Semi-auto...with micro red dot....and life of red dot?

[Orion8472]

So there are a lot of new guns out there that can accept a micro red dot site....and it got me wondering about something. I was wondering about the life expectancy of the electronics on slides that are moving very quickly, snapping back and forth between firing,...slamming itself from ejection of casing to feeding next round...metal on metal,......etc.

It makes me wonder how the electronics...and even the mechanism to hold zero...withstand that type of abuse?

 

[PistoleroWadcutterGANG]

Optics have been in place and used for USPSA / IDPA and many other shooting disciplines at this very moment. A lot of competitors have well over 5 times the round count with comp and practice that normal shooting will endure. Good name brands hold up and even some of the cheaper doctor or Amazon what nots seem to be hanging tough. At this time, I feel it isn't a significant worry. I travel in Arkansas, Missouri, Oklahoma, Kansas, E. Texas, Mississippi for various shooting fun comps. I have never met someone who's RDS gave up the ghost. So, I'd say your pretty safe from it. Some people have had RDS on their guns since AIMPOINT invented them. Still going strong. I know of 8 bullseye shooters that are still using their Tasco Pro points 10, 15, 20 years after buying and mounting. Let alone all the ULTRADOT users in NRA Precision Pistol. Get one use it you'll be just fine.

 

[Orion8472]

Thanks. I figured that is the case. It's just amazing that the electronics can handle it. I recently got an Echelon and may consider getting an RDS for it. Not sure which I'll get. Don't want to spend too much money...but not "too little", of course. I have a Burris Fastfire 2 on my Taurus TX-22 Competition. Might consider something a bit better than it, if I get one for the Echelon.

 

[tarosean]

Optics have been in place and used for USPSA / IDPA and many other shooting disciplines at this very moment. A lot of competitors have well over 5 times the round count with comp and practice that normal shooting will endure.

Open gun RDS's do not reciprocate with the slide. Optics classes outside of "Open" are fairly new. I tried USPSA CO when it was provisional and saw lots of people have issues. (unknown dots)

I forget his name/handle on Youtube but he has torture tested many pistol red dots. I only own Trijicon and DeltaPoints. I would buy a Holosun 507 if I had use for it.

 

[PistoleroWadcutterGANG]

Open gun RDS's do not reciprocate with the slide. Optics classes outside of "Open" are fairly new. I tried USPSA CO when it was provisional and saw lots of people have issues. (unknown dots)

I forget his name/handle on Youtube but he has torture tested many pistol red dots. I only own Trijicon and DeltaPoints. I would buy a Holosun 507 if I had use for it.

Splitting hairs, the point being that many people are using RDS for many years without issue.

 

[tarosean]

Splitting hairs, the point being that many people are using RDS for many years without issue.

It is a huge a hair to split.. something mounted above the reciprocating action is more like a rifle. A Dot subjected to the forces of slide reciprocation changes things dramatically.

 

[PistoleroWadcutterGANG]

It is a huge a hair to split.. something mounted above the reciprocating action is more like a rifle. A Dot subjected to the forces of slide reciprocation changes things dramatically.

No not really. Many rear sight dovetail mounts have been in use for years on glocks and other models. I've used the strike glock on a 40 smith 35 for years. I disagree with your colorization.

 

[epags]

Optics have been in place and used for USPSA / IDPA and many other shooting disciplines at this very moment. A lot of competitors have well over 5 times the round count with comp and practice that normal shooting will endure. Good name brands hold up and even some of the cheaper doctor or Amazon what nots seem to be hanging tough. At this time, I feel it isn't a significant worry. I travel in Arkansas, Missouri, Oklahoma, Kansas, E. Texas, Mississippi for various shooting fun comps. I have never met someone who's RDS gave up the ghost. So, I'd say your pretty safe from it. Some people have had RDS on their guns since AIMPOINT invented them. Still going strong. I know of 8 bullseye shooters that are still using their Tasco Pro points 10, 15, 20 years after buying and mounting. Let alone all the ULTRADOT users in NRA Precision Pistol. Get one use it you'll be just fine.

However, there is a big price spread on red dots. I see prices as high as $1,000+ range (cough) and as low as $20+/- (humm). I suspect the quality/resilience to shock is a function of the price. Personally I use iron sights on handguns and medium quality scopes on rifles since I do not shoot competitively.

 

[9mmepiphany]

I recently got an Echelon and may consider getting an RDS for it. Not sure which I'll get. Don't want to spend too much money...but not "too little",

In the Action pistol field...where they really work the red dots pretty hard...Trijicon is pretty much the name other red dots are compared to. The RMR is designed for LE use and the SRO for competition.

If you don't want to spend quite that much, the Holosun 507 model also have proven very reliable and it has features, such as ease of battery replacement, which are superior to the Trijicon. I prefer the HE506Comp-GR

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[StrykerByte.45]

Swampfox are utterly reliable as well.

 

[Styx]

So there are a lot of new guns out there that can accept a micro red dot site....and it got me wondering about something. I was wondering about the life expectancy of the electronics on slides that are moving very quickly, snapping back and forth between firing,...slamming itself from ejection of casing to feeding next round...metal on metal,......etc.

It makes me wonder how the electronics...and even the mechanism to hold zero...withstand that type of abuse?

I mean, our cars, airplanes, boats, submarines, rockets, missiles, etc are all full of electronics, and they work just finebin more extreme environments.

The electronics encased in aluminum (and sometimes rubber) shells don't take much abuse.

 

[tarosean]

I mean, our cars, airplanes, boats, submarines, rockets, missiles, etc are all full of electronics, and they work just finebin more extreme environments.

Riddle me this.. How much is invested in those vs Handgun Optics?

 

[Styx]

Riddle me this.. How much is invested in those vs Handgun Optics?

Being that it's more of it on the larger list of items, I reckon a lot more. Quality optics use simular metals and technology, but on a smaller scale.

Militaries, law enforcement, Special Forces, competition shooters, and tens of thousands of civilians have been using red dots for years on pistols, rifles, and shotguns. When it comes to competition shooting, I don't know about USPSA, but IDPA's "Carry Optics" division has been around for over 5 years now. Those who participate in the division have to have tens of thousands through their examples.

 

[Tom-R2]

Not a very scientific study, but I've seen more broken iron sights than I have broken RDS. I have two Holosun (507 and a 407) and one Trijicon RDS. I like them and trust them. I have zero issues if someone else doesn't like/want one. The big thing is to be good with what you have.

 

[jjones45]

Modern day technology has made red dot optics as reliable as they ever been. Sage Dynamics has log of all the dots he test and round counts until they die. He list the failures at what round count. I’d stick with trijicon and holosun if I was really worried about it, but even some of those had some kind of failure at high round counts and his extreme testing. Seems the most probable failure will be losing battery connection or loss of zero that can’t be maintained. Under regular usage (no torture test) I’d say most red dots from reputable manufacturers should be considered very reliable. I’ve been running a holosun 507c on my 10mm 510 tactical and it’s been reliable and held zero over 1000 rounds so far. I’m waiting on my trijicon rmr hd to be shipped by optics planet when it finally is back in stock and I plan on running a lot of rounds on that one.

 

[jjones45]

Here’s a good read for you, optics durability starts at page 17. He also list failures in the field from law enforcement he trains. The one trijicon rmr type 2 has over 33,000 rounds with no failures. And these are extreme conditions, not just ccw or competition.

https://www.sagedynamics.org/_files/ugd/7dc128_6377087e72264cd18dbcb04eea4686ce.pdf

 

[Nuclear]

I started using a slide mounted RDS about 15+ years ago. I started with a Burris Fastfire II, and I killed three of them before Burris stopped replacing them. Next was a Vortex Venom, which went back to the factory, got replaced, and now resides atop a PCC. Then a Holosun 507C, which also had to be replaced, but then lasted until I changed pistols. I’m now using a Romeo1pro on a Sig 320, which hasn’t failed (yet). I don’t abuse them, I’m only shooting standard pressure 45ACP and 9mm. But I do shoot 100-150 rounds a week. So say 3 years/15000 rounds life expectancy on average. But my observation is the mean time to failure is actually getting longer as time goes on. I don’t have any personal experience with RMRs, but they can and do fail, just not as often.

 

[JEBruns]

I had a lot of problems with the Sig Romeo that came on their RX guns. I bought a few of those guns 6 years or so ago, and had issues with every one of those Romeos. Even the one on my Legion RX. Some of the replacement Romeos had issues too. Sig was good about replacing them, and it was a wide spread problem for them. But I always say the best warranty is the one you don't have to use. I did finally get good ones, but it was a battle getting there. I think the new Romeo Pro has finally solved most of that for Sig.

I've since bought Vortex Venom's, Holosun 507K and a couple of SRO's. No problems at all with those. The SRO on my Shadow 2 Orange has shot at least 200 rounds a week for 2 years now and is as solid as a rock.

 

[hemiram]

A friend of mine has cheapo red dots from $40 to $300 or so on all kinds of guns, AR's, AK, some other rifles, and a lot of handguns, and from the cheapest to the most expensive, the main differences are battery life, and does the RDS have to be removed to replace it. He and his son are pretty rough with the AR's, they shoot them a lot, and the body of a couple of them look pretty sad, they still work great. I have a R/GDS on my AR that was $40 on sale, I don't remember the brand, but it's made in Russia, and it works great at nearly 10 years old. It doesn't have any auto shut off, so if I forget to turn it off, it's dead or soon will be when I pick up the gun to shoot. It's pretty big though. It's got a large body with big lenses on each end, like 40MM. And battery life stinks in general.

 

[lysanderxiii]

So there are a lot of new guns out there that can accept a micro red dot site....and it got me wondering about something. I was wondering about the life expectancy of the electronics on slides that are moving very quickly, snapping back and forth between firing,...slamming itself from ejection of casing to feeding next round...metal on metal,......etc.

It makes me wonder how the electronics...and even the mechanism to hold zero...withstand that type of abuse?

Depends on the quality of the red-dot.

 

[doubleh]

My main use has been on 2 rimfire pistols and have had no problems and didn't expect to. I started with low cost ADE to see if I even liked the things and after several years it is still working. 22s are really no test of durability from mechanical stress though. I only have one on a full sized 1911 in 9 mm and it has done it's job but It hasn't been shot enough to say yea or nay.