Strange flintlock for sale in Los Angeles - Can we identify it?

[colonelhogan44]

First, What is this thing?

http://losangeles.craigslist.org/wst/atq/3308141556.html

Second, someone in the L.A. area should go pick it up and fix it and then show us all the pictures!

 

[bubba15301]

middle eastern rifle

 

[Busyhands94]

Pick it up, might make for a good BP shotgun for hunting squirrels.

 

[mnrivrat]

Rides well on the back of a camel . Usualy the locks & barrels were British, the rest Bedowen . Middle East as said.

 

[colonelhogan44]

Unfortunately, I am not that close to the LA area, otherwise I might.

 

[BHP FAN]

Turkish, or North African...

 

[ntech]

False eastern copy made with pipe. I've seen in Morroco how they produce it and finish to "look old".

 

[zimmerstutzen]

Khyber junk.

 

[Flyincedar]

Was on Cajun Pawn Stars the other night. Rifle made for use on a camel

 

[BADUNAME30]

My first impression was Turkish.
Pretty cool what ever it is.
Even if it's fake.

 

[AlexanderA]

For what it is, I would say it's original (not recently put together for the tourist trade, as many are). The lock is a well-made Western piece (probably French). From the shape of the stock, I would say it's North African. Most likely, it's from one of the former French North African colonies (Morocco, Algeria, Tunisia). (This is just educated guesswork.)

 

[Slamfire]

On a recent television show, Bruce Canfield identified one as a "Camel Gun". I forget if it came from Morocco or not, but my recollection is that these are Arabic North African.

Mr Canfield said there was an aftermarket in making these for the tourist trade, so you would have to examine the thing carefully to see if the lock and barrel are functional, or just for show.

The pieces he examined had english locks, one stamped for the English East India Company and the other was stamped Tower.

If this is from LA it could also be a prop gun from a movie studio. I saw one of those, it was a flintlock made from parts, don't think it was meant to be fired, but from ten feet it looked like a gun. The great movie studio's collasped in the 60's and their inventory was sold off. MGM comes to mind, they are now just a brand name.

 

[rodinal220]

Afghan vet bring back.

 

[kBob]

"two rupee Jazeel"

but I Kiple......

Oddly one like it used to hang in a resteraunt on a Reservation near Monument valley, supposedly brought back fro WWII by a Navaho Code Talker......

They were also advertised in gun magazines in the way back as decorators.

A gun much like it appears in a 1958 catalog I have identified as a"Flintlock Musket from India" Smooth bore .54 caliber.

The guns identified as north african in that catalog all have straighter butt stocks.

The type of gun pictured here that is shown has far mor silver decoration and sold for $60 in 1958. Lock was English made.

Want to cry? Brown Bess Muskets and even original Baker Rifles sold for around $60 in that catalog.

Just to make folks go "geez, loueez" 1862 Colt Pocket Police $85, Metro politain same $74, REmmie NMA .44 $125, Star .36 described as having a true double and single action $55, and A trantor .31 cased with tools, bullet mold, flask, tin of bullets two cap tins, grease pot "all original" $110.

-kBob

 

[zimmerstutzen]

Some of those khyber gjunksmiths can turn out some amazingly proper looking stuff. There are a bunch of Afghan vet returns that look like British Martini Enfields, but the Word "Enfield" is spelled wrong, or letters are upside down. Now making a fake cartridge gun that looks that legit is an art. (Dangerous if somebody actually tries to fire one)

The trigger is jammed so far forward in the guard that a finger won't fit. Many of the original guns of that style had no trigger guard, and the triggers was just a straight piece with a ball on the end.

 

[Berkley]

kBob Kipled korrectly: the Craigslist gun is an Afghan jezail.

Long-barreled muskets with match-,flint- or percussion-lock ignitiion are common throughout the Islamic world from North Africa to India, but the distinctive curved buttstock of the Craigslist gun is peculiar to the jezail from Afghanistan.

rodinall220 is probably right about it being an Afghan vet bringback - they are very common in the markets of Kabul. Can't tell from the crummy pics whether zimmerstutzen is right about it being Khyber junk - plenty of that is peddled to unsuspecting troops wanting a souvenir of the Rockpile, but there are genuine old pieces to be found among the newly made. The fact that this one has such a plain stock, rather than the flashy mother of pearl inlay common to a lot of the newer tourist pieces means it could be a genuine 19th century gun with an East India Company lock.

(Or not - bad pics make it impossible to say for sure :banghead: ).

 

[Loyalist Dave]

Berkley is right,

It's a Jezail musket. Made for killing off British Redcoats the last time they tried to take and keep the Khyber Pass.

FYI it was a "Jezail bullet" that injured Doctor Watson, Sherlock Holmes' partner, when Watson was in Afghanistan, and thus caused him to leave the British army and thus begin his association with Holmes. Fiction of course but that would've been the type of gun that Sir Arthur Conan Doyle was talking about when he created Holmes and Watson...

LD

 

[rcmodel]

Made for killing off British Redcoats

Or to sell to tourists and interior decorators.

I wouldn't touch it as it is probably not safe to fire.

rc