I recently purchased a three set of USFA SSA in .45 LC; pristine condition and I would like to keep them that way. Went to the range as they will get shot however, I realized when new target time came, I did not know (not comfortable at least) with letting the hammer down on a live cartridge. I do know that to avoid lines/ timing problems, always cock all the way back and all the way forward (got that one) - just not sure about de-cocking on a live cylinder - the safe way. For those that know, your thoughts? Thank you.
SAA Proper Cocking Technique
- Thread starter Steve S.
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BobWright
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You can temporarily ease the hammer forward to the first safety notch, which will keep the firing pin away from the primer. Then just cock the hammer in the normal way to fire. The cartridge under the hammer will not be the round fired, incidentally. And, most important, the gun should not be carried in this manner.
If firing is not to resume immediately, let the hammer down to the safety notch, then bring it back to the loading notch and clear the gun before changing targets or whatever.
Bob Wright
P.S. When in the "safety notch" the action is the same as if the hammer is all the way down.
If firing is not to resume immediately, let the hammer down to the safety notch, then bring it back to the loading notch and clear the gun before changing targets or whatever.
Bob Wright
P.S. When in the "safety notch" the action is the same as if the hammer is all the way down.
Driftwood Johnson
Member
Howdy
Your question addresses the reason why in CAS once a hammer is cocked, the round must be fired, it is against the rules to lower the hammer on a live round.
Anyway, I suspect you are loading all six chambers. Instead, try just loading five.
With a traditional Single Action lockwork like your USFAs, the best procedure is to set the hammer at half cock, open the loading gate, load one, skip one chamber, load four more, close the loading gate, cock the hammer all the way, and then lower it onto an empty chamber. If you do it correctly, when you lower the hammer all the way it will be lowered onto an empty chamber. This is also the way to avoid causing a ring around the cylinder. By pulling the hammer all the way back and then lowering it, you are resetting the bolt. The click you hear when you lower the hammer is the bolt resetting. A bolt leg is popping over the hammer cam and resetting itself.
Loading a traditional single action with all six chambers is not a safe practice because if you happen to drop the gun and it lands on the hammer, either the sear or the 'safety cock' notch on the hammer is likely to shear, and the gun will probably fire. Loading the way I described you can peer at the gun from the side and see that there is not a cartridge under the hammer, there will be a space where there is no cartridge.
I suggest you get yourself a set of snap caps and practice this at home rather than trying it first time at the range.
Now, the time is going to come someday when you need to lower the hammer on a live round. Or, you should just get practice lowering the hammer with your snap caps. I always lower the hammer on the empty chamber, I never pull the trigger.
I suspect that your USFAs have the same high hammer spur as a Colt. Here is a sequence of photos showing lowering the hammer on a Colt. Note, I am using my left hand because I needed my right hand free to shoot the photos. It would be the same with my right hand.
Basically you use the hollow in the hammer spur and roll your thumb though it to control the hammer on the way down.
In this photo, the hammer is at full cock. Notice the position of my thumb, rolled forward a bit into the hollow. Notice too that my finger is off the trigger.
In this next photo I have forced the hammer all the way back against its spring, so I can control it when I pull the trigger. I have started pulling the trigger, but it has not released the hammer yet.
The trigger is fully pulled back and I am easing the hammer forward, controlling it with pressure from my thumb.
I continue to allow the hammer forward, rolling my thumb back in the hollow.
The hammer is almost all the way down and I am easing the pressure with my thumb to allow it to get there.
The hammer is all the way down. My thumb is no longer bearing down on the hammer and I am lifting it away.
Buy your self some snap caps and practice doing this. You can also practice it with an unloaded gun. Don't try it with live ammo until you are confident you have mastered it. It really is not hard, just takes a little bit of practice. Next time you are watching an old Western, watch when an actor lowers the hammer on his gun. If an actor can do it, anybody can.
P.S. If you have fired a string of shots but the gun still has a few rounds in it, and you want to change targets, I would never lower the hammer and walk in front of the gun. Never. Always empty the gun before you set it down and walk in front of it. Either shoot it empty, or set it at half cock and unload it before walking up to change targets. Set it down and leave the hammer at half cock before changing targets.
Your question addresses the reason why in CAS once a hammer is cocked, the round must be fired, it is against the rules to lower the hammer on a live round.
Anyway, I suspect you are loading all six chambers. Instead, try just loading five.
With a traditional Single Action lockwork like your USFAs, the best procedure is to set the hammer at half cock, open the loading gate, load one, skip one chamber, load four more, close the loading gate, cock the hammer all the way, and then lower it onto an empty chamber. If you do it correctly, when you lower the hammer all the way it will be lowered onto an empty chamber. This is also the way to avoid causing a ring around the cylinder. By pulling the hammer all the way back and then lowering it, you are resetting the bolt. The click you hear when you lower the hammer is the bolt resetting. A bolt leg is popping over the hammer cam and resetting itself.
Loading a traditional single action with all six chambers is not a safe practice because if you happen to drop the gun and it lands on the hammer, either the sear or the 'safety cock' notch on the hammer is likely to shear, and the gun will probably fire. Loading the way I described you can peer at the gun from the side and see that there is not a cartridge under the hammer, there will be a space where there is no cartridge.
I suggest you get yourself a set of snap caps and practice this at home rather than trying it first time at the range.
Now, the time is going to come someday when you need to lower the hammer on a live round. Or, you should just get practice lowering the hammer with your snap caps. I always lower the hammer on the empty chamber, I never pull the trigger.
I suspect that your USFAs have the same high hammer spur as a Colt. Here is a sequence of photos showing lowering the hammer on a Colt. Note, I am using my left hand because I needed my right hand free to shoot the photos. It would be the same with my right hand.
Basically you use the hollow in the hammer spur and roll your thumb though it to control the hammer on the way down.
In this photo, the hammer is at full cock. Notice the position of my thumb, rolled forward a bit into the hollow. Notice too that my finger is off the trigger.
In this next photo I have forced the hammer all the way back against its spring, so I can control it when I pull the trigger. I have started pulling the trigger, but it has not released the hammer yet.
The trigger is fully pulled back and I am easing the hammer forward, controlling it with pressure from my thumb.
I continue to allow the hammer forward, rolling my thumb back in the hollow.
The hammer is almost all the way down and I am easing the pressure with my thumb to allow it to get there.
The hammer is all the way down. My thumb is no longer bearing down on the hammer and I am lifting it away.
Buy your self some snap caps and practice doing this. You can also practice it with an unloaded gun. Don't try it with live ammo until you are confident you have mastered it. It really is not hard, just takes a little bit of practice. Next time you are watching an old Western, watch when an actor lowers the hammer on his gun. If an actor can do it, anybody can.
P.S. If you have fired a string of shots but the gun still has a few rounds in it, and you want to change targets, I would never lower the hammer and walk in front of the gun. Never. Always empty the gun before you set it down and walk in front of it. Either shoot it empty, or set it at half cock and unload it before walking up to change targets. Set it down and leave the hammer at half cock before changing targets.
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g.willikers
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The way I learned was to let the hammer down gently on a finger of the support hand.
In other words, a finger is between the hammer and the frame (and live round in the cylinder), preferably below the firing pin if it's the type in the pictures.
Then pull the hammer back just enough to free the trapped finger and let the hammer down the rest of the way.
In other words, a finger is between the hammer and the frame (and live round in the cylinder), preferably below the firing pin if it's the type in the pictures.
Then pull the hammer back just enough to free the trapped finger and let the hammer down the rest of the way.
Driftwood Johnson
Member
What support hand? I only shoot single action revolvers with one hand. Been doing it the way I described for over 40 years.
BobWright
Member
Driftwood Johnson:
I believe that is the very first time I've ever seen a step-by-step photo sequence on how to ease the hammer down!
May your tribe increase!
Bob Wright
I believe that is the very first time I've ever seen a step-by-step photo sequence on how to ease the hammer down!
May your tribe increase!
Bob Wright
The Bushmaster
Member
Keep in mind gentlemen that the Colt SAA can not be lowered to half cock and have the cylinder become free to rotate. The hammer MUST be lowered to fired position THEN brought to half cock. However you can lower the hammer to the safety notch from full cock. I have learned over the years NOT to trust the safety notch on Colt SAAs.
If you follow the 4 (FOUR) rules of gun handling you can safely lower the hammer to fired position on a live round. If it IS set off the bullet will go down range harmlessly. It WILL scare the be-jesus out of you though.
I have owned [and enjoyed] my Colt (bought new) sense 1966.
If you follow the 4 (FOUR) rules of gun handling you can safely lower the hammer to fired position on a live round. If it IS set off the bullet will go down range harmlessly. It WILL scare the be-jesus out of you though.
I have owned [and enjoyed] my Colt (bought new) sense 1966.
g.willikers
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Ok, then, your other hand, supporting or not.
If, by some unfortunate circumstance, you only have the one hand, then use your-----
Er, Nevermind.
That will hurt.
BCRider
Member
SteveS, the load 5 only rule should apply any time you're not loading and shooting immediately after loading.
The only time I'll load all 6 is if I'm at the firing line bench where I'm going to load all six with the gun at half cock, close the gate then raise the gun to be fired and go from half cock to full cock and shoot off that round along with the rest. Used in this way there's obviously no risk of a need to lower the hammer. Nor do I bother. I just go to full cock then aim and pull.
Around here I can only load and shoot at proper ranges. And all the ranges are cold ranges so the ONLY time I'm putting a loaded gun into a holster is at our CAS matches. And under those rules I load 5 only and lower the hammer down on the empty chamber.
I used to do the load one, skip one, load 4. But I ran into a high primer one time. So now I just load 5 and roll the cylinder a turn or a little more to check for any binding. All being well I'll continue the roll until I can see the empty chamber come up to between the 1 and 2 o'clock position on the left hand side of the gun. At that point I can pull the hammer to full cock and the pawl engages and rotates the empty chamber up to the 12 o'clock position and I can then pull the trigger and lower the hammer.
The whole time I'm doing this I'm looking down through the rim clearance space between the cylinder and the recoil shield and watching the vacant spot of the empty chamber.
The only time I'll load all 6 is if I'm at the firing line bench where I'm going to load all six with the gun at half cock, close the gate then raise the gun to be fired and go from half cock to full cock and shoot off that round along with the rest. Used in this way there's obviously no risk of a need to lower the hammer. Nor do I bother. I just go to full cock then aim and pull.
Around here I can only load and shoot at proper ranges. And all the ranges are cold ranges so the ONLY time I'm putting a loaded gun into a holster is at our CAS matches. And under those rules I load 5 only and lower the hammer down on the empty chamber.
I used to do the load one, skip one, load 4. But I ran into a high primer one time. So now I just load 5 and roll the cylinder a turn or a little more to check for any binding. All being well I'll continue the roll until I can see the empty chamber come up to between the 1 and 2 o'clock position on the left hand side of the gun. At that point I can pull the hammer to full cock and the pawl engages and rotates the empty chamber up to the 12 o'clock position and I can then pull the trigger and lower the hammer.
The whole time I'm doing this I'm looking down through the rim clearance space between the cylinder and the recoil shield and watching the vacant spot of the empty chamber.
Very elaborate and kind replies; thank you for the help. I was not sure if there was a safe way to lower the hammer onto a loaded cylinder AND not "scratch" the cylinder exterior by causing a timing problem. I really like these handguns and want to keep them as pristine as possible (AND not shoot anyone - OMG just the thought). Very good guidance and advice - I will surely follow your lead. Thank you again.
rcmodel
Member in memoriam
All you need to remember is, once past the half-cock notch.
ALWAYS continue to cock it fully before letting the hammer back down.
And Load one, Skip one, Load four, and Full cock & let the hammer back down on the empty chamber.
I can't be of much help telling you how to safely lower the hammer.
I have been doing it for 60 years with the shooting hand, on rifles, shotguns, pistols, and revolvers with nary an accident. No extra fingers or thumbs under the hammer to get pinched either!
It's just something so ingrained in my muscle memory I don't even think about how I do it.
Or tell you how to do it.
rc
ALWAYS continue to cock it fully before letting the hammer back down.
And Load one, Skip one, Load four, and Full cock & let the hammer back down on the empty chamber.
I can't be of much help telling you how to safely lower the hammer.
I have been doing it for 60 years with the shooting hand, on rifles, shotguns, pistols, and revolvers with nary an accident. No extra fingers or thumbs under the hammer to get pinched either!
It's just something so ingrained in my muscle memory I don't even think about how I do it.
Or tell you how to do it.
rc
Driftwood Johnson
Member
Howdy Again
I will probably get taken to task for this, but generating a ring around the cylinder will in no way damage your revolver or 'cause a timing problem'. It is purely cosmetic. Don't get me wrong, I have been shooting Colts and clones for many years, and I learned long ago to always lower the hammer from full cock, never from half cock. But if you do it wrong, you are not going to damage anything, except maybe your pride.
Here is a photo of the moving parts in a Colt. I'm sure you recognize the hammer and trigger. The hand is the part with the spring attached, and the bolt is the other part.
The slanted surface on the side of the hammer is the cam. Its function is to raise the tail end of the bolt, causing the other end of the bolt to pivot down out of the cylinder, allowing the cylinder to turn. If you look carefully you will see the tail end of the bolt is split in half, with two tails.
When you cock the hammer, the cam rotates up. Its round top edge catches the curved underside of the bolt tail closest to the hammer. The cam pivots the tail of the bolt up. That causes the 'business end' of the bolt to pivot down, releasing the cylinder to rotate. This also compresses the bolt portion of the split trigger/bolt spring. By the time the hammer reaches full cock, the cam will have rotated far enough that the tail of the bolt slips off. The compressed bolt/trigger spring then pops the 'business end' of the bolt up again. The bolt is then free to pop into one of the locking slots on the cylinder, as the slot rotates past the bolt window in the frame.
When the hammer rotates forward, either to fire a cartridge or to ease it down, the slanted face of the cam wedges the same tail to the side, so the the bolt does not move; its spring keeps the 'business end' in the up position, keeping the cylinder locked. When the hammer rotates far enough forward, the top surface of the cam will clear the tail of the bolt. The bolt is made of spring steel, and the bent tail will straighten itself out as it clears the cam. You can hear the click it makes as the tail of the bolt pops back and straightens out. The bolt has not pivoted at this point, it has remained 'up' keeping the cylinder in battery.
The half cock notch on the hammer is positioned so that when the hammer is placed in half cock, the cam has rotated far enough to push the tail end of the bolt up, pivoting the bolt down out of the cylinder. The overhanging lip on the half cock notch traps the tip of the trigger (sear) so the hammer and trigger stay in position while you rotate the cylinder to load and unload.
Now, here is the point. If you then lower the hammer from half cock, without first going to full cock, the bolt has not reset itself yet. As you lower the hammer, the trigger/bolt spring pushes the bolt back up again, because the cam is allowing the tail of the bolt to pivot down. At this point the bolt spring is pressing the bolt against the body of the cylinder, between the locking slots.
At this point you have caused no damage at all. The bolt is merely pressing against the side of the cylinder. That does not harm anything, and it does not scratch anything either. However the cylinder is no longer locked in battery. It is free to rotate. If you should happen to rotate the cylinder now, with the bolt pressed against it, that is when you start to generate a ring around the cylinder. The first time or two probably nothing will happen. A few more times and the bolt will start scraping the blue away, causing the the beginning of a line.
This does not affect the timing. Timing is the relationship of the bearing surfaces of the parts so they all do their job in the proper sequence. A ring around the cylinder does not affect this. Unless you do it a bazillion times, wearing the parts down so they no longer fit correctly. You would have to do an awful lot of rotating of the cylinder with the bolt up to accomplish that.
As I say, it is a point of pride among Colt (and clone) owners to not generate a ring around the cylinder. But it ain't going to damage anything, other than the blue on the cylinder and the owner's pride.
BCRider
Member
Just a last question. Do the USFA revolvers use the old style spur firing pin on the hammer or do they have the frame located floating pin and transfer bar?
The reason I'm asking is that if it's the old original spur pin then there is no really good way of lowering the hammer onto a live round. The FP will be resting on the primer and that's not a good situation. This is simply not a good move at any time regardless of the situation.
The reason I'm asking is that if it's the old original spur pin then there is no really good way of lowering the hammer onto a live round. The FP will be resting on the primer and that's not a good situation. This is simply not a good move at any time regardless of the situation.
BobWright
Member
That is not true. With the hammer in the safety notch, the firing pin is not in contact with the live primer. It is held just slightly above with no contact. Cocking the hammer from this position WILL rotate the cylinder.
Bob Wright
BobWright
Member
Let me reiterate the hammer positions other than full cocked.
1. Hammer in first safety notch. The firing pin is not in contact with the primer. Cocking from this position will result in cylinder rotation.
2. Half Cock (loading notch) When the hammer is drawn back to this position, the cylinder is free to rotate for loading/unloading. IF the hammer is at full cock and the hammer eased down to this position, then recocked, the cylinder will NOT rotate.
In either of these two positions, a normal pull of the trigger will not fire the gun, unless parts are broken, or the trigger sear is not fully engaged in the notch.
This for Colt Single Actions and similar guns only. Guns such as the Ruger, with transfer bar operate differently. Once the hammer of a Ruger is cocked, the trigger must be held back to fire. If the trigger is pulled and the hammer is restrained, pressure may be released on the trigger and the hammer allowed to go forward with no worry.
Bob Wright
1. Hammer in first safety notch. The firing pin is not in contact with the primer. Cocking from this position will result in cylinder rotation.
2. Half Cock (loading notch) When the hammer is drawn back to this position, the cylinder is free to rotate for loading/unloading. IF the hammer is at full cock and the hammer eased down to this position, then recocked, the cylinder will NOT rotate.
In either of these two positions, a normal pull of the trigger will not fire the gun, unless parts are broken, or the trigger sear is not fully engaged in the notch.
This for Colt Single Actions and similar guns only. Guns such as the Ruger, with transfer bar operate differently. Once the hammer of a Ruger is cocked, the trigger must be held back to fire. If the trigger is pulled and the hammer is restrained, pressure may be released on the trigger and the hammer allowed to go forward with no worry.
Bob Wright
BobWright
Member
One more thought:
SOME Uberti Single Actions have a hammer block safety. The gun on the left has such a safety, visible on the hammer face just below the firing pin:
This hammer block is activated when the hammer is placed at the safety ntch position, and fits between the hammer face and gun's frame. It is every bit as effective as the hammer blocks on Colt or S & W double action revolvers. It is automatic, and withdrawn when the hammer is cocked for firing.
Bob Wright
SOME Uberti Single Actions have a hammer block safety. The gun on the left has such a safety, visible on the hammer face just below the firing pin:
This hammer block is activated when the hammer is placed at the safety ntch position, and fits between the hammer face and gun's frame. It is every bit as effective as the hammer blocks on Colt or S & W double action revolvers. It is automatic, and withdrawn when the hammer is cocked for firing.
Bob Wright
45 Dragoon
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This is a great thread for teaching folks how the action parts work . It always seems to be a mystery to most! Very nice pics with explanation DJ !! Awesome copy as well Bob!! And, I like the hammer block when in safety position on my El Patron! I'm comfortable with that system and keep six in , ready to go.
45 Dragoon
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