Stolen at gun show?

[flieger]

I went to the Las Vegas gun show on Saturday, and brought along a Marlin model 39A Mountie which I purchased in 1980 at a show in Grand Junction, CO.
Upon checking in, the officer on duty informed me that the piece was stolen and confiscated it. When he ran the serial number, he omitted the "W" prefix, and insisted that it is not part of the serial number. He further insisted that the piece was manufactured post-1968 (the "W" prefix indicates manufacture in 1962 or 1963).

This inconsistency makes me wonder if perhaps there has been a mistake. Naturally, if the gun was indeed stolen (in 1972, per the officer) I want it returned to the rightful owner, if they are still alive. However, I am not entirely sure it is indeed stolen. Is anyone on this forum able to run the whole serial number for me?

It is W12xx, a rather low number considering the date of manufacture.

Thanks for any help you guys can give me. And yes, he ran MY numbers and I came up clean <G>.

 

[orangelo]

Wow, if he can tell it was stolen or not just by looking at it while it's lying on a table imagine what he can do with lottery tickets.

It was stolen alright, from you by a so-called law enforcement officer.

Get an attorney.

 

[ID_shooting]

keeping an eye on this

 

[Third_Rail]

Sounds like it was stolen.


By the officer.




Did you get a receipt? How about a badge number, department, name, etc. from the officer? If not, he's a theif.

 

[isp2605]

Low serial numbers can result in numerous listings of stolen guns. It wouldn't surprise me at all if 1257 didn't have multiple stolen guns listed with that number. We got playing with NCIC one time and I can't remember the serial number we ran but we ended up with something like 24 different stolen guns of different manufacture all with the same serial number. Lots of military weapons. You have to look at rest of the entry to eliminate them by make, caliber, and other info.
Check back with the PD and see where they're at with the case. They will have to contact the PD where the gun was reported stolen. From 1972 that PD will no doubt have to dig thru their records to get a description of the stolen firearm and that could take some time digging thru back files.

 

[flieger]

I do have the officer's card and a copy of the report. He showed me the listing on his laptop for that serial number in the NCIC or some similar site. It did come up as a Marlin .22, altho' not the specific model. And as noted before, he omitted the prefix.

I have tried to get into the NCIC site to run the full serial number, with prefix, but have been unable to.

 

[motorep]

I had occasion to question the provenance of a rifle I had. I called the local FBI office, they were glad to help, called me back with an ok. It shouldn't be difficult.

 

[JohnBT]

"When he ran the serial number, he omitted the "W" prefix, and insisted that it is not part of the serial number."

He's an idiot, or substantially misinformed.

"It is W1257"

I have W11xx and Marlin told me my Mountie was made in '63. This was back before the days of easy on-line access to serial numbers.

John

 

[ChestyP]

The NCIC stolen gun data base

basically contains four elements of identification information: Type (e.g. rifle, shotgun, pistol, revolver); Make (e.g. Marlin, Winchester, etc); Caliber (usually just the actual .38, .30-30, .30-06, etc) and serial number (which SHOULD include prefixes/suffixes). No model numbers or other information is provided.

When an officer does a "check stolen," those are the four data elements he pokes into the computer. Obviously, an incomplete serial number can give false results.

The NCIC also contains additional information regarding the reporting agency, etc. That agency will have more complete/thorough identifying data on the gun in question. You should keep in touch with the department that seized the gun and have them confirm it's the one on the original report.

At least that's how it was done when I was a police dispatcher a decade ago.

 

[3 weelin geezer]

This reminds me of a long john silver commercial they ran a few years back. It involved a trooper or LAPD pulling over a guy for something or other. Think COPS show where they fuzz up the faces to protect the 'innocent'. The guy stood there outside his car asking 'what did I do?' and the cop asked him to step away from the bag (of food). He grabs the bag and starts walking back to the cruiser saying under his breath: "Oh boy, I'm gonna eat good tonight!" While the guy stands at his car slapping his legs and looking around wondering what just happened That was funny but I understand LJS got sued over that by the LAPD cuz it made them look like the mexican police!

 

[El Tejon]

This is not unheard of. Often cops looking to steal guns will claim weapons "stolen", or police will inadvertently call in transposed number which returns stolen. Sounds like you got the latter.

Case in Indianapolis maybe 15 years ago. Indiana State Police called in the model number of a revolver instead of the serial number (yes, you read that correctly). The weapon came back "stolen."

ISP was ordered to pay 100K at a civil trial.

 

[Ira Aten]

Why it happened

I think the reason this occurred, is because "only police officers" have the correct training and common sense to possibly be allowed to possess firearms.

If you don't believe it, ask Mayor Ray Nagin of New Orleans. He'll tell you.

 

[deadin]

I have what may be a stupid question. Do they "run" every gun that goes into a show in L.V.? If they do, it must take days to get set up.
If not every gun, why did they run yours?

Dean

 

[pete f]

I would also demand a certified copy of the original report AND I would get a letter from Marlin to claim that the W prefix is in fact a part of the serial number.

 

[Ala Dan]

Heck, that gun was stolen D) back when NCIC info was kept on large
white index cards~!

 

[isp2605]

NCIC was operational prior to early 1971 which was when I started doing entries. I worked with one of the agents who helped develop the program.

 

[c_yeager]

I seem to recall that the NCIC database deliberately excludes alphabetical characters from the serial number list (i.e the "serial number" for the search is the number on your weapon MINUS the letters). I dont remember the reason for this though, or if it is still done this way.

It is possible for a serial number to belong to several different weapons, one of which may well have been stolen, not necessarily the one that he confiscated from you though.

 

[Otherguy Overby]

Not that I'd take it to a gun show (I've no intention of selling it) I've a Remington Nylon 66 that does NOT have a serial number. I was with my dad when he bought it for me some time prior to 1968.

Would any authoritarian LEO believe me? I don't think so.

 

[Diomed]

I seem to recall that the NCIC database deliberately excludes alphabetical characters from the serial number list (i.e the "serial number" for the search is the number on your weapon MINUS the letters).

Seriously? That's about the dumbest thing I've ever heard, this week. Why on earth would omitting part of the number be useful? That's about as useful as saying the number has a two in it, if there's another weapon with a two in the serial number listed as stolen then obviously it's the same gun.

Not that I'd take it to a gun show (I've no intention of selling it) I've a Remington Nylon 66 that does NOT have a serial number. I was with my dad when he bought it for me some time prior to 1968.

Same here. And a shotgun in the same way.

 

[steveno]

so why was he checking serial numbers of guns to begin with? is it a state law or what? I have been to gunshows in Nebraska , Wyoming and Colorado and never seen a serial number check run on any gun

 

[isp2605]

"Quote:
I seem to recall that the NCIC database deliberately excludes alphabetical characters from the serial number list (i.e the "serial number" for the search is the number on your weapon MINUS the letters).

Seriously? That's about the dumbest thing I've ever heard, this week. Why on earth would omitting part of the number be useful? "

Not true. Alpha characters can be included in serial numbers.

 

[Otherguy Overby]

Something is fishy here. I've several guns with a mixture of letters and numerals in their serial numbers. Also, my previously mentioned rifle with NO serial number. Anyway my carry STI would have only a 4 digit serial number without the letters, 22XX. MY 3rd generation Glock would only have a 3 digit serial number comprised of the same digit like 222 for example.

Mr. Cop is running some kind of game...

 

[flieger]

Thanks for all the help, guys.

I have a call in with the FBI field office in Las Vegas. If they can corroborate that the rifle was indeed stolen in 1972 then so be it.

If it does not come up as stolen then I think the Metro Detective in question will be in fairly hot water. I will keep those of you following this thread posted, and thanks again for all the input.

 

[flieger]

That's all she wrote...

Repeated attempts to get a 'second opinion' resulted in zip. I heard from the detective who confiscated my Marlin 39 today and he claims to have spoken with the company and that they substantiate his claim. I sure hope the rightful owner is still alive and gets it back. It is in mint condition and in all likelihood worth five times what he paid for it. Otherwise it will be destroyed. Don't want those gangstas toting a lever action .22 carbine. No siree Bob.

 

[cassandrasdaddy]

cynic

have you contacted marlin?