ramp worker in the world as well.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=G5mvvZl6pLI&playnext=1&list=PL739C3177D781C761

This is why I use a cable lock to secure my firearm case inside my luggage. I run a cable around the interior tubes that the handle collapses into. If they try to take the case, the suitcase goes too.

 

[Bob K.]

It doesn't make any difference to me what the rules say. It would appear to be just common sense to lock the soft suitcase as well as the gun case. Why even make an issue of it?

Bravo to the OP. Nothing is more important than holding the Government to its own rules. Any government agency that is permitted to make rules up on the fly or use power to force its way is a disaster waiting to happen. Firm and polite. Thumbs up!

 

[medalguy]

I wonder if your TSA agent was one of those arrested yesterday for stealing from passengers' luggage???

 

[carlsca]

It's a government operation, therefore, by definition, it can't make sense. Get a lock on the hard case, lock that in another box and lock that in your suitcase and wrap the whole thing in duct tape!

 

[ClickClickD'oh]

If you lock the external case, TSA will just break it open to inspect it. Pack your firearm inside a hard case, then secure that case inside an unlocked case. Print out the TSA regs and keep them, and the keys to the firearm case with you at all times. If TSA wants to inspect your firearm open the case yourself. Never turn over the keys to your firearms case.

In my experiences of traveling with my firearm all over the nation I've found that Southwest employees are generally the best about checking a firearm, and the TSA is a crap shoot.

 

[EddieNFL]

It's a government operation, therefore, by definition, it can't make sense. Get a lock on the hard case, lock that in another box and lock that in your suitcase and wrap the whole thing in duct tape!

...and another TSA smuck will insist it cannot be double locked.

 

[BENBRU]

Never had a problem... even in Boston, which is where I thought I would run into a huge problem(s).

So, read the regs... have them printed out.... leave yourself plenty of extra time (to include more time to get groped, by the way I like to ask for a print out when they scan me)...

Unfortunately nothing will avoid bufoonery in the airports.

 

[frankge]

so i posted this while having a vodka tonic at the airport bar... surprisingly when i got to Tampa there was my suitcase with firearm intact... just like other other 100 times. I fly alot for a living so I'm pretty good at "managing" the system. Some things I adhere to;

- TSA is not the most educated group, I knew a contract that trains them so I got the stories.
- Argue or ne nasty and its a no-win situatio for YOU
- I travel with my carry which is a stck G36 - not my custom G34 or 1911 - it gets gone easily replaced
- locking a suitcase is a recipe for broken lock and lost luggage.
- do not allow special stickers applied to the suitcase indicating firearm
- the more generic the suitcase the better
- invest in a good metal hardcase with lock
- be polite above all and help guide the airline and TSA personnell that might not have dealt with firearms before - they do make the general public and uninformed nervous

 

[jerkface11]

So we aren't allowed to see the rule book????

 

[CHALK22]

This did not happen to me, but to my brother-in-law. He lives in CA, so is used to dealing with anti-gun people, but this one really amazed him. While flying home from Missoula, MT, (where I live) he stated that he had an unloaded firearm in his luggage. They pull it out to inspect it, and when they open it, he had removed his ammo from the mag and put it in a ziploc baggie( yes, a no-no, but he had nothing else to use, he forgot to leave it at my house) so then, they tell him he cannot fly with loose ammo, to which he says, "fine, can you please dispose of it for me" to which they reply, no, they can't throw away loose ammo in an airport trash can, so then he ask what he should do. So the TSA agent tells him to LOAD HIS MAG and PUT IT IN THE GUN. So, under the watchful eye of the agent, and supervisor, he did just that, and said it was the wierdest thing he had ever done in an airport.

Blows me away.

 

[lloveless]

I fly several times a year on work assighnments. TSA and airline employees don't read the rules, and will tell you something different each time. I have soft sided luggage. I lock it with a TSA approved lock. A plastic case with my gun and knife are locked after an unloaded card is placed in it with a non-TSA lock. All my ammo is in a small tackle box that is also locked with a non-TSA lock. I have never missed anything, but TSA has messed up my clothes so bad I had to iron the clothes so I could wear them. I did have one TSA agent ogle one of my pistols and made a comment that the gun probably would come up missing! I looked him in the eye, and told him as a former LEO I had his name and number, and he'd be the first person interviewed should my gun not show up. It showed up.
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