Semi-auto shopping questions...

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Shinbone

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A couple questions concerning inspecting semi-autos when looking to buy...
If I'm standing at the counter in the local gun shop, and I want to look at semi-autos, for a new one, what do I need to look carefully at?
Also, same question, but for used semi-autos?
I know to check on fit and balance, but what else should be taken into consideration in the way of checking that there are no real problems going to develop with the firearm?
Thanks.
 
For starters look at the controls. Are they easily manipulated by you and other potential shooters (family)? Does it have a universal rail or do you need one? Are there sharp edges to cut you or a holster? Are you willing to care for the finish?

A few other important points would be sights and whether replacements are available if need be. Warranty should not be overlooked and finally don't consider used if you're not familiar enough with inspection to know what's important. It simply leads to more expensive more often than not. It also helps to have a small bore light just for fun.

Start with a list of qualifications for what you want and pare down the candidates. Look at your budget then go meet the candidates in person.
 
Check to make sure its unloaded, dry fire it, test the safety, and check the feed ramp for scratches and whatnot. lock the slide open and check the barrel for rust or pitting.
 
How a gun feels and how it shoot are two COMPLETELY DIFFERENT things
a gun can feel 'good' and you might shoot poorly with it
in the end you find a gun you like and can shoot well

best piece of advice is shoot it before you buy it, better to spend a little more for something you can use well and like than put up with a POS, a 100 dollars is LESS than 200 rounds in most things other than 9mm
 
Something to be considered if you reload or plan on starting, is chamber support. Many auto loaders have inadequate chamber support, which is probably the primary reason why most auto loading brass will expire much quicker than other type chamber configurations. Poorly supported cases will blow out at, or just above the case head where chamber support is dished out by the feed ramp. To check this ask the sales clerk if you can insert a fired casing into the chamber with the barrel removed so you can see how much support the chamber provides for the case head and web.

Another quality to consider is the type of barrel as to whether or not it is compatable with lead (non jacketed) bullets. Some barrel types such as the Glock require an after market barrel for those who shoot lead. This too is something that would probably be more of a concern for someone who reloads, but not always the case. To determine if a firearm is ok to shoot lead through, you might need to do a minor bit of research, or just ask the store personel for an honest answer.

I also consider ease and simplicity of take down an important element for those who may have a limited degree of firearm knowledge. Some just aren't comfortable with breaking down a firearm unless it is straight forward and simplistic. A Springfield XD would be a perfect description of what would be an easy firearm for just about anyone to break down for cleaning and general maintenance. For this, I always ask the sales clerk to demonstrate general take down for me. And thenI give it a try myself to be sure it is something I won't have difficulty performing.

Another very important factor is, making sure you have selected the right cartridge, the one that meets your expectations and needs. If your considering a firearm that you'll be carrying every time you leave the house, you'll obviously want to consider bulk and weight.

And then you must decide what cartridge suits your wants and needs. Some of us prefer a magnum wheel gun, a heavier and bulky firearm is usually the case. But different strokes for different folks, I in fact carry snubby .357 magnums nearly every time I wear. But this isn't very common any more, even with the smaller lighter revolver frames being offered by most of the major wheel gun makers, the common choice seems to be the auto loader hands down, which has nearly evolved into an industry all it's own. Now days a guy can find a reliable and generally decent auto loading pistol for $300 NIB in any cartridge.

And last but not least, unless you know and trust the person selling a used firearm, or know enough about firearms to properly inspect it for wear and function, don't consider buying used. Even myself who has been involved in the shooting sports and industry for more than 45 yrs. knows that, buying a used firearm comes with unknown risks not always detectable by visual inspection.

GS
 
DUDE
a .357 airweight for a first time shooter
do you want it to be his last time shooting?
that is a SPECIALIST gun, I don't like them, I can shoot them doesn't mean I find them fun

for a first gun I would suggest a standard size, he isn't going to carry it (doesn't have a license yet) and they are softer on the recoil do to being larger.

ONCE AGAIN
shoot it first.
no reason to pick a pretty gun (say a .357 airweight) that you HATE to shoot.
 
Hand feel. If the gun fits your hand, it comfortable to hold, and points naturally, then the gun goes on the short list. If not, scratch it. The more comfortable the guns feels the better you'll shoot it, the more you'll enjoy shooting it, and thus the more range time it'll get (and the better you'll be come).

For me that means 1911s. For some it's Glocks, for others M&Ps. I think this is by far the most important issue. Once you've decided on a style, then focus on the features: Safety, barrel length, mag release, slide lock, slide serrations, sights (pay a lot of attention to the sights and spend extra for better ones).
 
First thing to consider is your purpose for the gun. Home defense? Range gun? Plinker? Concealed carry (even part time)? Every choice involves trade-offs, every person's needs will be different. That's why everyone has a different definition of the "perfect" handgun. This first evaluation of your needs and expectations for use will narrow down the field to a range of sizes, weights, and calibers. You can then do a lot of research online to sort through the available options and get to a manageable list of handguns to evaluate for feel in the store. Hopefully once you narrow THAT list down to four or less choices (maybe more, when considering the same platform in different calibers) then you can try to rent some at the range for the final downselect.
 
gamestalker, I do reload and so chamber support would be important. Right now I'm looking at a M&P 40c. If Illinois ever gets with the rest of the country, this would be my carry.
Thanks for the many awesome replies.
 
Any new or used handgun can have or develop issues, however the odds of failure are dramatically reduced by buying only the higher quality (and unfortunately higher priced) makes and models. Names like S&W, Colt, Beretta, Ruger, Walther, Sig, Glock, and a few others will most definitely stack the deck in your favor. If buying used, get the dealer to guarantee your money back if the gun when test fired fails to perform satisfactorily.
 
If I'm standing at the counter in the local gun shop, and I want to look at semi-autos, for a new one, what do I need to look carefully at?

Honestly...the same broad scrutiny you would apply to purchasing a factory new car, bicycle, suit of clothing, or delivered furniture. In other words, just a visual once-over for obvious factory defects. If you buy brand new, and something later comes to your attention...just bring it back for repair or replacement. You wouldn't accept a new car off of the dealer's lot if it had a crease in the body work, crookedly mounted trim, a tear in the upholstery, non-functional lights, or grinding brake pads.

Today, there are so many quality guns offered by so many manufacturers, that it's difficult to go wrong, but...you can still run into the occasional lemon. You'll probably not detect a performance issue until you actually go to the range, but you can alleviate problems by inspecting for major defects at the gun shop.

So look for obvious manufacturing errors:

Loose or off centered sights

Cosmetic blemishes, scratches, finish mistakes, exterior tooling marks, etc.

Controls that fail to properly function (safety, trigger, decocker, magazine release, slide stop, etc.)

A slide that doesn't ride smoothly along the rails or seems to "catch" midway along its length of travel (could be a burr in the rails, polymer sprue interfering with a metal rail insert, or small bits of metal grist or chips left over from manufacturing)

Magazines that won't seat properly (or release freely)

Chips or scratches on grips

Anything loose or wiggly that's supposed to be staked or screwed down tight

Obvious burrs in metal at muzzle crown, along rails, on sights, on feed ramps, etc.

Signs that the weapon has been dropped (dinged sights, butt, muzzle, grips, or trigger guards)

Things that are visually out of kilter...waves in what is supposed to be a flat mirror polish, bends in what are supposed to be straight lines on a slide, crookedly machined parts, unevenly polished finish or "smeared" rollmarks, huge gaps in fit (like one side of slide to rail fit being vastly different from the opposite side...when looking at the rear of the slide).

Make sure the caliber markings (on the slide or barrel) actually match what is advertised on the tag or box. It happens. Hmmnn...Why wont my .40 cartridges fit in this new weapon? Oops! Apparently this is actually a 9mm!

Inspect the weapon visually from all angles paying close attention to sights, muzzle, bottom of butt, trigger guard, top of slide, rear of slide/grip, and bottom of slide. Lock the slide to the rear and inspect everything you can see. I rarely ask to disassemble a new gun, but if you must, have the seller field strip it for you so that you can look at the interior components. Any scratches created or problems encountered are his...not yours. This isn't the time to prove you are an armorer.

From some companies, factory test firing will leave powder residue, so the fact that the weapon is slightly "dirty" does not indicate that it isn't new. On the other hand, it shouldn't be covered in firing residue and have a filthy bore. Just a smudge of black residue should be finger wipe-able from off the breech face, chamber, muzzle, and feed ramp area.

Inspect the weapon for signs of rust. Rare with a new pistol...but it happens.

Inspect all screws for signs of marring or rust, especially on grips and adjustable sights. Some idiot may have dinged them up while playing with it in the stock room.

Inspect the bore. Lock the slide back (after properly clearing) and look down the barrel. If you don't have a mini-flashlight or bore light, just use the overhead room lighting to take a glance. Stick your thumb or index finger into the open ejection port and use your finger nail to reflect ambient light back towards your eye (looking down the muzzle). An easy trick to do and you are merely looking for obvious bore defects: rust, major scratches inside the bore, burrs, damage to the muzzle crown, etc.). Anything that shouldn't be there. A slight hint of copper colored smear (from bullet jacketing) on the inside of the bore just indicates the weapon was test fired at the factory. 99% of the time, you are going to see a clean, bright, and shiny bore with crisp lands and grooves. Inspecting the bore should take you all of about 5 seconds.

Ask the seller if you can dry fire the piece. Clear it, then point the weapon safely at the floor or other safe direction, and try the trigger a time or two. Also test the safety (if it has one) by trying to fire with the safety applied.

Ensure that your dealer is including the correct complement of factory spare magazines. Some weapons come with one. Some with two. Some with three. Unscrupulous shops have been known to parse spare $40-$50 magazines from factory boxes...then sell them separately. This requires a little due diligence on your part...easily done by researching here on the forum or at the manufacturers website before you buy. If your proposed new purchase is supposed to come with two factory magazines, but the dealer is only showing you one...you might want to ask where the other magazine is.

If the pistol of your dreams feels like crap in your hands...find something else. You'll never shoot it well if it doesn't fit you comfortably. Doesn't matter who made it, how much it costs, or how much the gun magazines have raved about it. Find something else.

To me, the single most important thing you can do is to resist impulse buying with only a cursory inspection. Have an idea of what particular model you are considering before you come into the shop. Compare the field by trying several weapons to hand. After looking at a weapon, you might want to go home to do some more leisurely comparison on the internet. Then decide if the weapon you were enamored with earlier in the day is actually the one you want.

Don't get buck fever while standing at the gun counter. Even if it's exactly what you always wanted, is in good shape, and at a decent price...walk away and look at something else for a few minutes. Give yourself time to think about it before you slap down cash or credit card. Then, go back and make a second (closer) mechanical inspection. Upon further reflection, if it fits your needs, fits your hand, fits your budget, and makes you happy to hold it...buy it. :)

It's just shopping.
 
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Noting your signature line, don't buy an R1 no matter how tempting. I don't generally swear off a product but the Remington 1911 has several poorly spec'd frame cuts that aren't an easy (or cheap) fix. These include an over-cut VIS and frame ramp.

Carry on.
 
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