I have been thinking about a 1911 lately. I like the way they look. In the hand they feel okay, if not slightly oblong. I recently picked up a Sig P220 and like the shape of the grip a little more. It holds one more shot. I can get it in DA/SA. And then another kicker was demonstrated in my recent CCW course. The instructor took apart a 1911, to show us how to clean it, and I was a little surprised at how much simpler modern semi-autos are to break down. The 1911 had about 1.2 gazillion steps. So what do you all think of the Sig, and how easy/difficult is it to breakdown? How does it shoot (ergonomics wise) compared to 1911s? I'm new to the .45 game but I'm looking for an all-metal one. Feel free to throw out other suggestions for all-metal .45s.
Sig P220 vs. 1911
- Thread starter cowssurf
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I won't stump for one or the other, I love and own both.
I will point out however, that while the 1911 takes a moment longer to field strip, try detail stripping a Sig sometime. The real "guts" of the sig are far more complex, tool intensive, and require (imho) more frequent care.
I will point out however, that while the 1911 takes a moment longer to field strip, try detail stripping a Sig sometime. The real "guts" of the sig are far more complex, tool intensive, and require (imho) more frequent care.
james_bond
Member
Is detail stripping a 1911 easy?
Lonestar49
Member
Tough Call
...
For me personally, knowing what I know now with my full size P220 and my 2 1911's, for first time owner, first time gun, I'd steer ya towards the best of both worlds IMO, a Sig P220 Carry SAO, especially for "ease of disassembly, inspection, cleaning, and reassembly, along with, no teething problems with Sigs and what they will shoot/eat, and what they won't.. they just start shooting, accurate out of the box, and keep on going..
So my best and easiest road to take choice for ya would be either Sig P220 Carry model (shoots just as good as a full size, no difference in recoil IMO) but offers less barrel and slide length along with SAO, cock and lock, OR DA/SA is your best choice. DAK is for later, maybe.. But if you go DA/SA, then your next gun, and change, should be with SAO, you'll see.. lol
BUT.. With a little bit of time, in disassembly, inspection, cleanings, and reassembly of my 1911's, they really are very easy, but that is not an easy first, second time, event that comes easy, as does the Sig from the get go.
But, knowing what I have "learned" and "experienced", both in grip feel, and ease of accuracy and finding out what my 1911's like and don't like, I give both guns, a big thumbs up.. Both guns are GREAT platforms, shooters, accurate, ccw or otherwise..
Best of luck, but you are right in that
in seeing, and trying to remember the take-down and get "the feel" down, and right, and easy, with a 1911, first out of the gate, so to speak.. (but the manual does explain it well IMO)
Enjoy, your choice
Ls
...
For me personally, knowing what I know now with my full size P220 and my 2 1911's, for first time owner, first time gun, I'd steer ya towards the best of both worlds IMO, a Sig P220 Carry SAO, especially for "ease of disassembly, inspection, cleaning, and reassembly, along with, no teething problems with Sigs and what they will shoot/eat, and what they won't.. they just start shooting, accurate out of the box, and keep on going..
So my best and easiest road to take choice for ya would be either Sig P220 Carry model (shoots just as good as a full size, no difference in recoil IMO) but offers less barrel and slide length along with SAO, cock and lock, OR DA/SA is your best choice. DAK is for later, maybe.. But if you go DA/SA, then your next gun, and change, should be with SAO, you'll see.. lol
BUT.. With a little bit of time, in disassembly, inspection, cleanings, and reassembly of my 1911's, they really are very easy, but that is not an easy first, second time, event that comes easy, as does the Sig from the get go.
But, knowing what I have "learned" and "experienced", both in grip feel, and ease of accuracy and finding out what my 1911's like and don't like, I give both guns, a big thumbs up.. Both guns are GREAT platforms, shooters, accurate, ccw or otherwise..
Best of luck, but you are right in that
in seeing, and trying to remember the take-down and get "the feel" down, and right, and easy, with a 1911, first out of the gate, so to speak.. (but the manual does explain it well IMO)Enjoy, your choice
Ls
VARifleman
Member
It's not bad, takes a little practice and reading what to do.
Personally, I think a sig is clunky and don't like the controls.
BlindJustice
Member
Keep reading threads and find out stuff...
That's what I like about The HIgh Road Forum. I didn't know the Sig 220 is a more tool intensive etc. detail strip job.
Just to throw in a 3rd possible candidate for the O.P.
How About the CZ 97
It has DA/SA as well as a thumb safety instead of a
decocker so the Cocked & Locked option is available from
the first round or if a pause in shooting engage the thumb
safety and no bother with the decocker.
How does the CZ 97 compare in terms of
* Field stripping
* Detail stripping
CZs are known for good accuracy
Oh, and it's a 10 shot clip.
That's what I like about The HIgh Road Forum. I didn't know the Sig 220 is a more tool intensive etc. detail strip job.
Just to throw in a 3rd possible candidate for the O.P.
How About the CZ 97
It has DA/SA as well as a thumb safety instead of a
decocker so the Cocked & Locked option is available from
the first round or if a pause in shooting engage the thumb
safety and no bother with the decocker.
How does the CZ 97 compare in terms of
* Field stripping
* Detail stripping
CZs are known for good accuracy
Oh, and it's a 10 shot clip.
High Planes Drifter
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I have a Sig 220, and a 1911. The Sig is a great gun, no doubt. It is a bit chunky tho. I would rather the 1911 for carry. My 1911 and my Sig have both been extremely reliable. I rather the controls of the 1911, and the way it sits in the hand better. Also, 1911 mags are easier to load.
BlindJustice
Member
* Are the SIg P220 mags 7 rd or 8 rd - Factory or Aftermarket Options?
* Seems to me looking at the dimensions of the CZ 97 it must be a single
stack magazine, since the overall height over the 1911 is enough to give it
the 10 rd capacity but it has the same width as the other double stack CZ75/85 siblings at 1.4" I noted on the SIg Arms site they list their fairly new SIg 1911 offering as having a 1.37" width.
Oh, I found a prior THR thread of CZ 97 vs P220 at
http://www.thehighroad.org/showthread.php?t=55013
Enjoy - I'm happy with my S&W 1911 - which begs the question for the
O.P. to specify since 1911s come in so many flavors but there is only
one SIg P220 - which generic type of 1911 do we compare it to?
I have the S&W 1911, with a lot of nice standarde extras
then you can go up market or
down market to say a Mil-SPec Springer.
But the 1911 has certainly earned it's status as
the yardstick which others are judged by.
* Seems to me looking at the dimensions of the CZ 97 it must be a single
stack magazine, since the overall height over the 1911 is enough to give it
the 10 rd capacity but it has the same width as the other double stack CZ75/85 siblings at 1.4" I noted on the SIg Arms site they list their fairly new SIg 1911 offering as having a 1.37" width.
Oh, I found a prior THR thread of CZ 97 vs P220 at
http://www.thehighroad.org/showthread.php?t=55013
Enjoy - I'm happy with my S&W 1911 - which begs the question for the
O.P. to specify since 1911s come in so many flavors but there is only
one SIg P220 - which generic type of 1911 do we compare it to?
I have the S&W 1911, with a lot of nice standarde extras
then you can go up market or
down market to say a Mil-SPec Springer.
But the 1911 has certainly earned it's status as
the yardstick which others are judged by.
Lonestar49
Member
From the factory.. P220 mags
...
They, least mine came with, come with two, 8+1 mags (8) and one 10+1 mag (10) from the factory..
Ls
...
They, least mine came with, come with two, 8+1 mags (8) and one 10+1 mag (10) from the factory..
Ls
Quiet
Member
SIG P-220 Carry SAO.
Cause I grew up shooting 1911s but perfer the reliability of the SIG.
Cause I grew up shooting 1911s but perfer the reliability of the SIG.
AK103K
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This is the biggest advantage to the SIG's. Most 1911's these days are hit or miss, and its amazing how many people seem to think its normal to have to break a gun in, with your time and ammo no less.
Detail stripping either is pretty simple once youve done one or two.
The older factory mags were 7 rounders, the new mags are 8.
A full size P220 is actually a Commander sized gun. They all carry the same, even the full sized 1911's, and I really doubt you would notice any diference.
alaskanativeson
Member
The Sig would get my vote.
Even though I'm not a particular fan of the 1911, I'll not speak evil of it either. They've been a "been there, done that" gun since before my father, a WWII vet, was born. A good many elite organizations use them. I just don't really like the way they feel in my hand, I don't like the arrangement of the controls and I don't like the way they come apart. Great gun, just not my cuppa joe.
The Sig is a fantastic firearm. remarkably reliable and accurate, excellent quality, good ergonomics for me. I love the ones I've shot and my friends who own them can't say enough good about them.
Really it comes down to which you are more comfortable with. Feel both and if possible, shoot both. That will tell you a lot. Either gun would do well for you.
Even though I'm not a particular fan of the 1911, I'll not speak evil of it either. They've been a "been there, done that" gun since before my father, a WWII vet, was born. A good many elite organizations use them. I just don't really like the way they feel in my hand, I don't like the arrangement of the controls and I don't like the way they come apart. Great gun, just not my cuppa joe.
The Sig is a fantastic firearm. remarkably reliable and accurate, excellent quality, good ergonomics for me. I love the ones I've shot and my friends who own them can't say enough good about them.
Really it comes down to which you are more comfortable with. Feel both and if possible, shoot both. That will tell you a lot. Either gun would do well for you.
Phil DeGraves
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You can get 8 round magazines for the 1911 as well, so there really is no round advantage of the SIG over the 1911. The Sig is okay; it's a good reliable accurate gun. But I like the 1911 better.
robctwo
Member
I have owned the 220 and some 1911s. Bought the Sig first. Stainless version. Accurate, reliable and and attractive. I was trying to avoid 1911s. Once I bought a 1911, I bought a few more. Found I wasn't shooting the Sig at all and sold it to a good home. I have small hands and the 1911s fit me better than the 220, even with the slim grips.
Here's my 220 with the slim grips sitting next to a 1911
I also found that for range used I prefer the SA triggers. My carry guns vary.
Here's my 220 with the slim grips sitting next to a 1911
I also found that for range used I prefer the SA triggers. My carry guns vary.
usp_fan
Member
Most of what I would say has already been said. I own both. I carry the P220 more often than the 1911. It is lighter and carries 1 more round. The 1911 is slightly flatter and the grip is somewhat smaller even with slim grips on the 220.
As far as accuracy goes, both of mine are pretty good. I can't tell much of a difference except the 1911 has a more gentle recoil cycle--likely due to it's weight.
As far as accuracy goes, both of mine are pretty good. I can't tell much of a difference except the 1911 has a more gentle recoil cycle--likely due to it's weight.
Technosavant
Member
I've never found a 1911 to have a difficult or involved field strip at all.
The Sig 220 is a good gun. A 1911 is a good gun (provided it is properly made). One major issue with 1911s is the amount of hand fitting required in its construction; if it isn't done exactly right, you're going to have issues. The Sig is probably a better choice for out of the box shooting, but quite honestly, I don't know of any gun I'd trust defensively out of the box. I've even had revolvers not work 100% out of the box, and those tend to be more reliable than autoloaders (no magazine issues).
As always, go with what feels nice and you shoot well; I don't think you can go wrong either way.
The Sig 220 is a good gun. A 1911 is a good gun (provided it is properly made). One major issue with 1911s is the amount of hand fitting required in its construction; if it isn't done exactly right, you're going to have issues. The Sig is probably a better choice for out of the box shooting, but quite honestly, I don't know of any gun I'd trust defensively out of the box. I've even had revolvers not work 100% out of the box, and those tend to be more reliable than autoloaders (no magazine issues).
As always, go with what feels nice and you shoot well; I don't think you can go wrong either way.
waterhouse
Member
I wouldn't let this steer you away from the 1911. Field stripping a Sig is almost as easy as it gets, but field stripping a 1911 isn't exactly rocket science.
Depending on who makes your 1911, both will be reliable and accurate. I find them both to be very comfortable to hold. I like the SA trigger on the 1911 more than the SA trigger on the 220. Either way you've got two good candidates.
evan price
Member
I personally prefer a Sig 220 over any 1911. I like DA/SA decocker. I like the way the gun feels. Its accurate and reliable without fail.
As far as full stripping goes- not needed very often. I regularly remove the feedramp block from my P220 to clean it better and that's a snap- no tools required.
As far as full stripping goes- not needed very often. I regularly remove the feedramp block from my P220 to clean it better and that's a snap- no tools required.
RobertFBurnett
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To me also it depends on which 1911, I love my Kimber Gold Match, but thought the Sprinfield Mil-Spec felt bony and rough. A P-series SIG will have little variation compared to the myriad of 1911s Kimber, Colt, Sprinfield, etc make.
A 220 ST Elite is my next SIG, in about 9 months +- when the State of CA approves it. But I already own a 1911...so I guess I'm not really helping.
One question to 220 owners, when you press the slide release does the checkering bite (I define bite in this case as when you press the release and the slide slams home the rear serrations glance the tip of my thumb) your thumb? Reason I ask is on my 226 it has never done it, but on a rental 220 it bit me like 3 times. Willing to chalk it up to it being a rental.
My Buck-0-5
RFB
A 220 ST Elite is my next SIG, in about 9 months +- when the State of CA approves it. But I already own a 1911...so I guess I'm not really helping.
One question to 220 owners, when you press the slide release does the checkering bite (I define bite in this case as when you press the release and the slide slams home the rear serrations glance the tip of my thumb) your thumb? Reason I ask is on my 226 it has never done it, but on a rental 220 it bit me like 3 times. Willing to chalk it up to it being a rental.
My Buck-0-5
RFB
buenhec
Member
I have both and love both. Depends what you want it for. Sig for carry, has a decocker and DA. 1911 when you are a bit more experianced or for competition shooting..or get both.
AK103K
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I havent encountered any. Maybe its just how you hold the gun.
One thing I have noticed is, the slide stops can vary in height, (which I think may be user modifications, I dont think they left the factory that way) which can cause the slide to go home on an empty mag, depending on your grip style.
I was experimenting with a "thumbs forward" grip with my SIG's and was having pretty good success with it until I picked up a surplus P6. All of a sudden, I started having the hammer drop on an empty chamber/empty mag. When I changed back to the thumb over thumb, it went away. I later noticed that my second P6's stop was a lot flatter to the grip (like all my other SIG's), and that the first guns stop appeared to have been bent upwards, perhaps for more leverage in getting it to let go.
I still prefer the SIG's slide stop position over the 1911's. They just seem more logical in their placement.
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