So, I want a shotgun.

[Plinkerton]

I want to buy a shotgun for home defense, as I'm moving out of my tiny apartment, and into a real house.

My dad used to have an old Mossberg, that was all wood stocked, etc. It was a beast of a gun, but awesome nonetheless.

Unfortunately, my dad gave it back to his brother, because he bought it off him for $50 dollars back when they were kids, when my uncle was hard up for cash.

So, we now have a Maverick shotgun, Field model I believe.

Since I don't hunt, and won't really be hunting anytime soon, I would like a "defensive" shotgun.

I have been drooling over the "tactical" shotguns over at the Benelli website, but fear they are much to expensive for me.

I would like to have a light mounted, but I don't want to buy into all the other tactical mall ninja stuff.

I've always been partial to Mossbergs, as those are the first shotguns I can remember hearing about, and they seem to be great quality.

I like this one a lot, but realize that a "heat shield" is some of that tactical stuff that I don't think I need. I just like how this one looks.

#50665 590® 12 ga. Pump Action 9-shot capacity, parkerized finish, bead sight, 20" cylinder bore barrel with heat shield and Speed-Feed® stock. ...MSRP $519

I don't really want anything wood, as I don't want the weight, and I guess i'd just prefer a black one.

Also, I notice that most of the Benellis are autos. I have never shot an autoloader shotgun, so I really have nothing to base that on.

Anyhow, just curious for some recommendations as to what I should look into.
Nothing too "uber tactical" and nothing too "woodsy".

For me, quality is the most important thing. I want a shotgun I can have for many years, if not my whole lifetime. I want something I won't have to ever worry about, and something I can attach a light to, but that's not super important.

Thanks everyone.
-Plink-

 

[sm]

I am not as familar with the Mossbergs as others. These folks will be along.

Personally - Gun fit, training, instructions, BA/ UU/ R ...etc., would be where my monies would be invested moreso than the shotgun itself.

For instance a Maverick(by Mossberg) sells for $134 brand new at the Local Academy Sports. Your pictured gun above priced at $519 - $134 = $385 left over for ammo, lessons, range fees...

Just the way my mind is wired, especially for a new shotgunner.

http://www.thehighroad.org/search.php?searchid=81101

 

[ZeroX]

Remington 870 Express

 

[Selfdfenz]

I think the military adopted one Mossberg model as a martial weapon. Don't remember the number. I had an 835 but never liked to lockup on it. It wasn't smooth and took too much effort to begin the initial phase of the pump. I could never smooth it out no matter what I polished.
Maybe Mavericks are smoother.

I have to agree with sm. You can spend lots of money on a specialized unit that might be better spent in other ways. Forgive me for saying this but I figure what SD shotguns do most of the time is sit someplace as opposed to being fired at least occassionally as would be the case with a handgun.

IMO a well used but sound 870 with a 20 inch cyl bore barrel will last a lifetime and there are many commercial attachments for the 870 that will allow you to remodel it later as you see fit.
S-

 

[MrTuffPaws]

Antoher vote for the Remington 870 Express. I have a 20 gauge youth model that I put an 8 round extension on it. Really nice gun.

 

[Black Majik]

I'm gonna ditto the recommendation on the 870 Express. Though I would suggest to get the 870 HD model.

It has the 18.5" barrel and ext. magazine tube.

A very no frills kind of home defense shotgun.

It usually runs $300 or so, and its cheaper than the Mossy 590A1 model..

Advantages to the mossberg is higher magazine capacity and the speedfeed stock, though in my position i'd most likely never use the speedfeed stock.

Theres also the Winchester 1300, and the Benelli Nova.

But out of those, the Remington would be my pick.

Have fun.

 

[esldude]

I am of the opinion you are better off with an automatic for self defense. But they cost more. You could hardly find a better one than the Benelli's. Another option is the Remington 1187. Either will last a lifetime and then some.

Considering that you want it for a lifetime. Might be worth saving up and getting the right shotgun. Benelli would be a good choice.

 

[Plinkerton]

I'll definitely check in to the 870.

The Maverick is okay, but it feels a little cheap in my opinion. The price is right, but feeling that, compared to my dad's old Mossberg, is just night and say.

The Maverick feels rough, and wobbly. Overall, it seems to be a decently solid performer, but I want something that feels good also.

I'm not completely sold on buying a "tactical" shotgun. For the most part, as I don't go shooting that much in general, yes the shotgun won't be fired a whole lot. My 686 hasn't seen a lot of range time recently either... Maybe this week.

An all around general use shotgun would be great, as long as it's still reasonable for HD, and so far, it seems the 870 will fit the bill just fine.

Any more comments are much appreciated.

Thanks,
-Plink-

EDIT: Okay, I'm lookin' at the Remington site. I found this one,

which is the: Model 870™ Express® Synthetic (18" Barrel)

18" barrel. 7 shot capacity Fixed cylinder. One question, I live in California. Is there a law on capacity for a shotgun?

Oh, and I'm looking at the bottom picture. Also, if I ever wanted to use that shotgun for hunting, or clays, I could get a longer barrel for it right? And take off the mag extender?

I don't see anything specifically called the Express HD.

 

[Black Majik]

I'd also like to add that, take a feel of both of the shotguns, the mossy and the 870.

For me, IMO the racking of the forearm is a lot smoother on the 870 than the 590. For some reason when I checked out the 590A1, racking the forearm felt kind of rubbery/vague, while the 870 had a more distinct, positive, and smoother action while racking the forearm.

Take it for what its worth, but thats what sticks out most in my head when I think of 590 vs. 870.

 

[Plinkerton]

I'm gonna go try to find an 870 in one of the stores tomorrow. It seems to be perfect for what I need. The more I read about them, the more I don't know why me or my dad don't have one already.

EDIT: One other question. I have heard that quality control at Remington has been dropping lately. Is there any merit to that? I'd be looking to get a new 870, so is there something I should worry about?

 

[Black Majik]

plinkerton, where in california are you?

usually the sales price for the 870 HD model runs at $299. They used to have a factory rebate of $25 but I dont think they do that anymore, but it'll never hurt to check.

If you live in socal, Tuners Outdoorsman has a regular sale on the HD model.

 

[Justang]

The Rem 870 and the Mossy 500 are the two that seem to be debated the most.

I just bought a Mossberg 500A Persuader. It came with a buttstock and a pistol grip. I wanted home defense with the option of going out clay shooting. I thought the two stocks were a plus. I paid $269.99 for mine. Just got done with the 10 day wait Friday.

this is the gun:
with full stock

pistol grip

*not the same gun. The pistol grip one has the 14" barrel not for civilian use. Just add 4.5" to the barrel.

 

[Plinkerton]

I'm in Socal, in Santa Barbara.

Which one is the HD model? I don't specifically see it on the Remington website. I see the one of the picture I posted, but it's not called the HD model. Are they the same?

 

[Black Majik]

Plinkerton, yes they are the same.

Its the lower picture of the 2 remingtons you have posted. The one w. the ext mag tube.

 

[sm]

Plinkerton

Original post stated YOU wanted a Mossberg for sentimentality. I posted with that in mind. I also provided a link to a slew of threads for you to read , I did a quick search : "defensive shotguns" > Dave McCracken.

In those posts , you will a variety of " This versus That" , " Mine is bigger than Yours" , " Iwannacoolgunvirus" , and your "Momma is Ugly and Wears Army Boots".

Bottom line - It is NEVER the firearm itself - It is the MINDSET of the user. My criteria for any defensive firearm - Gun must fit user , in a platform the user knows and can use the MOA, is reliable , ammo is reliable , in the largest caliber that affords quick accurate hits.

I like Wood & Blood personally , I like stock guns. The less crap there is - less crap to break and the gun not run.

I have used anything from Win SX1 ( which in my opinion is the MOST reliable semi- auto), SX2's, 1100s, Beretta 303s ,870s, 1300's, Model 37, 97, Model 12, ...

Most often - I am going to grap a 870 Express, bone stock. I bought it brand new, first new shotgun I have bought in y-e-a-r-s. I paid $174 . Yep it was $199 - $25 Rebate = $174.

I have already shot more than $174 worth of ammo thru it. Heck I run 200 slugs in one day alone. 100 rds of buckshot and another 100 rds of target loads two days later. In one week I ran probably 700- 800 rds.

DO not get caught up in all this. HD needs for you is different than 3 gunners, SWAT, LEO, Military ,... "Buford the Bear Slayer" or "Marvin the Mall Ninja" .

And quit gawking at "Pattie the Puma Puncher" , yeah she is a looker and all - but she knows how to shoot that 20 ga 1100.

 

[Rupestris]

I want to buy a shotgun...

I think you meant to say " I want to buy my first shot gun..."
Right now I'm looking for my 3rd 870 (4th SG overall).

 

[Fred Fuller]

Another 870 fan weighing in here.

If you like 870s, you will most likely prefer an older production model to the new ones. New 870s have a lawyer inspired locking safety that has been known to lock itself without use of the key, rendering the gun unuseable until it is unlocked. Not the kind of thing I like to think about myself. There are some other changes on newer 870s that some afficianados find objectionable.

My suggestion is that you check on the thread at
http://www.thehighroad.org/showthread.php?t=107119 . Sgtb still has 18" parkerized 870 Police Magnum trade-ins for sale at a good price. I bought one of these retirees from him a month or so ago, and it is in great shape all round for a gun that was new in 1989.

If you don't like that idea, do by all means shop around for a good used 870. There are _lots_ of Cinderella 870s out there just looking for a good home, and Dave McC and I can't adopt them all (though we seem to try). It will save you a lot of money if you shop carefully, and you will get what I think is a better gun into the bargain. The last Cinderella 870 I brought home a few months ago was $145 out the door, a 21" vent rib barreled two bead sighted Express turkey gun that would be great for HD as well as lots of other more sporting applications. The wood needs refinishing on this one but after a good cleaning all else was in great shape.

And I heartily second the suggestions that you run the basic gun as is until it is an extension of your arms before adding bolt-ons. What matters is how good you are with the gun, not how kewl the hardware is.

Good luck in shopping, I hope you find an HD gun that makes you happy. Keep it simple, stick with a workhorse pumpgun for starters and don't worry about all those smarmy Benellis out there. Work on being so good with your plain jane pumpgun you can outshoot'em, that's the best thing for you _and_ them.

lpl/nc

 

[Zach S]

The 590 in your first post is simular to mine, I dont have the speed feed stock. Dont let the MSRP fool ya, they're never tagged that high (if they are, go somewhere else). I think mine (part #50660) had an MSRP of around $480, I paid $365 and tax.

 

[Gunsnrovers]

Since you're in California, check out the local Big 5. In Sunday's paper, they advertised the Mossberg 500 "Security" which is a 20" 8 shot 12 guage for $219. They daily have either the Mossberg or 870 Express on sale.

Either is a decent choice so long as you subscriber to aforementioned BA/UU/R (patent pending/t-shirts on order).

 

[MrMurphy]

The Remington 870 is the "King of Combat shotguns" and resides in most cop cars. Six million sold (for all uses) and still going strong. The 18" Express model would serve you well, I had one. The Police Magnum variant makes a better combat gun,but both work well in that role.

The Mossberg 500 is right behind the 870 in sales (it's a Ford/Chevy thing) and the Mossberg 590 was adopted by the military. Big 5 sells the Mossberg 500 twin pack (an 18" barrel and a 28" barrel with one gun) for $200 about once a month on sale, and it's a good deal. The Mossberg has a top-mounted tang safety which, being in front of your nose, is easy to remember it's there. My very first shotgun was an 18" six shot Mossberg 500. I donated it to my brother because he lacked bedroom artillery aside from a .45 at the time.


The Winchester 1300 and Benelli Nova run side by side in popularity (the Nova's newer) and all four of these pump action guns run about $250-300 in the 18" barrel variant for home defense.

I started with a Mossy 500, went to an 870 HD, sold it to a friend who needed one, and bought a Benelli Nova SP Tactical with ghost ring sights out of variety. It's worked well.

All you need for a house gun: Bead sight, stock holder for some spare shells, and a LIGHT! (You MUST identify your target before firing)... Surefire makes the best of them.

 

[Plinkerton]

Mr Murphy, that's what I want on my HD gun. I want a light, and some extra shells, and that's about it. I don't want crazy sights or anything, as I'm used to standard bead.

I would say this is my first shotgun, but for the most part it's not. The Maverick we have is mine, as I picked it out, and my dad pretty much bought it for me. But, it's the only shotgun we have, and I let him keep it at his house. I don't want to ask for it back, as then he would have to go buy one.

I love the top mounted safety, so I may be looking at those. My dads old Mossberg had a top mounted, and the Maverick has the trigger guard ones (I don't know what they're called) and it was a pain to get used to.

Thanks for the Big 5 recommendation. I'll head over there right now.

Thanks,
Plink

 

[Dave McCracken]

Ladies and Gennelmun, my $0.02.....

EVERY shotgun mentioned in this thread will do the job. From the po' relation Maverick to the B guns costing 4 figures, they will do the job IF we do ours.

In HD, and probably most combat in general, the weak link is not the gear.

"We have met the enemy, and he is us."-Pogo....

Training, mindset and commitment have lots more to do with who assumes ambient temperature after a crisis than make, model and bling.

If that's not on a tablet of stone in The Temple of the Shotgun Gods, it oughta be.

Get any shotgun you darn well want to. If it goes glitchless for 200 rounds of duty ammo when broken in and is comfortable to shoot, it's a good choice. Shoot it until you and it are one. Then, decide what, IF ANYTHING,needs to be changed, improved or added to. Chances are that will be a very short list.

HTH.....

 

[Plinkerton]

Went to all the gun stores today, including Big 5.

Found the Remington 870 HD one, and I love it. I played with some Benellis and some Mossbergs, and even this insane HK that they don't make anymore. The HK had fiber optic Ghost rings, and a pistol grip, etc. Was extremely light and very comfortable, though there's no reason in hell I would ever need one of those. It was fun to play with though.

The Remington is great. Feels very solid, much more than the Maverick we have.

Anyhow, I'll be getting it sometime very soon. Big 5 had a sale of the same model for 30 bucks cheaper, but I think I'm gonna buy it from the local gun store, cause it's not that much more, and they're nice folk in there.

So, I'm stoked. It was nice to actually get to see the one I want to buy. They also had a BFR in there. Those things are ridiculous.

Oh, by the way, for Cali prices, the 870 was 330.

Thanks everyone.
-Plink-

Any other opinions, suggestions still welcome.

 

[Black Majik]

Yup, that sounds about right. Regular going price is $329.00...

Sale price is usually 299.


But, glad you liked the 870. Means my recommendation wasn't completely useless.

Congrats on your future shotgun! Remember to BA/UU.R!

 

[ZeroX]

Your decision makes me feel validated.

Good shooting.