"sticky" extraction?

[NOLAEMT]

So i just got my first revolver, a 686p with a 5 inch barrel.

I put together two handloads after shooting up some factory ammo to get accustomed to the gun (that double action revolver trigger takes some getting used to after only shooting single action autos!)

my first load was a 158gn lswc over 5.5 grains of bullseye with standard cci primes-- a pretty mild load.

my other was 14.6 grains of 2400 under the same lswc, with standard cci primers.

The cases on these where a little "sticky" I think?

they didn't fall out of the charge holes like the lighter loads did, but they were not difficult to remove, they just required a little force on the ejector rod, and then I could pull them out. This load is under the max by quite a bit, over a grain in every manual I have seen.

Is this ok? Am i going to get into trouble with this load?

by the way, the brass was a little dirty, i tumbled it, but not for long enough, as I wanted to load it before bed, and it was getting late last night.

 

[Eb1]

I am just now loading for the 44 magnum, and I get the same with any load that reaches into the magnum range. I don't think it is anything to worry about. Check your book to make sure the 2400 charge is not over max.

Did you shoot .38 Specials out of the gun before loading your longer .357 magnum rounds? if you did you might have build up from the shorter case length of the .38 SPL.

I loaded 19.0 grains of 2400 under a 240 LSWC today in my .44 Mag. they came out, but were a little sticky. So were the 15.5 grains with a 270 grain jacketed. As well were the 10 grains Unique under a 240 JHP. If the charge is within range then you are fine. Cases get sticky when you venture into the magnum loadings.

 

[NOLAEMT]

I looked at several sources and according to them all I was at least a grain under max, sometimes more, and seated at the max COAL listed, so I think it should be ok, I've just never shot or reloaded for a revolver before, so I have some "noob" questions!

thanks for the reply, It seems as if i am safe, but I wanted to make sure

 

[Eb1]

I am a "noob" to loading revolvers as well. Just look up some of my questions. hehe...

Heck, you might learn something to help me out. I am never shy to ask a question. If not of these forums. I wouldn't have anyone to talk about this hobby with.

How did the loads group? Did they work out for you? I am have pushed the 2400 up to 19.5 and 20.0 for tomorrows test with the LSWC. The 270 JHP shot really well, but I am went ahead and bumped it up to 16.0 of 2400 from 15.5 grains 2400. I need to know if the group holds with a little more velocity.

 

[NOLAEMT]

they grouped pretty well, I'm having some difficulty catching on to the whole double action thing, so I shoot a lot low and to the right, but the groups were very consistent, I just need to learn to shoot. Its gotten a lot better with some dry firing practice since my first outing though.

 

[NCsmitty]

my first load was a 158gn lswc over 5.5 grains of bullseye with standard cci primes-- a pretty mild load.

I'm not sure where you got your load data, but I'm reading the www.alliantpowder.com site and they show 4.8gr as the Maximum charge of Bullseye under a 158gr Speer LSWC. It could be the reason that they are "sticky".

Your 2400 load of 14.6 is a near maximum for jacketed bullets, and I'm surprised that you're not leading the barrel with the LSWC.



NCsmitty

 

[NOLAEMT]

the load that was sticky was the 14.6, and it is with Missouri bullets hardcast lswc. They say they are for magnum velocities. I didn't notice any leading, but I only shot about 40 rounds.

my manual says that the max load for bullseye is 6.5 grains with a 158gn lswc? i dont know why the alliant site says otherwise.

 

[NCsmitty]

Without looking up the BHN on the Missouri bullets site, it should be a BHN of at least 18 to prevent leading at the higher velocities.

www.alliantpowder.com has the latest up to date load data available, seeing that they manufacture/distribute Bullseye and 2400.



NCsmitty

 

[NOLAEMT]

They are BHN of 18 according to the missouri bullet box.

It does say that 4.8 is the max for bullseye on the website, but I have a speer reloading manual, as well as one of those 1 book 1 caliber books that is compiled from several sources, and they all say that 5.5 grains is well under max for 158gn lswc in the 357. they shot fine, with moderate recoil, and no signs of pressure at all.

 

[NOLAEMT]

according to my loadbook, the max for bullseye for 158gr lswc is 6.9grains for about 1300 fps.

 

[bullseye308]

Eb1 but I am went ahead and bumped it up to 16.0 of 2400 from 15.5 grains 2400

I smell a typo.
My bad. Twas late, too many hours on the road, & not enough coffee.

NOLAEMT
my first load was a 158gn lswc over 5.5 grains of bullseye with standard cci primes-- a pretty mild load.

my other was 14.6 grains of 2400 under the same lswc, with standard cci primers.

I load my 158 SWC's with 5.0 for a nice plinking load. If I need more shock & awe I load 14.5gr of 2400 with the same bullet. Been doing this for a while and loving it.

according to my loadbook, the max for bullseye for 158gr lswc is 6.9grains

That sounds about right, not having a manual in front of me.

 

[Eb1]

Quote:
Eb1 but I am went ahead and bumped it up to 16.0 of 2400 from 15.5 grains 2400
I smell a typo.

No, typo. Starting load for the 270 grain Speer is 15.5 grains of 2400. I moved up some with 16.0 grains of 2400.

Now the "I am went" part is pretty bad...


Sorry, OP...

 

[NOLAEMT]

haha, no apologies necessary, I just appreciate the info.

 

[sonier]

Ive had issues with sticky extraction after some dirty rounds, I take a drill and a gun cleaning rod patch those things that are like scrubbies but instead of bronze there solid cotton or whatever, i chucked this in my drill and ran it through all of the cylinders, till they sparkled and looked shiny now even my max H-110 loads just nearly fall out of the cylinder using the extractor. you might just have a dirty cylinder clean it up a bit however you choose.

 

[Eb1]

@ Sonier. Doesn't that ream the chambers some, and may cause a loose fitting to some bullets later on in the guns life? Just curious, not a S/A observation.

 

[OYE]

Sticky extraction is never o.k.. It's one of first the things we look at for high pressure signs.
Every gun is different. What was o.k. for the test gun may not be o.k. for yours. Flattened primers is another. Any sign of brass flowing around the firing pin another.
Pierced primer is one. Any marks on the case head another. .0005 in. expansion of the case head certainly is one. Primer pockets opening up ( primers go in too easy ) on the next load or after 2 or 3 loads. Brass needing excessive trimming certainly is one. Case failures of any kind. And that's not all. Woe to he who ignores the warning signs.

 

[Eb1]

I am sorry, OYE. I have to disagree that in a Magnum revolver sticky extraction cannot be used like it can be in a rifle loading. You are shooting a Magnum cartridge. The cylinders are made extremely strong to handle the pressures. Magnum rounds never fall out of the cylinder like a powder puff load. I have learned this with my .22LR/.22WMR and from shooting my .32 H&R Magnum. You shoot .32 S&W Longs in the .32 H&R Mag, and they fall right out. Shoot a .32 H&R Mag, and you need to use the extractor as it was made to do. Whack those empty cases right out of there.

I do not think sticky cases is an good place to look for revolver overloads. Now cases you have to beat out with a dowel or cleaning rod. That is another story.

 

[Walkalong]

A bronze cleaning brush with your favorite bore cleaner chucked up in a drill will get those chambers squeaky clean and not hurt a thing.

Sticky cases can come from rough or dirty chambers, but if the chambers are properly made, clean, and nicely finished, then sticky extraction is to be noted, and action taken to stop it. Namely, reduce the charge.

 

[Eb1]

Are we talking sticky to where you have to use the extractor to get them out, or are we talking you have to beat them out?

 

[sonier]

I hav'nt used bronze brushes but the cloth ones work just as easy, and I dont think it will ream the chamber, just polish it.

 

[Maj Dad]

I have used bore brushes & patches with a drill on the cylinders, followed by a patch/mop with JB Bore Compound for a very smooth finish. Brownell's & JB say it is non-embedding, and will not scratch, mar or damage "the finest bore." I use it on most of my guns, and followed by JB Bore Bright on the small caliber/high velocity rifles.

Joe Bob sez chek it out... http://www.brownells.com/.aspx/sid=4121/sku/J_B_Bore_Cleaning_Compound__2_oz_