S&W MP and the 40 cal

[1Longbow]

Well I broke down and bought a new MP in 40 cal ,Yesterday I got to shoot it for the first time and as posted on this site the 165 grain shot low and the 180 grain shot to the center on the target. I did experience alot of miss feeds with the 165 grain PMC loads ,while the 180's fed with no problem. I like the feel of the gun ,which is why I bought it ,but the failure to feed the 165's took me back some. Do you reloaders find one powder better than another in this cal. ?I'll probably stick with 180 Grain bullets. And another question ,what are you guys using on your slide rails for lube. The manual calls for gun oil ,is there something better? As you can probably tell this is the first auto pistol I've bought,though I shoot my revolvers alot. The failure to fully feed the lighter bullets has me alittle spooked right now. Thanks for any info ---1Longbow

 

[treebeard]

I don't reload, and I don't shoot reloads either. For what it's worth I have not experienced one FTF or FTE using Winclean, Speer, Independance, Magtech, and lancerammo. I have also used 165 grain and 180 grain too. I just put a dab of oil on the rails before putting it back together.

 

[1Longbow]

Thanks treebeard,
These were factory loads also ,the 180's were Winchester and the 165's were PMC's .I bought them as a test just to see where each would print on the targetas other memebers were saying that the 165s printed low which was my findings also. Maybe it was just the PMC brand,and see what happens.Thanks for your reply--1Longbow

 

[treebeard]

Almost forgot....I found that the 165's I shot were low as well. There was a very slight difference in recoil with the 180's, and my shot placement was better as well. Now that I think back, the 180's I shot were Speer and Winchester. I have personally never shot PMC out of any .40 that I own. I know several people that own the M&P and have not had any FTF's or FTE's either. Let us know how you make out on your next range trip.

 

[distra]

The M&P in my hands shoots better with the 180gr rounds. 165gr were typically low. I have not had any FTF or FTE with either. ~500rds through it so far, Winclean, WWB, Cabela reloads and Federal TMJ. All feed fine. I put through Hornady XTP with no issues. Once I get more round through it, I might even carry it now and then. I typical carry a 1911Sc or my XD45.

 

[1Longbow]

Treebread and others thanks for the replys,I did go out and purchase some Federal 180 grain and some 165 grain .No failures to feed or eject this time so it must have been the PMC brand for what ever reason. I did rest the gun on a bench to find the actual point of impact and at 10 yards,holding the sights 1 inch below dead center on the bull ,they hit center of the bull(for the 180 grain)The 165 grain with the same hold ,hit 3 inches lower and to the left.Recoil between the different weights in bullets was very slight. I feel better now 1Longbow

 

[iamkris]

Probably just the shap of the specific 165 gr bullet that PMC uses. Different brand bullets will feed differetly based mostly on the shape of their ogive.

Also, heavier bullets tend to shoot higher because of (usually) greater recoil.

 

[treebeard]

1Longbow, glad to hear that you did not have any problems with the Federal. I was trying to remember the one brand that I have shot but forgot about, and it was Federal. I would probably stay away from PMC. Happy shooting!

 

[v35]

Also, heavier bullets tend to shoot higher because of (usually) greater recoil.

This implies that recoil affects the bullet's trajectory. I had thought that recoil is negligible until well after the bullet leaves the barrel. Now I'm really confused. Would someone please un-confuse me?

 

[glocker1911]

Actually, it's a qeustion of speed, not weight. The higher velocity a load has, the lower it will hit on the target. The gun begins to rise, however little, as soon as it is fired. A faster bullet will "leave" the barrel earlier, thus hitting lower on the target than a "slower" round which spends more time in the barrel and thus leaves at a higher angle. Remember, we are talking about a differance of a split second, but all things being equal in the same gun, a heavier bullet (normally a lower velocity round) will in fact strike the target higher than a lighter, faster one will.

 

[RyanM]

180 gr is a better weight than 165 anyway.

As far as powders go, IMR Hi-Skor 800x is the best, if you don't mind weighing each charge, or using one of those really expensive automatic scale things. It meters like poop. Though I've been able to get my Lyman Ideal #55 to give charges that only vary by about +\- 0.2 gr, which isn't too bad. Hi-Skor is especially good since you can exceed factory velocities with only 26,000 PSI of pressure (SAAMI max for .40 is 35,000, and most handloads are around 33-35k). Good for guns with partially supported chambers. Dunno how the chamber support on the M&P is, though. If you want to work up barnburner loads, 800-X is a very forgiving powder.

Alliant Power Pistol is pretty good, but makes a blinding white flash, and is very loud. Power Pistol and lead bullets would definitely be a bad combination. Also, it seems like very few stores sell Power Pistol.

Hodgdon Longshot is good, but it requires a fair amount of pressure to burn consistently and give good accuracy. Hodgdon's max load in .40 is a 180 gr bullet at about 1150 fps. Reduced pressure loads to replicate factory velocities won't work as well as with Hi-Skor.

 

[atblis]

Power Pistol

Hmmm
I load 10mm with cast lead 180s and PP. Accurate and consistant. Didn't notice excessive leading.

 

[RyanM]

Weird. I guess the flame temperature isn't as hot as it looks.

I forgot to mention in the other post, you'll want to stay very far away from Universal, and from Winchester Super Field. Both will start to have pressure spikes around 35,000 PSI, which is also the pressure that .40 is loaded to. Most powders won't spike until they get to much, much higher pressures than that. But with those two powders, just a couple tenths of a grain too much powder can be catastrophic.

Also, the powders I listed are best if you want to replicate what factory loads are advertised at (180 gr at 1015 fps). If you want to replicate the actual factory velocity (more like 920 to 960 fps for 180 gr loads), most of the mid to fast speed burning powders are fine. AA#2, 5, 7, Red Dot, Unique, HP-38, HS-6, etc.

 

[g56]

As to impact points of different weight bullets, I used to carry a S&W Mod 66 in 357 mag, the 125 gr hollow points were the hot item in 357, they shot so low in my revolver I couldn't adjust the elevation of the sight enough to make up for the low impact point. It wasn't a good situation, we had to carry the 125 gr bullets, but I had to keep in mind to aim high, not a good idea for a high stress shooting situation! I still have that Smith, but I keep 158 gr ammo in it, there's no problem with the old standard 158 gr bullets!

 

[Freddie]

M&P

I have not had any FTF's with mine..And I love the gun....Even more then the Glock I had..