Teach a Frenchman to shoot?

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Malice

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This isnt a French-bashing thread.

I am home from college for the summer and one of my friends in high school has a French student staying with her for the whole month. Not to go to school, but be immersed in the English language to learn it better.

I of course asked him about guns.

It is hard to converse with him, because his English is very broken. He understood me, though, and he said, yes, his uncle is a policeman and he has shot a ".22 lone rifelll"

I asked him if he wanted to go to a shooting range and shoot some of my guns. He didnt understand me and looked to my friend to translate, and he looked back at me and said "real?"

It was a beautiful moment, because I told him yes, real, about 10 of them.

His face lit up like a freakin roman candle and he nodded his head so hard I thought it would fall off.

So, he is more than willing. He asked me which kind of guns. He knows the Winchester brand, but not Marlin. I said I had Swiss, American, and Soviet. His eyes lit up, and he definatly recognizes "Kalashnikov"

So, I want to take him. Here is my problem...

Beforehand, I would of course have to go over the rules. He is a smart guy, but his English is fairly limited. I am afraid I would not be able to teach him gun safety with the language barrier.

So what do you think? Do you think his 1/2 understanding of English, my friend's 1/2 understanding of French, and my instruction make for a fun day at the range or a disaster waiting to happen.

Also, I realize even if he doesnt totaly understand my words, what he does understand along with me acting it out with an unloaded gun might be enough?
 
don't foget rule no. 1

For the trainer I mean.
Stay behind the shooter at all times.( actually I'ts my made-up rule,but it's a good one,no?)
I think if the 3 of you work at it a bit the safety training will pay off.Just be SURE to limit his ammo to 1 round at a time for a time.
 
Go for it.

Be careful

Be watchful.

Emphasize above all "Always keep the muzzle pointed in a safe direction."

Go for it.
 
Show him one step at a time using an obviously unloaded rifle (easier to control than a pistol) - at the range not in the house - to keep finger out of trigger guard until on target etc. If he makes a mistake like swinging the gun back off the firing line, forcefully grab the gun and correct him. This is no time for PC be sure he knows it is "deadly" serious. Use the correct terms and speak slowly as you instruct him so he can learn the words. Make him repeat several times each instruction.

When (if) live fire comes load one shot at a time and watch his habits. Don't allow multiple rounds until he is habitually safe. If he doesn't get it forget it. If it works out you have made at least one convert. The French are smart people they are just not well programmed to stand up for their individual rights.

Just MHO!
 
See if you can get something in French and English with all the safety rules so you can follow them while demonstrating each technique. Pick a comfortable place for it.
 
I don't think the language barrier will be too much of a concern. Safety concepts are pretty easy to convey through demonstration and body language.

We get alot of foreigners at my local range, particularly Eastern Europeans of various origins (Estonians LOVE Hi-Points. Figure that out...). Most of them ask as best they can for pointers, and I've found that a patient tone and simple demonstration seem to be very effective.

(I deserve a gold star for not making some sort of French joke in this post. I really do...)
 
You could always try babelfish: http://babelfish.altavista.com I don't know if I'd trust it for life-and-death situations, though.

One additional word of caution: make sure you only let him handle weapons with drop-safe firing pins.
 
I was going to make a smart comment...
Something along the lines of "Do what you can but don't expect much." :D

I think it can be done.
We had a Finnish foreign exchange student in our senior class and he got to go deer hunting while he was here. He did have some familiarity with guns to start with though.

BTW - I suffer from a last name of French origin. I am therefore allowed to make French jokes. :D
 
Just be careful. I think Science has proven that Frenchmen are genetically predisposed to dropping any gun they are holding and tossing their hands in the air at the first sound of gunfire. :D
 
I would check some Canadian web sites for the basic firearm safety rules. Many of them are liable to have pages or PDF files you can print out that are already in french. There is a French Uzi owner on the www.uzitalk.com forums. Maybe you could ask him to translate the 4 rules into frenchy.
 
I have a friend who taught a deaf woman how to shoot. So yes, it can be done.

My advice?

1) Chances are, his written understanding is ahead of his spoken/heard understanding. So give him the 4 Rules on paper written out beforehand. He's probably got a French/English dictionary on hand so he can do a translation for himself if he needs to.

2) Take it slow. Once you add hearing protection into the equation, everything is going to become very much more difficult. So do as much as you can, safety-wise, before the hearing protection comes out.

3) Pantomime as much as you need to even if you feel weird. It's universal.

4) Use your finger n' thumb "gun" to demonstrate no-nos, like turning around with the gun. Make sure he understands NOT to do that. Amazing how many newbies will if they get a chance.

5) Demonstrate everything first -- and do so slowly. You do not want him to imitate you shooting fast. You do want him to imitate your exaggerated caution in placing your finger far, far outside the trigger guard area, and in double checking the gun is unloaded before you set it down. So do these things slowly enough that he sees and understands what you are doing.

6) Let him load only one round at a time to begin with, and for at least 10 shots afterward. You want to be utterly certain that he is safe before putting a second round in the gun.

7) Stand where you can physically stop him if he starts to do something dangerous. And don't be afraid to reach in & do so if you need to.

Best place for me has always been a half-step behind and a half-step to the right of a right-handed shooter -- that way you can see what his trigger finger is doing at all times, and it's a lot easier to control the gun if necessary. Yeah, you'll get hit with brass, but that's what safety goggles are for.

***

There's an article on my site that might be of help to you. See http://www.corneredcat.com/Newbie/Newbie.htm It's about taking a new shooter to the range, and while not everything is going to apply I think you'll be able to translate most of it into stuff that will work for you guys.

pax
 
(I'll try really hard not to make any jokes about the French dropping guns, etc :p )


I played with Babelfish a bit and came up with this for the four rules:


1. Traitez toujours chaque pistolet comme si il est chargé.
2. Ne dirigez pas un pistolet vers quelque chose que vous ne voulez pas détruire.
3. Ne touchez pas le détente avant que vous ayez l'intention de déclencher.
4. Connaissez toujours votre cible et ce qui est derrière lui.


Translated back into English, it comes out to this:

Always treat each gun as if it is charged.
Do not direct a gun towards something which you do not want to destroy.
Do not touch the relaxation before you intend to start.
Always know your target and what is behind him.

(Rule 3 may sound strange, but this link confirms that "détente" and "déclencher" are the correct terms.)

Good luck!

And if you come across any Germans at the range, you'll want to know this phrase: "Je capitule!" (Oops! I said wasn't going to do that! :neener: )
 
Being the wise ass I am.....

take some duct tape with you so you can tape his hands to the guns so he doesn't throw them down............I hope you have alot of fun teaching him how to shoot. I did this with some Russians that were training at the company I work for. We signed up to be a sponsor for one of them to have them experience the American way of life. It was SOME experience and very rewarding.......chris3
 
HAHAHA, that's so funny because I've never heard a joke about a Frenchman dropping a rifle before.

attachment.php

Ok, now that the joking is out of the way, let's get back to the rather serious task at hand: safely introducing a new person to shooting in a situation where both teacher and student have limited communication abilities.

It's been mentioned that some sort of pictograph might be the way to go. This would take forethought and preparation, but might make for a very interesting project.
 
am home from college for the summer and one of my friends in high school has a French student staying with her for the whole month. Not to go to school, but be immersed in the English language to learn it better.

I of course asked him about guns.

It is hard to converse with him, because his English is very broken. He understood me, though, and he said, yes, his uncle is a policeman and he has shot a ".22 lone rifelll"

I asked him if he wanted to go to a shooting range and shoot some of my guns. He didnt understand me and looked to my friend to translate, and he looked back at me and said "real?"

It was a beautiful moment, because I told him yes, real, about 10 of them.

His face lit up like a freakin roman candle and he nodded his head so hard I thought it would fall off.

So, he is more than willing. He asked me which kind of guns. He knows the Winchester brand, but not Marlin. I said I had Swiss, American, and Soviet. His eyes lit up, and he definatly recognizes "Kalashnikov"

So, I want to take him.
Click to expand...


GOOD ON YA!
Make sure he knows to keep his finger away from the trigger and the muzzle pointed in a safe direction, even when "unloaded". It's very thoughtful of you to show him how much fun guns can be, because laws are very strict in his country and he would likely not get that exposure otherwise. :cool:
 
Bonjour dear shooters

Thanks for taking the Frenchy to the range.
Here is what you do : you simply google up the
Website of the "Féderation française de tir" and download the
safety rules in French, they are the same - no hands up, no white flag.
I love that little Liberator 45 pistol.
Congrats on al-zarqawi.

Stay safe.
Laurent
 
Choose and agree on one word

to bring all action to a halt. I would suggest "NO" since it is close enough in sound to the French "non" not to need much translation under stress. Agree that it means "don't proceed, don't turn, don't do anything until the problem/danger is taken care of."
 
Good on him for wanting to learn, and good on you for wanting to teach!


I can understand why all the usual French jokes seems to be appearing, and I have been known to make a few myself (Agincourt, Agincourt, Agincooooouuuurt! :neener: ). That being said, France has been fighting wars as a country for 1000 years, and fighting as organized tribes for another 1500 years before that.
Gauls under Brennus sacked Rome circa 390 BC.
Click to expand...
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gaul

France has gone downhill in the last 200 years (Post Napoleon), but has seen more war than many nations that are currently respected.

Remember, not all Frenchmen are Parisians!
 
Enough with the french jokes! My understanding of WWII is there was a large number of ballsie frenchmen who stood up to the invaders. The french resistence is legendary for its courage.

Back to shootin'. Consider conducting safety instruction away from the range. Shut down the enthusiasm generated by being on the range. Make sure you have their undivided attention. Muscle memory is a major part of safe gun handling. Doing it away from the range lets you instruct in the fundamentals and gives your students time to finger a firearm before the thing is loaded. Then when you get to the range you've just cut down on the number of unknowns.

Consider a number of trips with the last one the most intense. Send 'me back to France with the two week grin and a fist full of photos, videos, targets, brass, and memories. You have the opportunity to set gun control waaaay back in France. Keep us posted.
 
The French jokes are idiotic and insulting as well as being as inaccurate as jokes about Americans being a bunch of gangsta' thugs or out of control saloon cowboys. We don't like it much when our national character is impuned so we should take The High Road and try to help here.

I agree that his reading comperhension is going to be much better than his spoken skills in english so you should pull some material and make sure that he understands that he doesn't get to go if he can't follow the rules.

Start him out slow with single shot .22 rifles or at least don't put more than 1 round in the mag until you are 100% sure he has the safety rules down. Remember to not let your enthusiasm carry you away either. You are the teacher here and his safety as well as your own is in your hands.
 
Draw up a front sight & rear (verso) sight picture (w/ appropriate verbage in French & English) to show him proper sight alignment, low (inférieure), high (haut), left (sorties) and right (droit), six o'clock hold etc.

I didn't do as well as I should have in H.S. French... :D

Securite Premier (Safety First)
Point museliere duvet allonge (Point muzzle down range)
Digitale disjoncte Declechons (finger off trigger)
Chargement (Load)
feu quand pret (fire when ready)
bon tirai (nice shot)
serrer, non par secousse, le Declechons (squeeze, not jerk, the trigger)
 
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