Switching from Jacketed to lead. Need help, please.

[Keiger]

Running a Kimber 45 have been loading the 230 gr. TMJ with Bullseye at 4.9 gr. and OAL of 1.275.
Problem is I have the Lyman 48th edition and there is no data on the cast bullet.
Have a box of Lazer Cast 230gr. RN
With the cast bullet will I need to mess with the OAL?

If I can use the Bullseye will I need to mess with the powder levels to get the action to work right with the cast bullet?

Do I need to buy a new book for the load data?
Thanks Keig

 

[DIV03]

Might want to look here as one reference:http://www.reloadammo.com/45loads.htm

 

[LiveLife]

Keiger, try some test loads at 4.0/4.3/4.6 gr of Bullseye using the same OAL.

I run my 45 ACP loads at 4.3/4.5 gr of Bullseye with 1.25" OAL.

 

[Keiger]

Very cool thanks for the the link Divo3. bds what does the OAL do to the action of the auto load?
Also do these cast bullets need to be crimped?
Thank for the help.

 

[LiveLife]

OAL (Over All Length) of the pistol cartridge affect feeding/chambering characteristics and chamber pressure.

Too long or short of OAL, and the round may not feed/chamber properly for your magazine/ramp/chamber.

Deeper you seat the bullet, the chamber pressure increases for the same amount of powder charge. That's why all the published load data always lists OAL and many posters on THR do too.

Unlike seating jacketed or plated bullets, seating lead bullets require a bit more flaring to minimize shaving the sides of the bullet during seating (Also, if the bullet is tilted during seating, shaving of lead will happen too). I always apply just enough taper crimp to remove the flaring of the case neck used to seat the bullet. The finished round should have straight case neck that should drop in freely into case gauge or the tightest chamber/barrel you have.

 

[Keiger]

Should I keep my cast OAL at the same as my jacketed ones, since it works in my Kimber? The link from Divo3 did not show OAL.

 

[LiveLife]

As to link not showing OAL, I am not sure. But if the OAL is not mentioned, it may "assume" the caliber standard (1.25" for 45ACP, 1.125" for 9mm/40S&W).

If the longer OAL feeds/chambers fine in your pistol, by all means use the longer OAL. Longer OAL will engage the rifling sooner and often provides for more accurate rounds. For some pistols, you have to decrease the OAL to feed/chamber properly.

OAL will often depend on the nose profile of the bullet used and Walkalong has an excellent thread on it - http://www.thehighroad.org/showthread.php?t=506678

 

[Keiger]

Very cool thanks for all the help. I will read up on this and tear down the Kimber later today and the headspace. Keig

 

[LiveLife]

http://www.alliantpowder.com/reloaders/powderlist.aspx?type=1&powderid=1&cartridge=35

Here's the load data for Bullseye from Alliant's website:

45 Auto 230 gr Speer TJM RN Speer 1.26" OAL 5.7 gr 840 fps
45 Auto 230 gr Speer GDHP Speer 1.2" OAL 5 gr 812 fps

TJM (Total Jacketed Metal) RN should have similar nose profile as lead RN. Since it is showing 5.7 gr as max load at 1.26" OAL, you should be fine using up to 4.8 gr with your longer 1.275" OAL (You probably may end up increasing the charge to around 5.0 gr).

Try test loading some 4.5/4.8/5.0 gr at 1.275" OAL and see how they work out for you.

 

[LiveLife]

Duplicate post

 

[NuJudge]

I worry more about lubricated cast bullets getting pushed back into the case, than I worry about jacketed bullets getting pushed back. Test to make sure it is not happening. My biggest problems have been with old Remington brass, which is thin. Lee's Size die is small to start with, and they make an undersize die for another company, which is nice to have.

CDD

 

[Walkalong]

My first .45 sizer would not work with Remington brass. A call to RCBS and another tighter sizer was sent my way.

 

[Keiger]

Here is another silly question I have had for ever but did'nt know where to ask it.

Why with the different bullets weights does the OAL change?

 

[LiveLife]

Using 45ACP bullets as an example, 185/200/230 bullets have similar base (part that is seated into the case neck), but different nose shape and length (part that sticks above the case neck).

So if you seat the bullets the same amount into the case neck, amount above the case neck will vary and give you different OAL.

 

[Keiger]

So if I get a good head space with one bullet on the OAL, will it work with all the different weight bullets?
1.25 OAL should be the same for all (for that gun) right?
Thanks for putting up with me. Keig

 

[rcmodel]

Your Lyman manual most assuredly has data for a 230 LRN bullet like your Lasercast 230 RN bullets.

Look at the data for the Lyman #452374 cast bullet.
It is listed as 225 grain, but that is without lube.
It is a 230 when the grease groove is filled with lube.

OAL is shown as 1.272", and that would be correct with any 230 grain round nose bullet similar to the GI FMJ-RN shape.

1.25 OAL should be the same for all (for that gun) right?

No!
As already noted, every bullet weight & shape will have a different "correct" seating depth & OAL length.

Headspace is controlled by the case length, not the seating depth or OAL. You need to chamber check your loads to make sure they do not hit the rifling leade before fully chambering. You should not have a problem with your RN bullet design.

rc

 

[Keiger]

Rcmodel, got it, I was missing the case length. Now I got the lyman data no lube.
I'm going to go load some lead. Keig