Tales of one who DISLIKES 9mm

Status
Not open for further replies.
Where did the other 14rds go? :uhoh:

100_6521.gif


A good friend of mine is a retired EMS Captain.. We were talking about things he had seen in his job over the years, and one of the subjects was bullet size, stopping power, bullet wounds in general and the like.

He said he had seen two occasions where a person was killed by one 22cal round.. Another time it was a 25cal, one round, killed the guy.

So I kinda figure obviously the bigger the projectile the better, but small rounds of various caliber have been doing a pretty good job for a long, long time..

My buddy carries a S&W SW99. (16+1 capacity). I carry either my Walther P99c/AS with 10+1, or the slightly larger fullsize P99/AS with 15+1..

If I ever get scared enough to have to shoot someone in defense of my life he had better be able to take 16 rounds of 9mm Corbon because I'm too much of a chicken to stop until the last round is downrange..

Just guessing, but I'll bet you if you could keep track you would find out that 9mm has killed more people all over the world than any other caliber. Nine MM was very popular all over the planet before it ever hit our shores. I know the Germans used up a round or two wayyy back in WW2..

Best Wishes,

J. Pomeroy
 
He said he had seen two occasions where a person was killed by one 22cal round.. Another time it was a 25cal, one round, killed the guy.
Click to expand...

Happens all the time. Most people on the street are killed by just one or two .22lr rounds. The .45ACP guys don't like to hear that, but it's true. All handgun cartridges are about the same unless you are carrying a .44 Mag or bigger than you are talking "hand-cannon".

If you only feel confident with .45ACP, then sorry to say you need to work on your shooting skills. A good shooter can stop a threat with any service caliber.
 
Most people on the street are killed by just one or two .22lr rounds. The .45ACP guys don't like to hear that, but it's true.
Click to expand...

Not quite. There's a big difference between killing a rival and stopping an unjust attacker. Many people who are murdered live for a while after the shooting.

But if you're attacked by a man intent on robbrey, murder or raping your wife or daughter, you want to stop him. If there was a way to do it reliably without using deadly force, that's the method you'd use. But the paramount thing is to stop him, not wound him and hope he dies hours later.

As the defender in a situation like this, you're already at a disadvantage -- your attacker picks the time and place for the attack. Therefore it doesn't make sense to further handicap yourself with something less that a gun that has a reputation for stopping attackers.

And if you read (and believe) the varous studies, the .45 ACP is about even with the .357 Magnum. Both are highly effective stoppers.
 
Many people who are murdered live for a while after the shooting.
Click to expand...

Watch "The First 48" on A&E. They find many people dead right there in the middle of the street and on the sidewalk. Most are shot with .22lr sometimes even .25ACP. Shot placement trumps caliber again.

Don't get me wrong I'm not recommending everyone walk around carrying Beretta Tomcats or anything, but to put .45ACP up on a pedestal over the a 9mm or .40 is absurd to say the least.

People put too much thought into calibers these days, which is really evident when you see people arguing over service calibers. They are too close to each other to even be argued about.
 
And that logic tells you that if it had been a 45, you would have been slammed against the wall and DRT?
Click to expand...

Well, given that I know the situation and you don't, yes, logic dictates that. When I was hit, I was in a very unstable position, I was at a very close range, and it hit me very low in the body. Would the .45 for sure have done me in? I don't know, but it most certainly would have done more damage, particularly at the range that I was at. The 9mm zipped right though me, leaving what I suppose was a very neat hole, where as the .45 would have left, if nothing else, a larger very neat hole. A small hole isn't good, a big hole is worse, basically. Besides all that, I never once stated that a .45 couldn't fail. Heck, people have gotten up and fought after getting hit by .30-06 rounds! Trust me, I am the last person that believes in any sort of "1-shot stop" nonsense. About the farthest I would take that argument is that I believe that the .45 is consistently more effective than the 9mm.

Also, Tantrix, you make a good point. There is a lot of talk about calibers, and a lot of it is nonsense. I agree totally with you that the .22lr can be a killer, but by that logic a .50 is just as effective as a .22, because after all, lots of people have died from both. It's not a function of what a particular bullet can do, but a function of what a particular bullet can do more efficiently. From that perspective, I absolutely place the .45 on a pedestal in comparison to other viable "defensive" calibers. That doesn't mean the other rounds suck, it just means that of the other rounds, I think it's the best choice. The 9mm, for me, has become a very viable 2nd choice because I can shoot it a little better. What I lose in power I make up for in accuracy, but keep in mind that it's a pretty small difference in both cases.
 
Watch "The First 48" on A&E. They find many people dead right there in the middle of the street and on the sidewalk. Most are shot with .22lr sometimes even .25ACP. Shot placement trumps caliber again.
Click to expand...

No one would deny that shot placement is all-important. As I have said, however, there are many factors involved in chosing a defensive weapon -- and it should be chosen as a weapon, a complete system, not as a cartridge. Your decision criteria should include how well you shoot the weapon system, your level of confidence in it, and so on.

The .45 ACP in its original platform, the M1911 is a very good choice.
 
TimboKhan:

Just curious, but I wonder if the 9mm rd you were punctured with was ball ammo, or hollowpoint?

I know most of us practice with the cheapest 9mm rds we cana buy, and often that is wwwb...

My pistols are loaded with hollowpoint Cor-Bons and when they were testing 9mm ammo several years ago this stuff tested very well..

Best Wishes,

J. Pomeroy
 
show some love for the 9mm

The nine is fine, it has a proven track record and is very popular for a reason. The argument that it is cheaper to shoot has diminished some, 2 years ago I was buying it at Walmart for $10.96 per hundred, now its $14.?? plus tax. I don't care because I reload for mine now. One of the advantages for me is that nobody seems to bother picking up the 9mm brass, nowadays I just paid for primers, powders and bullets.

When taping IDPA targets at matches, I do see that the .45s make bigger, nicer holes, does that diminish my faith in my nine, hell no. If I ever had to engage a person with my pistol, you can bet there would be more than one shot going downrange. With my nine I'm confident that I can keep then all where they need to be. In capable hands a 9mm is a very dangerous weapon.

The great thing about shooting IS all the different choices out there, some people just seem to go overboard in the defense of one pistol caliber over another.

regards,

Luis Leon
 
Worry not, it's not a hate thread. It's a like thread frome one who USED to hate.
Click to expand...


That's an awesome loophole. As long as it's past tense hate, it flies.
 
PX15,

It was ball ammo. Had it been any sort of hollowpoint, my suspicion would be that it would have expanded sufficiently enough to hit my spine, which would have sucked.
 
It was ball ammo. Had it been any sort of hollowpoint, my suspicion would be that it would have expanded sufficiently enough to hit my spine, which would have sucked.
Click to expand...

Congrats and thanks for serving.
 
Johnny Quest: I don't forget easily....I know this is not a "hate" thread, but it's no more different than my post-parody of "hate" toward Kahr which you shut-down & dressed me-down because some "yahooo" said it contained the word HATE...:confused: In the future, the word dislike should be substituted for hate and everyone could be happy.....:)
Now that I got that off my chest.....:)This caliber-war has a different slant which is nice....There are times & locations when you want to strap on something that has a little more "bite": it is .45acp time.....:D
 
If bigger is better, why stop at 45 cal?

tb_gun-lg-1.jpg
 
I own a 9 & it's fun to shoot. I carry it as a BUG when needed, but my love affair with the .45 will never end.
 
It shows the .357 Sig and the larger calibers have larger temporary cavities -- for whatever that's worth. I note no light-weight, higher speed .45 ACP round was tested, such as the 185 grain bullet.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Back
Top