What about left handed CTC grips? Right now the only one I want is a J-Frame, the beam is not obstructed the way I grip that. Other than that, useless, since I am gripped way up on the gun with my thumbs forward on any auto-pistol.
Tactical Tip from 'the' Larry Vickers
- Thread starter SkyGuy
- Start date
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I been using lasers for a little over a year now. I have CT on a S&W 1911, a LaserMax on a Glock 19 and a NcStar on a AR15.
I have found that in low light I can shoot faster, more accurate, and with a lot more confident. In very bright sunlight they are not that easy to see, but I normally don't need them then.
They do help with learning trigger control and point shooting. Especially the CT because you can activate the laser after you get on point. lets you know just how close you are. You can see your mistakes when you pull the trigger. The laser shows you what you are doing wrong.
Personally I like the CT over the LaserMax because they are brighter and adjustable. But I feel either one is a great addition to help increase your ability to use your weapon more proficiently.
I have found that in low light I can shoot faster, more accurate, and with a lot more confident. In very bright sunlight they are not that easy to see, but I normally don't need them then.
They do help with learning trigger control and point shooting. Especially the CT because you can activate the laser after you get on point. lets you know just how close you are. You can see your mistakes when you pull the trigger. The laser shows you what you are doing wrong.
Personally I like the CT over the LaserMax because they are brighter and adjustable. But I feel either one is a great addition to help increase your ability to use your weapon more proficiently.
brownie0486
Member
Deleted due to misreading the OPs starter post.
Brownie
Brownie
brownie0486
Member
Hmm,
Today we had the glock dr. from Az into the shop, he installed some parts into my g17.
While there, he also installed a giuderod laser into a customers gun that pulsated. Got to try it out for a few minutes.
First thing I saw was that at 8 feet, it was 4 inches low. So I then started looking for targets of opportunity at various distances in the store to determine where this laser actually met with the sights.
The laser was dead on with the sights at 32 to 38 feet. Thats not acceptable, any way you slice it to my thinking. Can't be adjusted either.
I know the CT's can be adjusted, I just don't want to change the feel of the grip on my glocks which is required to use one. I've tried various lasers a few times on friends and others handguns, they slow me down and are consequently counter productive in a defensive close environ for me personally.
I don't use red dots on my defensive guns, and don't know anyone who does. Consequently, the comment that they are as fast as the red dot sighting systems is a moot point.
I do have a dot on my 22/45 for hunting and plinking. I've also used a dot in competition over a span of 5 years on a gov 45. The dot to me is not anywhere near the same as a laser sight. I used the dot offensively in competiton, not defensively.
They have their place [ the lasers ], but that place is not on my carry weapons. I'd also like to comment on double naughts observations here:
I've seen at least one trainer who supports the CT product yet has never been seen [ on numerous ocassions ] carrying one on his personal defense handgun. Seems at odds with that trainers statements and is very hard to explain no matter how you slice it.
Brownie
Today we had the glock dr. from Az into the shop, he installed some parts into my g17.
While there, he also installed a giuderod laser into a customers gun that pulsated. Got to try it out for a few minutes.
First thing I saw was that at 8 feet, it was 4 inches low. So I then started looking for targets of opportunity at various distances in the store to determine where this laser actually met with the sights.
The laser was dead on with the sights at 32 to 38 feet. Thats not acceptable, any way you slice it to my thinking. Can't be adjusted either.
I know the CT's can be adjusted, I just don't want to change the feel of the grip on my glocks which is required to use one. I've tried various lasers a few times on friends and others handguns, they slow me down and are consequently counter productive in a defensive close environ for me personally.
I don't use red dots on my defensive guns, and don't know anyone who does. Consequently, the comment that they are as fast as the red dot sighting systems is a moot point.
I do have a dot on my 22/45 for hunting and plinking. I've also used a dot in competition over a span of 5 years on a gov 45. The dot to me is not anywhere near the same as a laser sight. I used the dot offensively in competiton, not defensively.
They have their place [ the lasers ], but that place is not on my carry weapons. I'd also like to comment on double naughts observations here:
I've seen at least one trainer who supports the CT product yet has never been seen [ on numerous ocassions ] carrying one on his personal defense handgun. Seems at odds with that trainers statements and is very hard to explain no matter how you slice it.
Brownie
sturmruger
Member
I have a nice pair of CT grips for my J Frame it was the best $200 I ever spent. I know have a $500 J Frame but it shoots so nice I really can't complain too much.
DigitalWarrior
Member
Laser Accuracy.
My laser is zeroed to my sights at roughly 20 yards. Up close I think I am about one or two inches off. I have never shot it at 40 yards, but figure it is roughly the same accuracy. I figure that with COM shots, 1 or 2 inches isn't a bad trade. If it is I am firing outside 40, it is time to run away, or close in (can't imagine why the hell I would want to do that, but it is an available option)
DW
PS, experts, please let me know if my assumption about 40 yards is wrong. The life you save may be my own.
My laser is zeroed to my sights at roughly 20 yards. Up close I think I am about one or two inches off. I have never shot it at 40 yards, but figure it is roughly the same accuracy. I figure that with COM shots, 1 or 2 inches isn't a bad trade. If it is I am firing outside 40, it is time to run away, or close in (can't imagine why the hell I would want to do that, but it is an available option)
DW
PS, experts, please let me know if my assumption about 40 yards is wrong. The life you save may be my own.
Hey Glocksters, did you know this:
"Crimson Trace Earns High-Tech Product of the Year Award and Two NRA Golden Bullseye Awards
At the 135th NRA Annual Meeting held in Milwaukee, Wisconsin on May 19-21, 2006, Crimson Trace hit a trifecta by winning three prestigious awards from the shooting industry.
CTC's new G-Series™ Lasergrips® won two Golden Bullseye Awards from the NRA. American Rifleman Magazine awarded "Accessory of the Year" and Woman’s Outlook gave "Personal Protection Accessory of the Year" to the G-Series, a family of Lasergrips designed to fit Glock firearms.
Later the same day, Crimson Trace was distinguished by the Academy Of Excellence by being chosen to receive the High-Tech Product of the Year award, also for the G-Series.
That makes it two consecutive years for Crimson Trace to be awarded this honor.
The Golden Bullseye Award is presented by the National Rifle Association at the national show to acknowledge the finest products available in the shooting sports industry."
.
"Crimson Trace Earns High-Tech Product of the Year Award and Two NRA Golden Bullseye Awards
At the 135th NRA Annual Meeting held in Milwaukee, Wisconsin on May 19-21, 2006, Crimson Trace hit a trifecta by winning three prestigious awards from the shooting industry.
CTC's new G-Series™ Lasergrips® won two Golden Bullseye Awards from the NRA. American Rifleman Magazine awarded "Accessory of the Year" and Woman’s Outlook gave "Personal Protection Accessory of the Year" to the G-Series, a family of Lasergrips designed to fit Glock firearms.
Later the same day, Crimson Trace was distinguished by the Academy Of Excellence by being chosen to receive the High-Tech Product of the Year award, also for the G-Series.
That makes it two consecutive years for Crimson Trace to be awarded this honor.
The Golden Bullseye Award is presented by the National Rifle Association at the national show to acknowledge the finest products available in the shooting sports industry."
.
Geronimo45
Member
"I've seen at least one trainer who supports the CT product yet has never been seen [ on numerous ocassions ] carrying one on his personal defense handgun."
Could be due to the fact that CT seems to specialize in grips for full-sized handguns, mostly. As for j-frames, I hear that the lightweight ones can be painful to shoot, and some folks probably have the rubber grips instead, and don't see a reason to change.
Could be due to the fact that CT seems to specialize in grips for full-sized handguns, mostly. As for j-frames, I hear that the lightweight ones can be painful to shoot, and some folks probably have the rubber grips instead, and don't see a reason to change.
BullfrogKen
Moderator Emeritus
Could be, except that all those trainers I saw carried full sized guns. The list of popularity each year had been, in this order:
1911's
Glocks - full to mid size
Sigs
They can carry whatever they want without the constraints we have of moving amongst an office staff without being noticed. Or a labor intensive job requiring clothing restrictions or shop uniforms. Most of those guys actually did, and do, carry what they shot the event with. None I can remember had Crimson Trace, or laser anything.
Its nothing more than an observation, fellas. But if there's a consensus on the matter, it isn't that its sweeping the community.
By contrast, EVERYONE had a flashlight. Some multiple.
Re: Trainers not using lasers.
The main theory I have is that the top trainers are good. Lasers and other aids are of minimal benefit for them, and are likely detrimental. When they point their gun, they already know where it's going to hit. No need for using the dot as a reference.
Me, I've only been shooting for nine months or so. 3" groups at 15 yards is about the best I can do with my current level of skill. Bring it out to 25 yards, and it's more like 10" groups. CT Lasergrips dramatically improve my speed and accuracy at those ranges. Same for shooting from the hip and other unconventional positions. As my skills increase, the level of benefit from the Lasergrips will decrease. But hey, they're useful now and that's what matters.
The main theory I have is that the top trainers are good. Lasers and other aids are of minimal benefit for them, and are likely detrimental. When they point their gun, they already know where it's going to hit. No need for using the dot as a reference.
Me, I've only been shooting for nine months or so. 3" groups at 15 yards is about the best I can do with my current level of skill. Bring it out to 25 yards, and it's more like 10" groups. CT Lasergrips dramatically improve my speed and accuracy at those ranges. Same for shooting from the hip and other unconventional positions. As my skills increase, the level of benefit from the Lasergrips will decrease. But hey, they're useful now and that's what matters.
These are just 'some' of the folks who believe that Lasergrips offer an immediate tactical advantage:
Marion County Sheriff's Department Outfits 300 Deputies with Lasergrips
Crimson Trace Corporation announces that Marion County Sheriff"s Office has purchased Lasergrips for all 300 sworn deputies within their department to mount on their SiG P-220 service pistols. The purchase comes after much testing and evaluation of the various types of laser-sighting devices on the market.
'We simply wanted the best equipment for our deputies in the field," stated Major John Bullwinkle, "Lasergrips have proven themselves on the street and as a training tool in the classroom." 10-2-06
Smith & Wesson knows the quality and performance that Crimson Trace Lasergrips provide. That's why customized Lasergrips featuring the Smith & Wesson logo now come standard on selected autos and revolvers.
Crimson Trace Corporation today announced an agreement to supply specially designed Lasergrips® to Kimber® for several full-size and compact 1911 pistol models in .45 ACP. 8-24-05
Crimson Trace Corp and Hillsborough County Florida Sheriffs Office Partner Together to Make the Streets Safer
Crimson Trace Corp is pleased to announce the nation's 7th largest Sheriff's department adoption of Lasergrips.
Hillsborough County Florida Sheriff's Office has authorized the use of Crimson Trace Lasergrips for their 1,100 deputies in the field. 9-1-04
Lasergrips Standard Issue for Singapore Police
The Singapore Police force has made Crimson Trace Lasergrips standard issue for all of their patrol officers. Positive results after a purchase of over 10,500 Lasergrips last year lead to the agency's most recent order for an additional 6,200 of the grip-integrated laser systems. 3-20-03
Crimson Trace Lasergrips accepted by Orlando, FL Police Department
As part of its ongoing commitment to community protection and officer safety, the Orlando Police Department has just approved its [/u]750 officers to carry Crimson Trace Lasergrips on-duty[/u]. Lasergrips replace the standard grips on the officer’s Sig-Sauer duty pistols and project a bright-red dot to indicate where a bullet would impact.
Crimson Trace Lasergrips are in use by hundreds of law-enforcement agencies worldwide and are a proven concept. Orlando accepted Crimson Trace as the only approved laser system after an extensive year-and-a-half testing process. 9-3-02
.
Marion County Sheriff's Department Outfits 300 Deputies with Lasergrips
Crimson Trace Corporation announces that Marion County Sheriff"s Office has purchased Lasergrips for all 300 sworn deputies within their department to mount on their SiG P-220 service pistols. The purchase comes after much testing and evaluation of the various types of laser-sighting devices on the market.
'We simply wanted the best equipment for our deputies in the field," stated Major John Bullwinkle, "Lasergrips have proven themselves on the street and as a training tool in the classroom." 10-2-06
Smith & Wesson knows the quality and performance that Crimson Trace Lasergrips provide. That's why customized Lasergrips featuring the Smith & Wesson logo now come standard on selected autos and revolvers.
Crimson Trace Corporation today announced an agreement to supply specially designed Lasergrips® to Kimber® for several full-size and compact 1911 pistol models in .45 ACP. 8-24-05
Crimson Trace Corp and Hillsborough County Florida Sheriffs Office Partner Together to Make the Streets Safer
Crimson Trace Corp is pleased to announce the nation's 7th largest Sheriff's department adoption of Lasergrips.
Hillsborough County Florida Sheriff's Office has authorized the use of Crimson Trace Lasergrips for their 1,100 deputies in the field. 9-1-04
Lasergrips Standard Issue for Singapore Police
The Singapore Police force has made Crimson Trace Lasergrips standard issue for all of their patrol officers. Positive results after a purchase of over 10,500 Lasergrips last year lead to the agency's most recent order for an additional 6,200 of the grip-integrated laser systems. 3-20-03
Crimson Trace Lasergrips accepted by Orlando, FL Police Department
As part of its ongoing commitment to community protection and officer safety, the Orlando Police Department has just approved its [/u]750 officers to carry Crimson Trace Lasergrips on-duty[/u]. Lasergrips replace the standard grips on the officer’s Sig-Sauer duty pistols and project a bright-red dot to indicate where a bullet would impact.
Crimson Trace Lasergrips are in use by hundreds of law-enforcement agencies worldwide and are a proven concept. Orlando accepted Crimson Trace as the only approved laser system after an extensive year-and-a-half testing process. 9-3-02
.
Let's keep this thread on the topic of lasers. This is turning into a commercial for Crimson Trace. Not that I have anything against them, in my personal opinion they make the best laser available but I'm not going to allow the use of THR bandwidth to sell anyone's product.
Skyguy before you post again you need to PM me with your real name so I can verify that you really are a consultant for Crimson Trace.
Jeff
Skyguy before you post again you need to PM me with your real name so I can verify that you really are a consultant for Crimson Trace.
Jeff
Ryder
Member
Using a laser could assist a prosecutor in claiming I shot to kill. I appreciate having the option of shooting someone between the eyes "by accident". The shooter needs to be the one who determines how fast the threat needs to be stopped, not some bald headed tie-guy sitting behind a desk.
I'm 'not' a consultant with Crimson Trace.
Sorry that you mis-interpreted my original post.
This thread starter post is a word for word copy of a tactical tip from Larry Vickers.
Here is the link to that 'tactical tip' where he says that HE is a consultant for Crimson Trace.
http://www.vickerstactical.com/Tips/visibleLasers.htm
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Car Knocker
Member
*I* certainly believed you to be a consultant with CT. The first paragraph reads that way and the lack of attribution for the article didn't help, either.
I'm closing this one. I've been in contact with Crimson Trace. They will pleased to know that one of their consultants is not posting in this thread.
Jeff
Jeff
- Status
