mljdeckard
Member
Para Ordnance recently sent me a shipping label for a return. It was labeled; "Metal Parts". Worked for me and Fedex just fine.
shipping to Ruger - my experience at fedex today
- Thread starter thomis
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dogtown tom
Member
No it doesn't. Federal law only requires notification to a common carrier when shipping interstate to a NONLICENSEE (which with only a couple of narrow exceptions is a felony)
You would be amazed at how many Einsteins ship a gun in the factory box with a giant green REMINGTON on the side.
478.31 says (in part):
jimmyraythomason
Member
Thanks for the correction dogtown tom.
Elkins45
Member
If the gun is sufficiently broken (or a real lemon to begin with) then they may be secretly hoping the carrier loses it, assuming they declared it at a sufficiently high value.
mljdeckard
Member
I had just received a new DVR from Direct TV, and not only did the case fit in nicely, the egg carton ends slipped on the ends of the pistol box perfectly.
mgmorden
Member
dogtowntom is correct. Notification is only necessary if shipping to a non-FFL (only legal time you'd be doing that AFAIK is if you were shipping it to yourself to avoid transporting through certain areas).
Other than that by law they don't need to know. When I've shipped lately I've just shipped regular ground in an inconspicuous box.
Realistically, in my entire life I've had only 1 package that was destroyed in transit. Another was lost for a few months but then located and delivered as expected. I typically get at least 3-4 packages a week and sometimes 10 or more. Things rarely go wrong.
Just kinda weigh the cost of the gun vs the cost of the extra postage. If I'm shipping a $2k Les Baer back to the factory its going to be declared, insured, and overnighted. A $400 polymer gun though I'll take the risk on rather than pay additional shipping that totals 15-20% of the replacement cost of the gun.
Other than that by law they don't need to know. When I've shipped lately I've just shipped regular ground in an inconspicuous box.
Realistically, in my entire life I've had only 1 package that was destroyed in transit. Another was lost for a few months but then located and delivered as expected. I typically get at least 3-4 packages a week and sometimes 10 or more. Things rarely go wrong.
Just kinda weigh the cost of the gun vs the cost of the extra postage. If I'm shipping a $2k Les Baer back to the factory its going to be declared, insured, and overnighted. A $400 polymer gun though I'll take the risk on rather than pay additional shipping that totals 15-20% of the replacement cost of the gun.
Sheepdog1968
Member
Agreed regarding overnight being mandatory. Might even be a law requiring it. I've shipped pistols quite a few times. Always needs overnight and depending whose at the counter mild to no reaction.
Long arms which I've shipped a fair bit as well over the years can go by ground.
Either way just make sure you get the insurance, just in case it goes missing.
BSA1
member
My local Fed-Ex has a "Don't ask, don't tell" policy. They have never asked what the contents were and since they don't ask I don't tell.
The other shipping method for handguns I use is USPS via a local dealer who charges me $ 50.00. I only do it if the receipent requests it.
UPS's has a very bad attitude towards guns. I was at the UPS hub once shipping a firearm and questioned the clerk about why I had to pay the higher rate when dealers and manufacturers ship at the lower ground rate. The clerk said he didn't know but pointed out the Head of Security who was on his way on out the building. When I asked him the same question all he said was "They are not suppose to" NOT "It is illegal and they are breaking the law."
My point is as dogtown tom pointed out is UPS and the O.P.'s Fed-Ex is using confusion about BATF regulations to extort higher shipping fees for customers.
The other shipping method for handguns I use is USPS via a local dealer who charges me $ 50.00. I only do it if the receipent requests it.
UPS's has a very bad attitude towards guns. I was at the UPS hub once shipping a firearm and questioned the clerk about why I had to pay the higher rate when dealers and manufacturers ship at the lower ground rate. The clerk said he didn't know but pointed out the Head of Security who was on his way on out the building. When I asked him the same question all he said was "They are not suppose to" NOT "It is illegal and they are breaking the law."
My point is as dogtown tom pointed out is UPS and the O.P.'s Fed-Ex is using confusion about BATF regulations to extort higher shipping fees for customers.
I went to a Fed-ex and the young ahem behind the counter insisted I had to be an FFL to ship a gun back to the manufacturer for some work. No discussion would budge this person. Thus, I went a couple of miles to another with no problem, except the cost. The manager at location 2 called location 1 to chew them out.
I also had some printing being done at location 1, so the young person said I could pick it up. I told them to keep it - too bad. Not paid for and I don't buy from folks who don't understand their own procedures.
I also had some printing being done at location 1, so the young person said I could pick it up. I told them to keep it - too bad. Not paid for and I don't buy from folks who don't understand their own procedures.
Lj1941
Member
Same for me
I had the same experience with UPS.The didn't bat an eye,but it cost $70+ plus to ship overnight to Taurus in Florida.
I had the same experience with UPS.The didn't bat an eye,but it cost $70+ plus to ship overnight to Taurus in Florida.
I had the same reaction as the OP a few years ago when trying to ship a revolver back to Charter Arms for work. The guy at the UPS satellite office almost jumped out of his skin when I told him it was a handgun. He just kept saying "No way" until I was out the door.
I then went to the UPS hub location and sent it without any problems at all. I think it cost me $43 for overnight service.
I then went to the UPS hub location and sent it without any problems at all. I think it cost me $43 for overnight service.
Thiokol
member
You will hear a lot of geniuses tell you that they ship handguns via ground service and declare the contents as "tools" or "machine parts" or that you don't have to tell the carrier that it's a gun. That is very bad advice. While it's not a law that you have to ship via overnight service, it is part of the UPS and the Fedex tariff. If you violate their tariff and your gun is lost or stolen, you're SOL if you try to file a loss/damage claim. Additionally, you have to ship from a UPS or a Fedex hub as they will not accept handgun shipments at Fedex Office or the UPS store and you can't drop them in a pickup box.
As to declaring the contents of your package being a handgun, that is a Federal law. Click on this link http://atf.gov/firearms/faq/unlicensed-persons.html and select item #8.
As to declaring the contents of your package being a handgun, that is a Federal law. Click on this link http://atf.gov/firearms/faq/unlicensed-persons.html and select item #8.
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mgmorden
Member
That's a FAQ page (ie, not a law), not the statute. The statutes referenced by the very page (478.31) state otherwise.
The actual law has already been posted:
Notification is only required if you're shipping to someone other than those mentioned. If you're returning a firearm for service it is going to a licensed manufacturer and so the requirement of notification doesn't apply.
Thiokol
member
Then take it up the the BATFE if you have an issue what they have posted.
mgmorden
Member
There's no need to. If any legal issues arise I don't have to worry about their FAQ page - only actual laws. The law says I'm good, so I'm good. If the goal was to explicitly require that you always notify then the entire portion in bold above could be completely removed and that would make it so, but the bold portion is there and does have meaning.
Thiokol
member
You'll be good to go up until the time that someone tries to prosecute the issue. So would it be easier, not to mention less costly, to simply declare that you're shipping a handgun/ or wind up out of pocket trying to defend your position if it ever came to court?
mgmorden
Member
I go by the same logic I used in the reasoning for the insurance scenario above - nothing is likely to happen, and if it does I'm legal per the statute anyways.
To suggest otherwise is kinda like saying that if a cop says you should let him into your home without a warrant that you should just do it, because even though the law states otherwise its easier to comply.
The FAQ as is is stated isn't technically wrong - more of an omission. The statute it references DOES say that you have to notify the carrier - except that the statute also lists some exceptions when you don't. It just so happens that those exceptions cover about 95% of the scenarios when you'd be mailing the firearm via common carrier in the first place.
orionengnr
Member
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Before you go to the FedEx/UPS facility, go to their website, find the part about shipping firearms, print a copy and take it with you.
That will help Nervous Nellie (and/or her supervisor) get her head screwed on straight, and will save you all a lot of time and frustration.
That will help Nervous Nellie (and/or her supervisor) get her head screwed on straight, and will save you all a lot of time and frustration.
oneounceload
member
Going to their ACTUAL facility, (not the franchise old Mailbox Etc. store), I have never had an issue. You don't need to declare, when they pull up the address, it tells them exactly who you are shipping to anyway. Just use initials, NOT the name
ex: Sturm Ruger becomes SR&Co. at whichever address, for S&W, you use SAW, etc....
Shipping without telling is risking your gun for no reason, you're better off just using your FFL instead
ex: Sturm Ruger becomes SR&Co. at whichever address, for S&W, you use SAW, etc....
Shipping without telling is risking your gun for no reason, you're better off just using your FFL instead
Sauer Grapes
Member
The FFLs I know don't tell the shipper what's in box, hence their low price. I'll bet if you give your gun to an FFL, he isn't declaring it a firearm. Your no better off than just shipping it yourself.
Guys sometimes whine at me for charging so much for shipping. I tell them, I can ship it ''snail mail'' and not insure it and if it gets lost, your out a gun and your money.
Bud's guns offers free shipping, what a lot of people don't know is, they don't disclose and they don't insure the package. The gun gets stolen or lost, your sunk!
Guys sometimes whine at me for charging so much for shipping. I tell them, I can ship it ''snail mail'' and not insure it and if it gets lost, your out a gun and your money.
Bud's guns offers free shipping, what a lot of people don't know is, they don't disclose and they don't insure the package. The gun gets stolen or lost, your sunk!
BSA1
member
Thiokol,
I have a C&R license and ALL of the firearms I have purchased have came to me shipped by regular ground.
Now don't you suppose that all of those major distributors that ship hundreds, if not thousands, of firearms a week would know exactly what the law and BATF regulations state?
Please post links or case citations of anyone being convicted of violating Federal law by not declaring the contents of the package and shipping a firearm by common carrier regular ground.
The real reason UPS requires firearms be shipped overnight is they can't control theft by their employees. So rather than investigate and fire dishonest employees they stick it to their customers with high shipping rates.
I have a C&R license and ALL of the firearms I have purchased have came to me shipped by regular ground.
Now don't you suppose that all of those major distributors that ship hundreds, if not thousands, of firearms a week would know exactly what the law and BATF regulations state?
Please post links or case citations of anyone being convicted of violating Federal law by not declaring the contents of the package and shipping a firearm by common carrier regular ground.
The real reason UPS requires firearms be shipped overnight is they can't control theft by their employees. So rather than investigate and fire dishonest employees they stick it to their customers with high shipping rates.
dogtown tom
Member
Nope, no such law.
Dealers and manufacturers don't get an exemption from UPS or FedEx tariffs.....if we ship handguns, they go overnight just like you mortals. BTW, ANYONE can ship rifles or shotguns via Ground, not just dealers.
For the kabillionth time on this forum :banghead:.......ain't no such Federal law. Instead of taking the ATF FAQ answer as law.......read the ACTUAL LAW they cite below the FAQ "answer".
That was done years ago and ATF admitted their error....but have yet to correct it. Search THR and you'll find the letter.
wally
Member
Try going in late Friday afternoon, past their "overnight" deadline, I don't think they can charge you for overnight that they know they can't deliver.
Worked for me sending back my cracked slide EAA Witness. I should have been able to just cheaply send the upper, but EAA wouldn't have it That's another story.
Its why good customer service sends you a pre-paid label S&W shipping to S&W costs very little 2nd day.
Worked for me sending back my cracked slide EAA Witness. I should have been able to just cheaply send the upper, but EAA wouldn't have it
That's another story.Its why good customer service sends you a pre-paid label S&W shipping to S&W costs very little 2nd day.
Here's something that might interest those of you who advocate not informing the carrier that you are shipping a firearm. Scroll down and note what "Quinn" was convicted of. http://www.ledgernews.com/news/top_...cle_6eab9e28-ba87-5d44-aa0b-999797a90609.html
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