starting to reload .380 question

Status
Not open for further replies.

Rom828

Member
Joined
May 10, 2012
Messages
177
Location
Colorado Springs
I am just starting to reload .380 with HP38 using plated 95 and 100 grain bullets. The reload data says to start at 2.9 grains with 3.1 being the max. I can't see starting at 2.9 and working up to 3.1. I'm tempted to just load 'em up to 3.0 and call it good. What's everyone here doing? All I need are target loads for my little LCP, for SD carry I'm using Hornady critical defense. Thanks again everyone!
 
IF the attitude you display in this question while being a beginner reloader---'that's good enough'---you are in foir some Major HEADACHES and heartache down the road. BUT that is why they sell NEW guns.
THERE IS A DAMN GOOD REASON WHY---WHY !!!---THEY HAVE STARTING AND MAXIMUM LOADS LISTED IN ALL THE LOADING MANUALS; AND DO NOT EVER THINK YOU KNOW BETTER !!!
 
It pays to start low and work up, especially in small cases.

Load 10 of each (2.9, 3.0, & 3.1) and try them. It's not much trouble and may save you some heartache. You may like one or the other best.

It really doesn't pay to skip the work up in such a narrow window with such a small case. Be smart, and be careful.
 
A small case means that .1 grains makes a big difference? I'm used to making loads for 45LC , 45acp, 38 special, etc. that give you a good size spread between starting data and max, (that I seldom load to), and yes, I am very careful with what I do, thank you very much. There is no "that's good enough" going on here. My first loads ever were 45acp that didn't cycle my 1911.
 
Think of the percentage of variation that is, compared to a larger case. A 10th of a gr is nothing when there's 43gr called for, but with only 3gr? It could start to matter.

Chances are, you'll be fine, but why not just weigh 5 at this, 5 at that, and 5 again at the max or whatever? Dont take but a sec when you've got everything out. And then you can feel good knowing you did it the right way:)
 
Last edited:
Target loads for a .380? No such thing.
Your data is for 100 grain jacketed bullets. (95 grain jacketed have a .1 higher max load, so it won't make any difference using the same data.) Plated bullets are not jacketed. Plated bullets use cast bullet data.
Anyway, the whole point of reloading is to use ammo tailored for your firearm. Just picking a load and hoping doesn't do that. You have to work up the load.
You don't 'determine' OAL. Your manual will tell you what it should be.
 
Sunray, I dont believe that is written in stone anywhere, even though you always say it. It's ok to use mid level jacketed data for plated IMO. Especially with the advancement of bullets of late, with all the "thicker" plating and whatnot.
 
I have been loading .380's 100 grain xtreme plated using 2.9 grains of win231 and have had good luck with it. As stated above start low and work your way up.
 
Always start low and work up. COL has (can have) huge impacts on pressure and such. I'm kinda shocked at the narrow range between min and max but then again I have no experience with the HP38. Mainly this is the reason for going right to the bottom for me....

I have started working up loads from the middle of the charge range before but it was after a lot of research and experimentation at the bottom end of the charge range. A 3 gr. range is pretty odd for me.

VooDoo
 
Target loads for a .380? No such thing.

Your data is for 100 grain jacketed bullets. (95 grain jacketed have a .1 higher max load, so it won't make any difference using the same data.) Plated bullets are not jacketed. Plated bullets use cast bullet data.

Anyway, the whole point of reloading is to use ammo tailored for your firearm. Just picking a load and hoping doesn't do that. You have to work up the load.

You don't 'determine' OAL. Your manual will tell you what it should be.


I rarely ever use the OAL from the load manual and many others that I know do not either, including many here. I load OAL in relation to the specific gun and/or magazine in question. I play with OAL looking for accuracy at times. Other times OAL is where the crimp groove or cannelure is.
 
You don't 'determine' OAL. Your manual will tell you what it should be

I was going to say something about that too, but felt I may not be "experienced" enough.

I was actually going to say that your manual doesn't tell you what your COL is, your barrel does. (with pistol)

Or your cannelure. (with some rifle bullets)

But i don't think it's bad info to tell someone to follow the manual, either.
 
Lyman 49 gives a broader range of 2.1 - 2.9 gr for 95 gr FMJ. They also note the 2.9 gr max load is the most accurate so you'd be skipping what they consider the best load by not trying it. I take any of those 'potentially most accurate' with a grain of salt, but they came to that conclusion somehow.

Hornady 8th which is typically one of my more conservative resources says 2.5 -3.3gr for a 100 gr FMJ - oddly it gives different data for W231 & HP38 with a 3.5gr max for W231 vs 3.3gr HP38. But again, a broader range.

Don't use Hodgdon online data as your only source for data. It's a good reference & very convenient, but it's smart to compare a few different ones when getting into a new caliber. The only loads I come across for what I load with that tight a spread are subsonic loads. When you see something like that & it seems odd, better to ask or check other references than just split the middle & guess.

Even the Lee data that came with my .380 dies has a better range of 2.9-3.2 to work with.

I'll share a mistake I made ASSUMING when it came to reloading. I was loading .223 using 55gr FMJ bullets. Worked up the load & wasn't at max load. Not even a few tenths away from it. Lots & lots of rounds & everything was going just fine. I decided to switch up & try a VMax bullet for better accuracy. SO I already had a good load and I figure "I'm going from one 55gr bullet to another - no need to start all over". All I was changing was a Hornady 55gr FMJBT for a Hornady 55gr VMax - everything else is the same so why not just start there? What I didn't realize is that although both are 55gr .224 diameter bullets made by the same company, the bearing surface on the VMax bullet is longer and the reference (had I bothered to check) called for an additional .050 COAL. I had severely overpressure rounds - blowing out primers, flowing primers, leaving deep ejector & extractor marks on the base. Could have been worse & luckily it just turned into a learning experience. Had I done it the right way & started off a lot lower (1) I wouldn't have almost blown up my gun (maybe an exaggeration, but I bet I was close to a proof round) & (2) I'd have found the most accurate load a lot sooner.

Another example but this time something that worked out well. My starting load for .45 was 5.0gr W231. The first batch had excellent performance. So I stopped working up .45 at my starting load. No need to try other charges or seating depths or crimps or anything. It just worked & worked wonderfully. It's a mild load, but very accurate in any of my .45's & I have a lot of them. When I switched from Hornady HAP bullets to 230gr plated, I didn't do anything different other than seating depth since I was at starting load. And those 'just worked' the same way. I didn't do any further experimenting because they were very consistent & accurate. Had I just chosen 'middle of the road' to start I would have missed a great load or maybe ended up with something that worked well in some guns but not others. You might find the published starting load pleasantly surprising. If so, great - esp if it is just a target load. The paper, Coke can, bowling pin, steel plate, whatever could care less if the bullet that struck it could have been moving 100fps faster.
 
Thanks everyone for your input, it's the reason I hang out here. I'll try ten rounds of 2.9, ten of 3.0 etc. as per Walkalongs advice and will report back.
 
You might find that the low end of the load chart works well for an LCP. Mine works fine with those and my G42 won't.
 
Always start at the low end and work up. That said COL can be critical to ammunition reliability. In my experiance loading for 4 different 380s they ALL prefered the shortest reasonable COL. Loading them too long almost always was an invitation to jamming. Of course the key word here is reasonable. seating bullets too deep is an invitation to excessive pressure in the tiny 380 case.
 
I use 2.8gr at .980 for all my 95gr loads. It's soft shooting, low pressure and accurate, if you can call anything with an LCP accurate.
 
Make sure that the brass you are using does not have an internal step in it. Some of the newer 380 brass does to keep the bullets from setting back. If you use a bullet that is too long, going past the step will bulge the brass so it will not chamber.;)
 
I got a brand new 100 count bag of 380 auto Magtech brass. Sorted and measured each one and came up with one shiny new 9mm case, one that was .060 too long, one with a chunk out of the rim and one with a big burr. I called the Magtech customer service and talked to a guy that was very interested in the lot number, says he'd send me a new bag for my trouble. Is it a mistake to copy the COL of a commercial round that runs through the gun OK and is accurate? It seems like running everything to max COL would cause trouble or am a playing around with pressures in a bad way? Thanks again.
 
Rom828 said:
I am just starting to reload .380 with HP38 using plated 95 and 100 grain bullets.

I'm tempted to just load 'em up to 3.0 and call it good.
I think part of the joy of reloading is the satisfaction of knowing that you have done a full powder work up to identify any lighter target loads with milder recoil that are still accurate.

When doing load development for semi-auto calibers, I will first determine the powder charge that will start to reliably cycle the slide and then focus on accuracy trends to identify lighter target loads along with higher charge loads that are accurate. This way, I only need to do the load development once for that particular bullet and powder combination.


Using OAL/COL listed in published load data may not be ideal for your pistol/barrel. Often, published loads are not even tested in pistols but in universal barrel fixtures shot one round at a time. For optimal accuracy, we try to use the longest OAL that will reliably feed/chamber from the magazine to reduce gas leakage around the bullet that tends to produce more consistent chamber pressures.

Walkalong has an excellent thread to determine the max and working OAL using the barrel - http://www.thehighroad.org/showthread.php?t=506678


For 100 gr RNFP plated bullet, I tested 2.6, 2.8 and 3.0 gr of W231/HP-38. Due to the bullet nose profile, my working OAL ended up shorter at .945" which seated the bullet base deeper in the case neck so I stopped at 3.0 gr. My load development with TCP 738 is discussed on this thread and I got the following shot groups at 7 yards - http://www.thehighroad.org/showthread.php?t=748320

attachment.php
 
The smaller the cartridge, the shorter the charge table. This means that it takes far less powder to change operating pressures.

As a new reloader it is wise and prudent to follow good sensible work up protocol. Even now as a long term reloader, I still use a safe start charge with powders and components new to me. It's one of the rules of the hobby, dismiss these safety procedures, and you'll likely learn a hard lesson at some point.
 
My Hornady book shows a 2.6-3.5 powder range with W-231. I loaded my Berry 100g RN at 3.1. OAL .968. Shoots well, accurate. This is just what i've found from my work ups. I started with 2.6 and worked to what shoots well with both my Beretta 85 and Sig 238.
 
Is it a mistake to copy the COL of a commercial round that runs through the gun OK and is accurate?

The bullet, more so than the brass, has a lot to do with what COL will work. Are you familiar with the "plunk" test?
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Back
Top