Squibs!

[Hondo 60]

Had two squibs this past week after 10-12,000 perfect rounds

What changed? I bought a progressive press.
This had me concerned enough I reloaded strictly on my single stage last night.

I hate the fact that I sit at 6:00, the powder goes in at 2:00, & bullet is seated at 10:00 on the Lee Pro 1000. And there's "stuff" (die holder, etc) in the way so I can't see if the proper amount of powder went in.

Not sure what I'm going to do about it. I love the speed of the progressive, but I can't see what going on.

Right now I'm thinking about selling it & getting a turret press. I know a turret is slower, but it'll leave the case right in front of me so I have a better viewing angle.

 

[Steve C]

Progressives are wonderful tools but there can be a problem with all the things going on at once.

If your squib problem is lack of powder then I'd suggest you just make sure you keep the measure full and add powder more often, make it a habit to check the level every couple boxes of shells or every time you add primers. If the squibs are occurring when using H110 or W296 it could be too low a charge level with a volume sensitive powder.

I often read about the hundreds of rounds that can be cranked out of a progressive in an hour by some people. I never load any where near as fast as some do. My Hornady LNL does put them out faster than my single stage but I still pull every 10th to 15th round and weigh the charge to make sure its still at the intended level and visually check the case after each powder drop.

 

[Walkalong]

The LNL can drop powder at the 3rd or 4th station, which puts it right there where you can see it. That is one of the things I like about the press, as I did the Projector before it. I see every charge I seat a bullet over. It slows me down some, but not that much.

I drop powder at the 3rd station. That way I can crimp and seat in one step or seperate steps.

Pic 1

Pic 2

 

[sonier]

Single stage press allows you to view all the cartridges in a loading block. but your going really slow then. sounds like your powder throw didnt drop any powder or just a little. Try not letting it get real low i always try to keep my throws almost all the way full so it has enough weight in it to ensure the powder gets thrown not kinda stuck in there.

 

[solvability]

The Lee powder charger is problematic and known for that problem.

 

[Dynamite Rabbit]

The RCBS lockout die works really well if you have a spot for it.

 

[Jim Watson]

What powder?
Ball (or Hodgdon "spherical") meters with less chance of bridging in the measure than a big flake. But if the bar doesn't stroke all the way, changing powder won't help.

 

[Hondo 60]

Powder is titegroup.

The powder hopper is plenty full. I think where I have a problem is not hitting the top & bottom on each & every handle pull.

I've even tried weighing rounds, but they differ so much that with 2 identical weights, one can be perfect & the second one is undercharged.

Although I did catch one the other night. After the 2nd squib, I pulled a 100 rd box & found another rd w/o powder.


I got lucky with the 1st squib in that it wouldn't allow the revolver's cylinder to rotate.
So I couldn't continue to shoot. I also noticed a lot of gas & smoke escape in the barrel/cylinder gap. All I can say is "Thank you Jesus" If it hadn't jammed the cylinder I would've continued to shoot. (never had a squib before so I didn't know what it sounded, felt or looked like)

With the 2nd squib, I saw the smoke in the gap again & knew immediately what had happened.

 

[Jon_Snow]

The RCBS lockout die works really well if you have a spot for it.

+1. Either this or a Hornady powder cop. I see that you're using the Lee Pro 1000 though, which I think only has 3 stations. Maybe you should upgrade to a press with 4 or even 5 stations. I use all 5 on my Hornady AP (sizer, measure, expander, powder cop, seater).

I think where I have a problem is not hitting the top & bottom on each & every handle pull.

Try to pull the handle all the way down and leave it there for a second. When dealing with press mounted measures you want to make sure your handle pull is consistent everytime or you will get inconsistent throws. It may slow you down a bit, but it's much safer and still a lot faster than a single stage.

 

[Jim Watson]

I think where I have a problem is not hitting the top & bottom on each & every handle pull.

That will cause trouble with any machine. Work on technique and don't get in a hurry. The production rates advertised for progressive loaders are based on short spurts with plenty of everything at hand and no glitches. I run about half what Dillon claims.

 

[Walkalong]

Try to pull the handle all the way down and leave it there for a second.

Yep. What's the hurry anyway? Slow and steady adds up fast enough.

 

[orionengnr]

I agree with the prior two posters.
I have a Dillon 550 and I put out 150-200 rounds per hour--about 1/3 of the rated ability of the press. The Dillon drops the powder at about 7:30, and I can see that the powder drop is correct.

I would rather have 150 rounds that will work than 550 that I will wonder about each time I press the trigger...

 

[mongoose33]

+2 on the RCBS Lockout die.

I had a couple of squibs a while back, and was bothered that the progressive was too fast, that it was too easy for me (not saying it is this way for others) to miss a squib load.

I bought the RCBS Lockout die and it has caught a few for me. Who knows if I'd have seen them before seating the bullet, but it told me that they were low loads of powder.

Why did they happen? Turns out the powder drop had a bit of a binding problem such that the rotor didn't return fully when the press returned on the upstroke. So I got a low powder load.

The beauty of the Lockout die, compared to the powder cop, is that I don't have to watch it to see if the load is a squib load. It'll just catch it.

THe only way I'd feel comfortable w/ the powder cop is if I set up a system as one or two people have done that produce an audible warning beep if it comes in off target load.

In fact, I like the Lockout die so much I bought one for 9mm and one for .45, so I don't have to readjust them when switching calibers.

 

[Jesse Heywood]

Could you set a mirror to check the powder charge?

 

[sharptailhunter]

I'm new to this whole reloading thing. I jumped into the "progressive" side of it right from the begining. Shortly after I thought I was getting it figured out, I had a squib occur. Sort of scared me because I thought I was being careful enough. Ya know, trying to look into each case before placing the bullet. Turns out that the two screws that connect a linkage arm to the barrel on my powder drop had come loose and as such, it wasn't dropping consistent amounts. Like you, I was using Titegroup. Even though I found the cause of the problem and fixed it with locktite, I wanted more insurance that it wasn't going to happen again.

So, I adapted the Dillon powder check to the empty station right after my powder dropper on my Hornady LNL AP. I have attached two pics so you can see how it was done. If anyone has any Qs on how to do it, PM me and I can give ya the details. I love the Dillon Powder Check because it beeps, rather loudly, if it detects a no charge or a double charge. I have tried numerous times to set it up for failure, i.e. a no detect when it should have, and it passed each time with flying colors. Now I have a lot more peace of mind when I'm cranking out the ammo. Nonetheless, I still look inside each and every case before I set a bullet on top of it. I also made a trick little low primer alarm to notify me when I'm on my last primer. That allows me to concentrate more on the powder end of it all. You can sort of see a pic of it sitting on top of the primer feed tube in the second picture. I think it cost about $7 dollars to make with Radio Shack stuff.


I'll also put a plug in for the Hornady LNL AP. The thing is awesome and their powder drop is very consistent (when the screws are secure) I know because my chrony tells me that I have very small spreads in velocities. And, everytime I check it against my scale, it's always spot on. I love it!

 

[glockdude57]

Tite group

I use tite group for all my hand guns it works great for me
9 40 45 357 38 works great

 

[Tom S.]

Squibs was why I got rid of both of my Pro 1000's and went to a Dillon 650XL. That and having to dink with them all the time to keep them running.

 

[LiveLife]

I still use my Pro 1000 and don't plan on replacing it anytime soon.

I had squib rounds in early days of reloading because I did not properly tension the Pro Auto Disk chain (taught chain on spring with Auto Disk all the way back when shell plate carrier is all the way at the bottom) or not cycle the ram lever all the way down (pushing the lever partially/halfway down and back up will rotate the shell plate without dropping the powder).

Haven't had a squib round for years now. When I help set up a new Pro 1000, I point this out and several recent users I helped set up haven't had a squib round out of their Pro 1000.

 

[atomd]

I would like to nominate this thread for the winner of "thread with pictures of the cleanest presses ever seen by man". Jeez guys, do they look like that all the time? I have a couple of presses and I think mine are pretty clean...I wipe them down and whatnot but yours look like you're reloading in a hospital or something.

 

[1SOW]

Some have mounted a small LED light to be able to see the powder before setting the bullet.

I had one that was awkward to mount, but it worked. I'm looking for one now with a flex-tube neck.

 

[TonyT]

The only time I expereinced a squibb was when ik purchased a Dillon 550 and was changing powder charges without pating attention or clearing the sheelplate before changing powder charges.
With the Dillon 550 I can examine the powder drop in each case before it advances to the bullet seating step. For the old tall straight walled cases like 38 Special I use Trail Boss powder.

 

[sharptailhunter]

I would like to nominate this thread for the winner of "thread with pictures of the cleanest presses ever seen by man". Jeez guys, do they look like that all the time? I have a couple of presses and I think mine are pretty clean...I wipe them down and whatnot but yours look like you're reloading in a hospital or something.

I do work in an O.R. and a surgery center and yes mine looks like that all the time. One helpful tip that I have found to keep a can of computer duster by my press. That way I can periodically "dust" things off with a few bursts of air. I also love Hornady One shot cleaner and lube. It leaves a dry lubricant so gun powder and such won't stick to it like it would to grease. After all, cleanliness is next to Godliness.

 

[russ45]

Static electricity? TG is very fine powder as I recall.

 

[sharptailhunter]

Titegroup was prone to static for me. I did the whole dryer sheet thing, sort of helped. Incidently, I just tried A#7. It's much finer than TG but meters very well and has very little static effect.