Schmidt-Rubin rifle......

[MachIVshooter]

Picked one of these up today, after seeing it at the shop on Wednesday. I didn't look closely before and am somewhat unfamiliar with the Swiss rifles, so I had figured it was a K31 (since that's what seems to be abound currently). I offered $200 for it and they called me back on Thursday to say OK. In the interim, I looked at many K-31's online and noticed one difference that really stood out (I hadn't really made a mental note of the barrel length or other features). All the K-31's have metal cocking handles, while this one had a red-orange plastic handle. When I went down to pick it up, I immediately noticed other differences. Once at home, I did more research and correctly identified it as an M1911 Infantry rifle. Needless to say, i am always happy to walk away with something more unusual. Furthermore, this rifle had to have been brought into the country some time ago, as there are no import marks whatsoever. Overall condition is very good, and all the numbers match (including the magazine). Per the S/N, this rifle was manufactured in 1916

I guess this means I'm still on the prowl for a K31, but it would seem I have allocated one of the less common examples of Swiss arms.

I really havn't any idea what the value of this rifle is. Like I said, I thought it was a K31 and offered accodingly (if not high), but I can't find any "for sale" M1911 rifles. I have found a few exampes of M1911 carbines that seem to bring a premium. If anyone knows, please tell.

 

[Cosmoline]

You did real fine. Is it a 1911 or a 96/11? They 96/11's have an added on semipistol grip, whereas the 1911's have them carved out of the existing stock.

The 1911 long rifle is IMHO one of the finest rifles of the 20th century. My 96/11 was one of the most accurate rifles of any kind I've ever shot. With GP-11 it should be able to give you tight groups out at 200, 300 meters and beyond. Simply superb rifle. Don't be fooled by some of the myths about these. The action isn't weak or dangerous. It's true part of the case head is unsupported, but it will shoot GP-11 or comparable handloads all day and night with no problem. It's an engineering marvel.

http://www.swissrifles.com/

http://p090.ezboard.com/fcollectorguns35625frm1

 

[Gewehr98]

I'll bet your "new" rifle looks a lot like this one.



In which case, it's a M1911 Infantry Rifle. Congrats on your prize, it's not quite as common as the K31 S-R, but shoots every bit as well, if not better. For a rifle with a 30" barrel, it also balances quite nicely offhand.

Keep it, get a K-31 later, or I'll send you a K-31 and you send me that M1911.

 

[MachIVshooter]

Is it a 1911 or a 96/11? They 96/11's have an added on semipistol grip, whereas the 1911's have them carved out of the existing stock.

M1911, identified by the one-peice lower stock and the trigger guard shape.

I don't see how this rifle would have recieved a reputation for being weak. The locking lugs, while relatively shallow, are huge!

 

[Cosmoline]

If you look around you'll find various references to the design being weak, along with comments about how it was never battle tested. What they overlook is the very rigorous training and exercises the Swiss soldiers underwent esp. in the runup to each of the great wars. Like the Finnish Civil Guard, they kept their rifles with them and shot them regularly. Any defects in the design would have manifested themselves long before combat. And after seeing how they shoot, I would *NOT* have wanted to be the first enemy soldier to charge that border.

 

[Gewehr98]

Cosmo probably knows this quote, but it reveals the Swiss defensive mentality...

Knowing that, I wouldn't want to be on the receiving end of all those M1911 S-R rifles, either.

"Then, Your Majesty . . . ."

It has long been the custom to invite distinguished visitors from other nations to attend one’s maneuvers. This not only cultivates a certain spirit of friendship, but also serves to let the other guys know what your people can do, which may be useful in deterring aggressive intentions.

Thus, in 1912, the Swiss invited Kaiser Wilhelm II of Germany to attend their annual maneuvers.

In addition to the usually field exercises and reviews, the Swiss staged a marksmanship contest. The Kaiser was asked to present the prize to the winner, arguably the finest shot in Switzerland.

Upon congratulating the man, and awarding him his prizes, the Kaiser asked, "How many of you Swiss are there who can shoot so well."

"One hundred thousand, Your Majesty," replied the Swiss.

The Kaiser’s next question was fully in keeping with the customary clumsiness and insensitivity which gave heartburn to foreign ministers, "Suppose I were to send two hundreds thousand men against you?"

"Then, Your Majesty, we will each shoot twice," came the quick comeback, defusing a potentially embarrassing moment.

Interestingly, German planning for war with France and Russia, had long included the possibility of invading Switzerland, an undertaking that was shortly dropped from the agenda. So perhaps the invitation to the Kaiser had been prompted by a desire on the part of the Swiss to let him know that if his legions attempted to invade their country they’d meet with a deadly welcome.

 

[4fingermick]

Swiss rifles

I had an English friend years ago who was working out here. He had one of these (don't know what model Swiss it was) and the country he was living in Switzerland (I think) before he came out here and they were not allowed to own mil calibres. His was rechambered to a 300Win Mag . I didn't fancy it, but he used it enough so they must be reasonbly strong. Mick.

 

[Limeyfellow]

The M1911 is one of the finest, most accurate military surplus rifles ever made and mine is one of the prides of my collection. People praise the K31 for being accurate but these things blow them out the window and are so well balanced you hardly feel the over 10ibs of weight. You got a really good find.

Most came into the country in the 50s and 60s though since ammo was rare for them back then most haven't been fired very often and are in excellent condition. Of course up until a few years ago they weren't worth that much though when the K31s came in so cheap and plentiful their prices have skyrocketed and you can often see M1911s go for $400-600 in places and still worth the money. Mine fires <1 moa and handles like a lady, and match that up to the flood of much cheaper swiss 7.5mm surplus that was designed for the rifle specifically, wolf and others producing ammo they are more than affordable to shoot.

Feel yourself lucky.

Heres mine.

 

[slzy]

that was a good kaiser story. along with ribbentrop truly among historys most inept.

 

[Fosbery]

the country he was living in Switzerland (I think) before he came out here and they were not allowed to own mil calibres

Can't be Switzerland, no restrictions on caliber there.

 

[jd46561]

All Swiss built Firearms are of fine quality , You did well at $200.00 for a m11. Here is an example of the 96/11 and the K11 carbine.

 

[MJ]

No comment

 

[jd46561]

MJ, is your 96/11 that orange or is it a camera/ flash issue? Both rifles look nice BTW.

 

[U.S.SFC_RET]

You are truly a lucky dog, you sniffed out that one and didn't know it.

 

[MJ]

2 out of 3

I haqve handled three 96/11's plus I saw a great display in Las Vegas in 1989 of Swiss sniper rifles. Almost all had the varnish finish in that color or very close. I was amazed at the third rifle I handled some years ago with a dark oil finished stock. Could it be that rifles that spent real time with field units received oiled stock rifles and that many were stored and sealed that way? Heck I don't know. That thing shoots with both GP-11 and my humble home rolled Swiss. I'm sure the GP-11 has a big advantage way out there, nicer stuff I have never see.




But we do OK with our own at 200 to be very happy with our results..

Yes! I thought that was the way all 96/11's looked.

Cheers
MJ