S&W 610 does not work well with Blazer .40 S&W

[Objekt]

S&W customer service shines again

Last night, I opened the gun's side panel and removed and inspected the firing pin. It was pitted on the end, not quite the nice hemispherical shape that's normal and desirable. Apparently there were some pierced primers over the years, although I can't remember seeing any. At least, something eroded the pin.

I called S&W to ask about purchasing a replacement firing pin, as I wasn't too keen on the aftermarket ones, and couldn't find anyone with an original firing pin in stock.

Guess what, one is now on the way for free. Wow!

S&W has always taken care of me.

 

[Peter M. Eick]

As a comment, my 610 (1st edition) is cut for 10mm shells in the cylinder so firing a 40 in it tends to really build up and tear up the bullet when it passes the 10mm chamber end. I think you will find it is far more accurate with real 10mm ammo then with 40's in it.

 

[Objekt]

Interesting. For me the main limitation is my skill as a shooter - I've been unable to demonstrate any significant difference in accuracy when shooting .40 S&W vs. 10mm.

Maybe if I had a Ransom rest, I could do some real tests with the 610. I wonder whether anyone's ever done that? It could be educational.

I think I just figured out a topic for Old Painless and his Box of Truth to investigate.

 

[Peter M. Eick]

Here is the first 50 shots I took from the gun with 10mm Ammo offhand at 15 yrds. While not perfect, (first shot flier out of a dry barrel), I think I can probably tell a bit about how well it can do with 40's vs. 10's in my gun. Trust me when I say in my gun, 40's do worse.

It also could be that my leade is particularly sharp and does not like the shorter 40 ammo.

More pictures just because 610's are so much fun!

 

[Objekt]

New firing pin but...

Things got a little weird.

I called S&W and they sent a new firing pin. Here it is beside the old one. You can clearly see that the old one (left) is chipped:



I installed the new one and went to the range a few days later.

On the first shot, the firing pin got stuck in the hole provided for it, locking up the gun. Some careful jiggling eventually got the firing pin to retract far enough to let the cylinder rotate. Gun locked up again in the same way on the second shot, at which point I called it quits.

Good news: both CCI Blazer .40 S&W cartridges fired on the first try.

Bad news: There's definitely something not right with the gun.

I called S&W a few days later. It seems I'm missing a firing pin return spring.

I have no idea what happened to that spring. I don't remember anything falling out or flying across the room when I was replacing the firing pin.

Further bad news: S&W is out of stock, and doesn't expect to have more firing pin return springs for at least 2 weeks. I can't locate an aftermarket source either.

Possible mitigation: An acquaintance who is a gunsmith thinks he may have the right spring. The range is closed this weekend so I won't be able to try it out, but dry firing will indicate whether the gun should function. At least, I'll be able to see whether the firing pin retracts within its hole as it should, after the hammer falls. As things are, the firing pin gets jammed in the hole, sticking out and locking up the gun - just as you'd expect with a free-floating firing pin, missing its return spring.

Dangit.

 

[MrBorland]

As things are, the firing pin gets jammed in the hole, sticking out and locking up the gun - just as you'd expect with a free-floating firing pin, missing its return spring.

A missing FP spring would likely tie up the gun when dry fired with empty cases in the gun. The force of a fired case getting slammed back usually pushes the pin out of the way, but that effect might not be as great when all the rounds are tied together with a moonclip.

It could be the firing pin also needs a little "trimming". I'd take a close look at the profile of the new and old pin to see if the new one's a bit longer where the larger part meets the smaller part, or if the radius of the junction is thicker. I ran into this with my 625 - the FP would stick in the forward position when dry fired, and it would tie up the gun when dry fired with empty cases in the chambers. IIRC, stoning the face of the larger portion back a smidge solved the problem.

 

[ClemY]

My 4" 610 shoots 10mm stuff, including Blazer, very well. It shoots my .40 S&W handloads well, but does not shoot .40 Blazer very well at all.

 

[Objekt]

Okay this is just weird. Same spring is missing entirely on my 625 also.

I took a good, long look in the firing pin channel, with a flashlight. No broken spring pieces, no nothing. So I guess I somehow lost that one too?

This doesn't make sense. When I removed the pin that holds the firing pin in the channel, in both cases (610 and 625), I had to turn the gun barrel-up to get the firing pin to drop out. I definitely didn't see any kind of spring fall out, and the firing pins obviously weren't under pressure from a spring, or they should have popped out on their own.

 

[Mr.Revolverguy]

Objekt,

This is exactly what I was referring to in my earlier post, happened to me also. But the firing pin did not just break off, unfortunately some 610's left the factory with a flaw in the firing pin. That firing pin is hollow at the very tip of the firing pin, which caused that dimple. Sort of a known issue, I say sort of because I got this directly from a S&W gunsmith, yet very few know about it in the public "I think".

 

[Objekt]

Can't say whether that chip was always there. I never had ignition problems before, so never had cause to inspect the firing pin.

What's really odd is that it seems both of my revolvers have lost their firing pin return spring. I know for sure I never removed the firing pin on my 625 until a few weekends ago, when I opened that part up to check whether there was gunk in the firing pin channel. I don't remember any extra parts falling out, so I have no idea how the return spring could have been lost.

I do know that the firing pin on the 625 now flops back and forth freely, hanging out of the hole when I tilt the barrel down. That didn't happen before.

 

[rcmodel]

O.K.

1. Both your revolvers worked until you took them apart.
2. Now, both your revolvers are missing firing pin springs.
A. You lost them both when you took the FP's out to do whatever it was.
B. Get a magnet and find them on the floor.
C. Sift through the vac sweeper dust if the magnet doesn't find them.

3. They would never have worked without the springs.

4. Your photos seem to show peirced primers in your fired brass.

5. Eroded firing pin tips is caused by hot gas cutting the end off the firing pin.
D. Figure out if the primers caused the FP failure.
E. Or if the damaged FP caused the pearced primers.

rc

 

[Objekt]

update

Got new firing pin return springs for both guns, and a new firing pin for the 610, from S&W. Took a while, but it was free, so I can't complain.

I can complain about one thing, however. The new firing pin is out of spec. It's difficult to get an accurate measurement due to the shape of the part (the actual pin part tapers), but the new firing pin is obviously too large. It consistently gets stuck, sticking out of the firing pin hole, when struck by the hammer. This happens with or without a return spring present. It locks up the gun every time, because the pin is then stuck in the primer of the just-fired cartridge, preventing the cylinder from rotating. So then I have to use a drift punch from the front to get it unstuck. Not good at all.

I thought about calling S&W for a new firing pin. Doesn't seem worth the hassle - especially if I wait 3 weeks for another firing pin which is also out of spec. Also I'm stubborn, and not in a hurry to get the gun working again.

So far I'm trying sandpaper, to remove just enough metal that the firing pin will no longer get stuck in the hole. It's very frustrating though. The dang thing is so tiny that it's hard to get a grip on, and it's very tiring to apply the sandpaper as well. Almost wish I had a Dremel, but that would probably just screw things up faster.

If you have a better idea than trying to sand down the firing pin to spec, please share it. So far all I've managed to accomplish is a very highly polished firing pin.

 

[Jim Watson]

Electric drill and a FINE file or medium stone.

A call to Apex Tactical who has their own firing pin.

 

[BlindJustice]

I have a S&W 625-8 .45 ACP / .45 Auto Rim

I use the steel full moon clips. I once tried
some of the polymer moon clips but they didn't
hold rounds well.

Light Primer Strikes started occuring. so the
main spring tension/stake was checked. I finally
had a gunsmith look inside. The Tip of the firing
pin was broken. The floating Firing Pin, is a drop
in replacement. I replaced the stocker with
Apex Tactical - Apex XP Ignition kit, consisting
of a forged FP which is a smidge longer as well as
being roundy shaped instead of poinnty.
and a weaker rebound spring.

Cylinder & Sllide offers a similar FP replacement


Still picky about ammo, it runs with Federal - does
not like Blazer at all. Soft vs Hard primers.

Too bad they never created 10mm AUto Rim heh

Randall

 

[RugRev]

I had a C & S firing pin installed in a Smith that was having some gunsmith work done. It had to be turned down a bit on a lathe to get it to work freely. I'd be tempted, if doing it again, to use the Apex.

 

[wally]

Yesterday I had an odd experience at the range. My S&W 610 simply would not set off four cartridges of CCI Blazer .40 S&W (165 gr., aluminum case) ammunition. I tried them all three or four times, in both single and double-action mode, but they just would not ignite. I only shot about half a box of this ammunition in the 610, so that's a pretty high failure rate - 4 out of 20!

I had the same issue with CCI Aluminum Blazer 9mm in my Charter Arms Pitbull and Taurus 905 revolvers. I can't explain it, the ammo is great in all my autoloaders. The steel cased ammo has very difficult extraction, so I just use brass cased ammo when I shoot these.

 

[Objekt]

Looks like it's fixed

Per a suggestion on another forum, I put the firing pin in a drill chuck, just as if it were a drill bit, and held sandpaper against it while running the drill.

It only took a few minutes to get enough metal off that the firing pin now does its job, without getting stuck in the hole.

Going to the range to verify function.