Saiga 12: The Adventure Begins.....

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Dave McCracken

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Through the kind offices of a THR member, I've been loaned a Saiga 12 gauge to try out. Being that The People's Republic Of Maryland doth not trust its peons with dangerous things like incorrect thoughts and Kalishnikovs, I had to endure a waiting period.

That's even though I have a CCW and have spent most of my adult life in jobs where proficiency with arms was a job requirement. Feh....

So, I drove through snow to Guns R Us, my long time dealer of choice, to pick up my loaner today. The folks in the shop, which is much more devoted to sporting arms than "Black" guns, liked the look of it, if for no other reason than it should tick off our President Elect.

This Saiga came with two 5 shot mags, a mag holder, a manual I've yet to read, a wrench for the "Thread Protector" on the muzzle and a shipping box.

So,once the paperwork was completed and the Saiga back in the box, off we went to PGC, blithe and unvexed....

The Geezers convened today,but shot little due to the wind chill and the occasional flurry of snow. With an average age in the 60s, we feel no need to show how tough we are.

The gang knew this was coming. and as it passed around the comments flew.

By and large, they said things like.....

"It's lighter than it looks".

"Bet it'll work for Home Defense".

"Where can I get one?"

"How much do they cost?"

Eventually, I loaded up both mags and we tried a few trap clays. Since this has no choke, rudimentary sights and a trigger best described as stout, results were not that good.

Note, the mags are a little hard for cold, arthritic fingers to load easily. Easy to rack in though.

One retired Marine did use up all 5 shots in the mag at one clay. He oft uses a SX1 Winchester at trap and has some experience with the AK from the 60s and 70s.

All mentioned the light recoil. It is a very light kicking auto, even using 1 1/8 oz Gun Clubs, which do kick some from my O/U and 870s. In the Saiga, creampuffs.

The thing handles nicely, and I'm planning on patterning it soon with the GCs and some buck loads.

More later....
 
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Speer low recoil lawman tactical 00 has a reputation for nice tight and even patterns in these if you have any on hand.........
 
Don't have that, do have a messa stuff including Winchester and Federal classic 00, 1, 4, "Old" Estate R/R 00 and some vintage Remington 00, circa 1980 that I should have shot up long before this.

As for slugs, this may be the chance to use up those 3" Brenekkes. There's also plenty of 2 3/4" KOs, more Winchester and Federal rifled slugs, some 2 3/4" Rottweils,ad infinitum.

Now I just need a place to shoot these off....
 
As far as Home Defense goes, isn't there a problem with the magazines if you leave the shells in for too long? I thought I read something about it not being a good idea with these guns in particular, but if its not the case I imagine it would be wonderful for home/zombie defense.
 
I need to pattern my new custom barrel extension
threaded for Rem Chokes.
 

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Dunno about how well they store when loaded. I do know this one is impossible to insert a mag with the bolt forward. The bolt hold open is tricky, but expertise will come with repetition.

The owner had emphasized that the mags needed to be seated with some oomph. No problem there. Guess all those years with the Mini 14s at work paid off.

Don't get me wrong. Darn near all the feedback I've gotten is positive, I'm quite impressed so far.

Some patterning and slug tests will have to wait. Family matters and all that.
 
Dunno about how well they store when loaded. I do know this one is impossible to insert a mag with the bolt forward
Click to expand...

They are tricky, tricky enough that I at first thought it couldn't be done but I have had half a dozen S12s and was able to load a full mag on a closed bolt with every one once I figured out that the angle I had to insert it at.

As to storing loaded mags on a closed bolt it can deform the shell if left like that for a prolonged period. One can remedy this in a few different ways. I have never had a loaded mag on a closed bolt long enough to deform it to the point it wont load though and thus I'm not sure just how long that would take.
 
shell deformation problem solved.
http://www.midwayusa.com/eproductpa...rce=bizrate&utm_medium=cpc&utm_campaign=23652
Now why can't Winchester, Remington, or Federal
produce a brass shell buckshot load. I would buy 10
cases. I would use the same in my saiga and my 870s.
617690.jpg
 
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Dave-

Is yours set up like an "assault weapon", or is it in original "sporter" config? Mine languished in the safe way too long in its as-issued trim, but now Mr. Obama has encouraged me to embrace Change, and it is off to FBMG for a conversion.

Mike
 
This is box stock and looks like a shotgun. No separate PG. I find that no disadvantage. It handles well.

Embracing change sounds good. I did think that I oughta have my pic taken with it and send it off to Mr O, telling him I cling to my religion also but am not bitter about it.



But, the Secret Service has enough to do now.....

Back to the Saiga.

Anyone know if storing this loaded one round down reduces or stops the shell deformation? Even four rounds fast is a mighty deterrent.

And, this isn't meant for flying clays or taking small game. It's designed to reduce threat levels no matter how target rich the area.

And in case you haven't noticed, I'm pumped about this.

762, that's an expensive option. Especially so on a shotgun that flings empties as enthusiastically as this does.

Back at the range today to help with the kid's program, folks were still talking about it. It was mentioned again how soft a shooter the Saiga is. I may have some 2 shot short magnums left to shoot up in this. 1 1/2 oz of lead.

MMmmm.....
 
Dang it, Dave. I mean, Dang it!

I just spent my Saiga money on a Glock 29, and now here you come talking sweet and smooth about the Saiga. Ain't you heard there is a financial crisis in this here Newnited States? I guess I am going to have to sell something and get the ^(*&^(+)^&%$^ Saiga.
 
I deny wrongdoing. Wait a couple months. I'm sure prices will slide down some after the inauguration.
 
Anyone know if storing this loaded one round down reduces or stops the shell deformation? Even four rounds fast is a mighty deterrent.
Click to expand...

I have read reports that indicate that down loading it one round does not prevent shell deformation for those that experience it.

I have heard others say that if they use a brass shell only as the top shell it prevents any deformation. If you are planning to leave it loaded for a rather long time then it is one of the options. It really isn't that expensive because you don't need a ton of them and you don't have to shoot the brass rounds regularly.

I've also noticed less signs of deformation in slug shells than others.

I have wanted to see how long it takes a shell to deform to the point it wont load but I have never left my saiga loaded long enough before I use it again. I would be curious if a ten round mag down loaded to 5, 6, or 7 roads would reduce the effects of deformation. If I can ever leave my saiga loaded long enough I may try to find out.
 
Thanks, I doubt I'll be able to keep it long enough to check.

Re all brass shells, some of that Winchester 00 from the Nam Mess would be nice.
 
Dunno about how well they store when loaded. I do know this one is impossible to insert a mag with the bolt forward. The bolt hold open is tricky, but expertise will come with repetition.

The owner had emphasized that the mags needed to be seated with some oomph. No problem there. Guess all those years with the Mini 14s at work paid off.
Click to expand...

Shell deformation is easy to avoid. Leave the Bolt in the open position with mag in by using the BHO lever. You can't load +1 like this, but there's no pressure on the second shell this way.

Mags DO NOT need to be seated hard with the bolt open. The BHO is tricky, but when loading I use one hand to pull the bolt back without using the BHO, insert the mag with the other, then let the bolt fly in battery.

There is a last round hold open in the works, just like most pistols, but don't hold your breathe. Been in the works for awhile. Also an AR style magwell with straight in mags loads, no rocking and locking like an AK. Also still vaporware right now.

familypics004-12.jpg
familypics001-14.jpg
 
I bought 2 Saiga 12's right before the prices went through the cieling. I like the guins just they way the are and am not going to change anything on the except poly chokes and I bought a bunch of 10 round and 2 20 round drums.

I have not had any kind of issue with them and am still putting them through testing as often as I can. We shoot skeet with them and they are a blast. Everyone wants to shoot them. As I wring them out and have more experience with them I may put them as my No. 1 HD weapon over the Benellis.
 
Gunnie, we'll see. My guess is there's a boatload of these on the way here now. That's a good thing.

Rusty, thanks for that. I had figured it out but you made it gel.

I could learn to like the Saiga.
 
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