crowbuster77
Member
while not progressive the lyman t-mag will hold 6 dies and i have loaded thousands of rounds on mine. not sure what the expert kit goes for these days however.
Tell me about progressive presses...
- Thread starter heypete
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RustyFN
Member
Looks good hornadylnl. I have heard a lot of good things about the LNL AP press. I wish I had a reason to need a 50 BMG press.
Rusty
Rusty
jmorris
Member
- Joined
- Sep 30, 2005
- Messages
- 24,289
Dave,
I didn’t post a rounds per hour, as I rarely load that long, I only need 400 rounds for the matches sat and sun. Yes there are many additional factors one has to address when reloading. If I were to count the time it takes to harvest brass, run it through my brass sorter, tumble it, get out the bullet casting machine and run it, change the reloading machine to a different caliber (if needed), put a drop or two of oil here and there, fill up a Dillon rf 100 primer filler, dump 500 cases in the case feeder (squirt case lube on them) and 500 bullets in the bullet feeder and crank the handle X times, flip on the vacuum, then case gauge and box every round. The rounds per hour figure will go up a lot. I was merely stating how fast it is once set up and ready to go. If I could only load 200rph I’d pay someone to do it.
I didn’t post a rounds per hour, as I rarely load that long, I only need 400 rounds for the matches sat and sun. Yes there are many additional factors one has to address when reloading. If I were to count the time it takes to harvest brass, run it through my brass sorter, tumble it, get out the bullet casting machine and run it, change the reloading machine to a different caliber (if needed), put a drop or two of oil here and there, fill up a Dillon rf 100 primer filler, dump 500 cases in the case feeder (squirt case lube on them) and 500 bullets in the bullet feeder and crank the handle X times, flip on the vacuum, then case gauge and box every round. The rounds per hour figure will go up a lot. I was merely stating how fast it is once set up and ready to go. If I could only load 200rph I’d pay someone to do it.
jmorris,
What I think Dave is saying is that your actual loading time is much greater then 3.5 minutes per hundred when you factor in all your prep time. Many people don't understand that time doesn't include using pre-prepped cases and does not account for packaging, refilling primers and powder, and get frustrated when they can't achieve those numbers.
However, I am interested in the bullet feeder you have. Now I am assuming when you quoted a run time of 3.5 minutes per 100 that didn't include any powder checks, is that correct? If it did include powder checks how many and if not can you tell me what your runtime is with four powder checks, one every 25th round? My typical run time per 100 rounds on my Hornady AP is 10 minutes, but that includes four powder checks one every 25th round. If the bullet feeder would half my time I might be interested, let me know what you have - thanks.
What I think Dave is saying is that your actual loading time is much greater then 3.5 minutes per hundred when you factor in all your prep time. Many people don't understand that time doesn't include using pre-prepped cases and does not account for packaging, refilling primers and powder, and get frustrated when they can't achieve those numbers.
However, I am interested in the bullet feeder you have. Now I am assuming when you quoted a run time of 3.5 minutes per 100 that didn't include any powder checks, is that correct? If it did include powder checks how many and if not can you tell me what your runtime is with four powder checks, one every 25th round? My typical run time per 100 rounds on my Hornady AP is 10 minutes, but that includes four powder checks one every 25th round. If the bullet feeder would half my time I might be interested, let me know what you have - thanks.
Personally, unless you are going to go into production mode on .223, I might stick with a single stage press.
With a little practice, I bet you can perform 500 of the following operations on a single stage press per hour.
- size and deprime
- prime using a hand tool
Two hours of work would give you 500 cases ready for powder, a bullet, and crimping.
I used to do it this way, and always had a bag of primed brass ready to go. If you have a separate power measure, you just take the primed case, put it under the powder measure, and operate the measure. Then put the case into the press, add bullet, seat and crimp. You can probably do this operation about 150-200 times an hour. Its important to layout your equipment to eliminate unnecessary movement if you do this.
On a net basis, you can do 100 reloads an hour this way on a single stage press, forgetting the prep steps that you would need to do with a progressive press anyway (like tumbling and lubing).
With a little practice, I bet you can perform 500 of the following operations on a single stage press per hour.
- size and deprime
- prime using a hand tool
Two hours of work would give you 500 cases ready for powder, a bullet, and crimping.
I used to do it this way, and always had a bag of primed brass ready to go. If you have a separate power measure, you just take the primed case, put it under the powder measure, and operate the measure. Then put the case into the press, add bullet, seat and crimp. You can probably do this operation about 150-200 times an hour. Its important to layout your equipment to eliminate unnecessary movement if you do this.
On a net basis, you can do 100 reloads an hour this way on a single stage press, forgetting the prep steps that you would need to do with a progressive press anyway (like tumbling and lubing).
jmorris
Member
- Joined
- Sep 30, 2005
- Messages
- 24,289
Idano,
One of the best features of the 650 is that it has 5 stations and station 3 is for Dillon’s powder check die. So every round is checked (or 100 out of 100) for over/under charge.
video of one in action (the blue box above #3 is the powder check)
http://www.commencefiring.com/files/Special Videos/GSIBulletFeeder.avi
One of the best features of the 650 is that it has 5 stations and station 3 is for Dillon’s powder check die. So every round is checked (or 100 out of 100) for over/under charge.
video of one in action (the blue box above #3 is the powder check)
http://www.commencefiring.com/files/Special Videos/GSIBulletFeeder.avi
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DaveInFloweryBranchGA
Member
"I didn’t post a rounds per hour, as I rarely load that long, I only need 400 rounds for the matches sat and sun. Yes there are many additional factors one has to address when reloading. If I were to count the time it takes to harvest brass, run it through my brass sorter, tumble it, get out the bullet casting machine and run it, change the reloading machine to a different caliber (if needed), put a drop or two of oil here and there, fill up a Dillon rf 100 primer filler, dump 500 cases in the case feeder (squirt case lube on them) and 500 bullets in the bullet feeder and crank the handle X times, flip on the vacuum, then case gauge and box every round. The rounds per hour figure will go up a lot. I was merely stating how fast it is once set up and ready to go. If I could only load 200rph I’d pay someone to do it."
Idano has it right, in that I was pointing out the reality of theoretical rds per hour vs. all the other stuff one has to do to prep and to wrap up, so that new reloaders have realistic expectations. I'm sure with other factors counted in, your round per hour count isn't 1740. Is it faster than the Lee Classic Turret? Sure, but it better be, because your setup likely cost ten times the price of the Lee. You're posting that is kinda like a guy with a $250,000.00 Ferrari showing up at a gathering of guys with Mustangs and claiming he can outrun any of them. Of course he can or he better.
My question for you would be if you can afford that setup, why aren't you running a 1050 with the bullet feed or, for that matter, just pay a professional handloader to custom load for you? If I had that little interest in handloading, but liked to shoot that much, that's what I would do.
The 200 rph figure I posted included all the other factors. The Lee Classic Turret press is extremely quick to change calibers, add primers and powder for the amount of money spent, so a significant amount of the hour is actually spent reloading, not doing caliber changes. It's more manual labor, but the trade off is always cost vs. round count. Your setup is fast, but I'm absolutely positive it takes a good while to change calibers and it's quite costly, definately over $1000.00 and probably over $2000.00. The Lee, on the other hand, costs less than 200 bucks setup for a single caliber. Probably the best value for a low to middle volume reloader out there who's just getting started. Allows them to learn how to reload while "seeing it" as one would on a single stage, but allows a "decent" amount of production. The amount of investment is low, but the equipment is pretty high quality and will last someone a lifetime. If Lee brings out a progressive based on the linkage and various other setups of the Classic turret, ALL the other manufacturers will be facing a SERIOUS challenge in the cost vs. performance race.
"One of the best features of the 650 is that it has 5 stations and station 3 is for Dillon’s powder check die. So every round is checked (or 100 out of 100) for over/under charge."
I don't know if you realize it or not, but the Hornady Lock N Load AP has five stations. So there's a station for the powder check die or an electronic powder check as well. I use an RCBS lockout die on mine, though some have adapted Dillon's electronic powder system to the Hornady. One of the reasons the Hornady LnL is comparable to the Dillon 650, not the 550.
In addition, Hornady's Lock N Load bushings instead of a toolhead allows changing out a single die, such as a neck sizing die for a FL resizer when you're loading 30-06. The bushings also provide for less runout than a toolhead does, a very nice thing allowing me to load my 600 yard line ammo on my Hornady instead of a single stage.
The powder measure also offers powder through case expansion with an expander insert similar in function to Dillon's powder funnel. The powder measure is excellent, with extremely easy adjustment. I've owned my Hornady for 7 years and never had to buy a second powder measure, since I can leave the powder measure and case activated powder drop on the press when I change die sets. In addtion, I bought and use the micrometer insert, which allows me to set the measure very accurately and quickly.
The rotating style measure, similar to a Redding BR30 or a RCBS Uniflow (with micrometer insert) handles extruded powders extremely well and with great accuracy, an advantage over the Dillon, where the adjustment is tedious and the measure often needs modification to handle extruded powders well.
Regards,
Dave
Idano has it right, in that I was pointing out the reality of theoretical rds per hour vs. all the other stuff one has to do to prep and to wrap up, so that new reloaders have realistic expectations. I'm sure with other factors counted in, your round per hour count isn't 1740. Is it faster than the Lee Classic Turret? Sure, but it better be, because your setup likely cost ten times the price of the Lee. You're posting that is kinda like a guy with a $250,000.00 Ferrari showing up at a gathering of guys with Mustangs and claiming he can outrun any of them. Of course he can or he better.
My question for you would be if you can afford that setup, why aren't you running a 1050 with the bullet feed or, for that matter, just pay a professional handloader to custom load for you? If I had that little interest in handloading, but liked to shoot that much, that's what I would do.
The 200 rph figure I posted included all the other factors. The Lee Classic Turret press is extremely quick to change calibers, add primers and powder for the amount of money spent, so a significant amount of the hour is actually spent reloading, not doing caliber changes. It's more manual labor, but the trade off is always cost vs. round count. Your setup is fast, but I'm absolutely positive it takes a good while to change calibers and it's quite costly, definately over $1000.00 and probably over $2000.00. The Lee, on the other hand, costs less than 200 bucks setup for a single caliber. Probably the best value for a low to middle volume reloader out there who's just getting started. Allows them to learn how to reload while "seeing it" as one would on a single stage, but allows a "decent" amount of production. The amount of investment is low, but the equipment is pretty high quality and will last someone a lifetime. If Lee brings out a progressive based on the linkage and various other setups of the Classic turret, ALL the other manufacturers will be facing a SERIOUS challenge in the cost vs. performance race.
"One of the best features of the 650 is that it has 5 stations and station 3 is for Dillon’s powder check die. So every round is checked (or 100 out of 100) for over/under charge."
I don't know if you realize it or not, but the Hornady Lock N Load AP has five stations. So there's a station for the powder check die or an electronic powder check as well. I use an RCBS lockout die on mine, though some have adapted Dillon's electronic powder system to the Hornady. One of the reasons the Hornady LnL is comparable to the Dillon 650, not the 550.
In addition, Hornady's Lock N Load bushings instead of a toolhead allows changing out a single die, such as a neck sizing die for a FL resizer when you're loading 30-06. The bushings also provide for less runout than a toolhead does, a very nice thing allowing me to load my 600 yard line ammo on my Hornady instead of a single stage.
The powder measure also offers powder through case expansion with an expander insert similar in function to Dillon's powder funnel. The powder measure is excellent, with extremely easy adjustment. I've owned my Hornady for 7 years and never had to buy a second powder measure, since I can leave the powder measure and case activated powder drop on the press when I change die sets. In addtion, I bought and use the micrometer insert, which allows me to set the measure very accurately and quickly.
The rotating style measure, similar to a Redding BR30 or a RCBS Uniflow (with micrometer insert) handles extruded powders extremely well and with great accuracy, an advantage over the Dillon, where the adjustment is tedious and the measure often needs modification to handle extruded powders well.
Regards,
Dave
New Lee Pro 1000 ....
I saw midwayusa selling the Lee Pro 1000, for $129. Hard, for me, to pass up. I had been reloading with the Lee Hand Press, for a number of years. With the hand press, after cleaning the cases, I 1) full case resized and de-primed, 2) expanded the neck, 3) primed, 4) added powder and seated the bullet, 5) roll crimped, with the Lee Factory Crimp. Bottom line was that I counted on 50-60 rounds per hour produced ... this included the times to check weights, check O.A.L., setup, cleanup and deal with a scewup, or two. Any particular hand press operation took maybe 8-10 cases per minute ... say 500 cases per hour. However with 5 steps to the operation and delays along the way, the bottom line was a more realistic 50 completed rounds per hour.
I kept reading folks saying they yielded a couple hundred rounds per hour, with a progressive. So, at $129, I thought I'd give the Lee a try. This is day two. I am reloading .357 magnum, 158 grain SJSP, using Unique and Winchester SP magnum primers.
The 1st day I set up the press, loaded primers and powder and tried to reload a few cases. Primers were not fully seating, then not feeding ... powder was not getting into the cases. A mess ... not very impressive.
Today I started over ... no powder, in the reservoir, plenty of light and a more deliberate speed. I discovered a primer jammed at the bottom of the primer trough ... it had tipped on its side (something to watch for when seating the primer feed case). I corrected this, and then loaded 30 empty, fired cases. These feed fine, de-primed fine and, when I concentrated on the up stroke after the de-priming/sizing operation, seated a new primer just fine. If I lost my concentration and 'limp wristed' the primer seating operation, I ended up with not fully seated primer and a definite PITA.
I then looked at the powder feed operation. I had the cavity disk back-wards, as well as the powder reservoir. I got things turned around. I found that the .82 VMD cavity produced 6.9 grains of Unique, rather than the 7.5 grains the Lee Table indicated .. the .88 VMD cavity produced 7.3 grains of Unique, rather than the 8.1 grains indicated, and ... the .95 VMD cavity yielded 7.7 grains of Unique, rather than the 8.7 grains shown on the table. This bothers me, in that the Alliant web page indicates 8.3 grains maximum, with Federal magnum primers. (Although the limited manual included indicates that the longer screws for using paired cavity disks were included, they were not, so until I stop and get (2) 6-32, 1-5/8" machine screws, I am at the mercy of one disk).
I went through and 1) de-primed and resized, 2) primed, charged, neck expanded (30) cases, weighing each charged case. These were consistent (for Unique anyway). I then repeated the operation, adding a bullet seating. I completed (20) rounds in about a minute. This will yield at least twice what I was getting from the Hand Press.
Was this a good buy ? The price made it seem so. However, as when I first began reloading, my nerves are on edge. I cannot see, as each charge in weighed (because the charges are not weighed) and each bullet seated, as I could with the single-stage Hand Press. I suspect I will be 'on edge' until I get comfortable, with the new process.
I ordered the bullet feed, which is indicated to double the speed. We shall see.
I saw midwayusa selling the Lee Pro 1000, for $129. Hard, for me, to pass up. I had been reloading with the Lee Hand Press, for a number of years. With the hand press, after cleaning the cases, I 1) full case resized and de-primed, 2) expanded the neck, 3) primed, 4) added powder and seated the bullet, 5) roll crimped, with the Lee Factory Crimp. Bottom line was that I counted on 50-60 rounds per hour produced ... this included the times to check weights, check O.A.L., setup, cleanup and deal with a scewup, or two. Any particular hand press operation took maybe 8-10 cases per minute ... say 500 cases per hour. However with 5 steps to the operation and delays along the way, the bottom line was a more realistic 50 completed rounds per hour.
I kept reading folks saying they yielded a couple hundred rounds per hour, with a progressive. So, at $129, I thought I'd give the Lee a try. This is day two. I am reloading .357 magnum, 158 grain SJSP, using Unique and Winchester SP magnum primers.
The 1st day I set up the press, loaded primers and powder and tried to reload a few cases. Primers were not fully seating, then not feeding ... powder was not getting into the cases. A mess ... not very impressive.
Today I started over ... no powder, in the reservoir, plenty of light and a more deliberate speed. I discovered a primer jammed at the bottom of the primer trough ... it had tipped on its side (something to watch for when seating the primer feed case). I corrected this, and then loaded 30 empty, fired cases. These feed fine, de-primed fine and, when I concentrated on the up stroke after the de-priming/sizing operation, seated a new primer just fine. If I lost my concentration and 'limp wristed' the primer seating operation, I ended up with not fully seated primer and a definite PITA.
I then looked at the powder feed operation. I had the cavity disk back-wards, as well as the powder reservoir. I got things turned around. I found that the .82 VMD cavity produced 6.9 grains of Unique, rather than the 7.5 grains the Lee Table indicated .. the .88 VMD cavity produced 7.3 grains of Unique, rather than the 8.1 grains indicated, and ... the .95 VMD cavity yielded 7.7 grains of Unique, rather than the 8.7 grains shown on the table. This bothers me, in that the Alliant web page indicates 8.3 grains maximum, with Federal magnum primers. (Although the limited manual included indicates that the longer screws for using paired cavity disks were included, they were not, so until I stop and get (2) 6-32, 1-5/8" machine screws, I am at the mercy of one disk).
I went through and 1) de-primed and resized, 2) primed, charged, neck expanded (30) cases, weighing each charged case. These were consistent (for Unique anyway). I then repeated the operation, adding a bullet seating. I completed (20) rounds in about a minute. This will yield at least twice what I was getting from the Hand Press.
Was this a good buy ? The price made it seem so. However, as when I first began reloading, my nerves are on edge. I cannot see, as each charge in weighed (because the charges are not weighed) and each bullet seated, as I could with the single-stage Hand Press. I suspect I will be 'on edge' until I get comfortable, with the new process.
I ordered the bullet feed, which is indicated to double the speed. We shall see.
RCBS Prog.
Here's my thoughts, I started a few years back w/ a RCBS rock chucker supreme kit and some other stuff. I recently got a piggyback kit to make it 5 station progressive and invested in a digial scale. I LOOOVEEE the piggyback. It works flawlessly, the only advise I have is that you should use locktite or threadlocker on the screwing parts that are never switched.
I like the piggyback for these reasons:
-It has 1 holder and 2 neat trays, a metal holder for bullets, a plastic for unprimed brass, and a plastic for "done" bullets.
-You can take a bullet out at any time any weigh powder, examine, do what you do.
-the powder measure can be anchored to the press, I don't need my uni-flow stand anymore.
-The shell plates are changeable with an allen screwdriver and nothing else.
-The die plates can be bought for about $15 and slide in/out with two pins. This keeps everything exactly where you want it without unscrewing/repositioning.
-The APS strips for primers are easy to use and quick. You even get the strip loader with the piggyback system/kit.
-Last but definitely not least, there is a PRIMER KICKOUT TUBE!!!! This takes those damn things and puts them into a container. I use an emtpy water bottle. No more stupid little primer hoppers to catch those filthy things. The dirt & primers go into an enclosed vessel.
I tweaked my piggyback a little bit and put the posts under the "tricks" sticky here.
If I was to buy a whole press again (pretending I didn't have one now) I would get the pro-2000
Here's my thoughts, I started a few years back w/ a RCBS rock chucker supreme kit and some other stuff. I recently got a piggyback kit to make it 5 station progressive and invested in a digial scale. I LOOOVEEE the piggyback. It works flawlessly, the only advise I have is that you should use locktite or threadlocker on the screwing parts that are never switched.
I like the piggyback for these reasons:
-It has 1 holder and 2 neat trays, a metal holder for bullets, a plastic for unprimed brass, and a plastic for "done" bullets.
-You can take a bullet out at any time any weigh powder, examine, do what you do.
-the powder measure can be anchored to the press, I don't need my uni-flow stand anymore.
-The shell plates are changeable with an allen screwdriver and nothing else.
-The die plates can be bought for about $15 and slide in/out with two pins. This keeps everything exactly where you want it without unscrewing/repositioning.
-The APS strips for primers are easy to use and quick. You even get the strip loader with the piggyback system/kit.
-Last but definitely not least, there is a PRIMER KICKOUT TUBE!!!! This takes those damn things and puts them into a container. I use an emtpy water bottle. No more stupid little primer hoppers to catch those filthy things. The dirt & primers go into an enclosed vessel.
I tweaked my piggyback a little bit and put the posts under the "tricks" sticky here.
If I was to buy a whole press again (pretending I didn't have one now) I would get the pro-2000
Well partly in thanks to this thread i purchased the Lee Classic Turret press, extra turret, Lee Pro Auto Disk Dispenser, and Lever Safety Prime. Watching the amazing video the guy made loading 45acp rounds, where he shows how to use the primer tool, put me over the edge. Its amazing how fast and easy you can make a round using the auto-index and autodisk and lever prime. It takes me sooooo long to make 50 rounds with my lee challenger anniversary kit. The worst/longest part is charging the cases, the fastest way i do it is i expand the case, throw a charge into the scale pan, and dump it into the powder through expander die with a funnel in the top and then move it to a tray waiting to be seated. The process of throwing the charge and dumping it in the funnel is a pain and hurts my back for some reason (the positioning of the dispenser on my desk). Plus the charges are consistently off, like i will set it for 4.5gn, and sometimes will get 4.2 and sometimes will get 4.8, a huge difference! And i did all the procedures of running 1 pound through the device before using, etc. The auto disk i like better cause its a fixed cavity. Then changing the dies 4 times is a pain too, especially since i usually re tweak them to make sure they werent slightly changed when i screwed them in/out.
So the turret looks like the answer to my prayers. I considered the load master 1500 and other progressives but i really dont need that much automation/speed. I cant shoot enough to make it worth it, but the turret speed is just right. Especially since you can put each set of dies in it's own turret and never have to adjust them again! I love that idea. I am a little worried about the primer system but it seems people have got it to work sucessfully.
So the turret looks like the answer to my prayers. I considered the load master 1500 and other progressives but i really dont need that much automation/speed. I cant shoot enough to make it worth it, but the turret speed is just right. Especially since you can put each set of dies in it's own turret and never have to adjust them again! I love that idea. I am a little worried about the primer system but it seems people have got it to work sucessfully.
DaveInFloweryBranchGA
Member
Mike,
You made a good choice. You'll get it setup, figure out how everything works and if you need help, there'll be others who own it that can help you get it running right. Once you do, it'll stay running right and provide you a great deal of joy.
Regards,
Dave
You made a good choice. You'll get it setup, figure out how everything works and if you need help, there'll be others who own it that can help you get it running right. Once you do, it'll stay running right and provide you a great deal of joy.
Regards,
Dave
>> Well partly in thanks to this thread i purchased the Lee Classic Turret press, extra turret, Lee Pro Auto Disk Dispenser, and Lever Safety Prime..... I am a little worried about the primer system but it seems people have got it to work sucessfully.<<
The problem with my safety prime was that it was contacting the priming area low and to the left. So I filed on the left side of the bracket hole in order to shift the bracket more to the right. Now the trigger is perfectly aligned with the lever arm just like it is shown in the instruction picture. However it still contacts the lever arm and that pushes the primer cup a bit back towards the ram slot. That's when it can drop a primer. I added a washer on top on the spacer so that the bracket sits a bit higher. Now it works great and no more dropped primers.
I am getting into the habit of priming with my left hand in order to keep the right hand on the main lever. Now if I can only get this amount of productivity improvement over on the casting and brass prep side. - Phil
The problem with my safety prime was that it was contacting the priming area low and to the left. So I filed on the left side of the bracket hole in order to shift the bracket more to the right. Now the trigger is perfectly aligned with the lever arm just like it is shown in the instruction picture. However it still contacts the lever arm and that pushes the primer cup a bit back towards the ram slot. That's when it can drop a primer. I added a washer on top on the spacer so that the bracket sits a bit higher. Now it works great and no more dropped primers.
I am getting into the habit of priming with my left hand in order to keep the right hand on the main lever. Now if I can only get this amount of productivity improvement over on the casting and brass prep side.
- Philcrap reading that article it says you need the lee auto disk riser, i didnt know you need that since it says its for using non-lee dies, does that mean i wont be able to use this lee turret setup right until i order it? the autodisk pro doesnt come with it right?
Thanks Idano. I still needed a washer plus the normal thick washer (or spacer) under the bracket to get mine to work consistently because the bottom of the trigger was contacting the lever arm and rocking the primer cup back before the primer is dropped. No big deal, just needed more clearance. It works just fine now, just like the video. I'm happy.
Mike, you need a riser for the autodisk when used with the safety prime. Another article here talks about this along with some good pictures. - Phil http://www.realguns.com/archives/123.htm
Mike, you need a riser for the autodisk when used with the safety prime. Another article here talks about this along with some good pictures. - Phil http://www.realguns.com/archives/123.htm
DaveInFloweryBranchGA
Member
Mike,
That's why we throw those articles out there, so people can gather that kinda information. Those nice pictures help a lot. Unfortunately, you're going to need the riser so your powder measure will clear the safety prime. I think if you call the outfit back this morning, you'll be able to get them to squeeze it into your order.
Phil,
Good solution on getting the Safety prime to line up. Those things work really well when lined up, but not so well if they aren't. The good thing is once they're lined up, they stay that way, no glitches. Of course, that's the way with most machinery.
Regards,
Dave
That's why we throw those articles out there, so people can gather that kinda information. Those nice pictures help a lot. Unfortunately, you're going to need the riser so your powder measure will clear the safety prime. I think if you call the outfit back this morning, you'll be able to get them to squeeze it into your order.
Phil,
Good solution on getting the Safety prime to line up. Those things work really well when lined up, but not so well if they aren't. The good thing is once they're lined up, they stay that way, no glitches. Of course, that's the way with most machinery.
Regards,
Dave
benedict1
Member
Where is the washer supplied with the press?
I am curious--what happened to the washer that comes with the unit? There is a oddly shaped metal washer that MUST be in place on top of he bracket--It is sort of semi-circular on one side and has rounded squarish edges on the other. If it's not installed then exactly what happened to you happens. It is described in detail in the article I referenced in surplusrifle.com
Where is your washer like that? In place on the press? If not, then no wonder you needed another washer to replace the one that should have been there.
When properly installed and operated briskly, the Safety Prime is dead on target with primers everytime in my experience.
I am curious--what happened to the washer that comes with the unit? There is a oddly shaped metal washer that MUST be in place on top of he bracket--It is sort of semi-circular on one side and has rounded squarish edges on the other. If it's not installed then exactly what happened to you happens. It is described in detail in the article I referenced in surplusrifle.com
Where is your washer like that? In place on the press? If not, then no wonder you needed another washer to replace the one that should have been there.
When properly installed and operated briskly, the Safety Prime is dead on target with primers everytime in my experience.
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>>I am curious--what happened to the washer that comes with the unit? There is a oddly shaped metal washer that MUST be in place on top of he bracket--It is sort of semi-circular on one side and has rounded squarish edges on the other. If it's not installed then exactly what happened to you happens. It is described in detail in the article I referenced in surplusrifle.com
Where is your washer like that? In place on the press? If not, then no wonder you needed another washer to replace the one that should have been there.
When properly installed and operated briskly, the Safety Prime is dead on target with primers everytime in my experience.>>
The goofy shaped washer is still on top of the bracket. The bracket just needed to be raised up .05 inches more than the spacer that Lee provided. Right now it's about as dead on as a piece of plastic hanging from another piece of plastic can be. I'm not knocking it because it works very well but it's not hard to see what happens when the bottom of trigger contacts the lever arm too low. Polishing the top of the lever arm probably would not hurt either. - Phil
Where is your washer like that? In place on the press? If not, then no wonder you needed another washer to replace the one that should have been there.
When properly installed and operated briskly, the Safety Prime is dead on target with primers everytime in my experience.>>
The goofy shaped washer is still on top of the bracket. The bracket just needed to be raised up .05 inches more than the spacer that Lee provided. Right now it's about as dead on as a piece of plastic hanging from another piece of plastic can be. I'm not knocking it because it works very well but it's not hard to see what happens when the bottom of trigger contacts the lever arm too low. Polishing the top of the lever arm probably would not hurt either. - Phil
Well i wasnt able to add it to my order but i was able to get another order in that will be here the day after with my extender. that article mentions cleaning out the dies when they are new but nothing i have read nor the lee instructions mentioned it and i did not do it without any bad results except some minor grease on the casings that i wiped off the first couple times... this is not a big deal with lee dies i assume?
DaveInFloweryBranchGA
Member
Mike,
CLEAN your dies. There's all kindsa nasty manufacturing crud in there you don't want making contact with your brass. Pull the die completely apart and use denatured alcohol with a few q-tips and a wrag. When you're done using the dies, wipe the Outside down with a wrag that's soaked in 3 in 1 oil or some other light machine oil to keep them from rusting where your hands have deposited salts and moisture. You'll also want to wipe down the black shafts on the press with an oily wrag, as those are blued steel. They'll rust if you do not for the same reasons the dies will.
Also, put drops of oil on each hinge and on the worm gear iin the middle that rotates the turret head.
Regards,
Dave
CLEAN your dies. There's all kindsa nasty manufacturing crud in there you don't want making contact with your brass. Pull the die completely apart and use denatured alcohol with a few q-tips and a wrag. When you're done using the dies, wipe the Outside down with a wrag that's soaked in 3 in 1 oil or some other light machine oil to keep them from rusting where your hands have deposited salts and moisture. You'll also want to wipe down the black shafts on the press with an oily wrag, as those are blued steel. They'll rust if you do not for the same reasons the dies will.
Also, put drops of oil on each hinge and on the worm gear iin the middle that rotates the turret head.
Regards,
Dave
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Mike,
Dave is correct about cleaning your new dies. The manufacture coats the dies in grease so that they won't rust while sitting on the shelf. However, that grease is thick and can dent your casings or plug the vent holes in the die that lets the air escape as you compress the case into the die. If the vent holes gets plugged normal case lube will have no place to escape and dent your cases.
Here is one of those instances where you should do as I say and not as I do: Dies really should be clean periodically unfortunately I don't do this as often as I probably should. Cleaning the dies extends their life and the life of your cases.
Dave is correct about cleaning your new dies. The manufacture coats the dies in grease so that they won't rust while sitting on the shelf. However, that grease is thick and can dent your casings or plug the vent holes in the die that lets the air escape as you compress the case into the die. If the vent holes gets plugged normal case lube will have no place to escape and dent your cases.
Here is one of those instances where you should do as I say and not as I do: Dies really should be clean periodically unfortunately I don't do this as often as I probably should. Cleaning the dies extends their life and the life of your cases.
I have run like 300 rounds through them, they are pretty clean now, lol. They no longer crud the brass, but i guess i will clean them, denatured alcohol is some strong crap, clean them entirely in it? carbide inserts too? Can i use gun oil to protect them, or perhaps like clp? I dont have 3 in 1 oil but could get it.
Its crazy lee doesnt mention this stuff in their book or their instructions.
Its crazy lee doesnt mention this stuff in their book or their instructions.
DaveInFloweryBranchGA
Member
Don't get fooled, denatured alcohol isn't that strong. It just smells strong. Just dip/soak a Q-tip and use that as a "mop." Should work fine. Use an old wrag with a bit of alcohol soaked on the corner to wipe the big areas with and a dry Q-tip to mop up the leftovers.
You can use your expensive gun oil to protect them if you wish, but the 3in1 is a lot cheaper to buy.
BTW, they mention it, but not in detail and that's pretty common with all of the manufacturers. That's what you talk to old Fudds like me on the internet for, to find out stuff like this. (grin)
Regards,
Dave
You can use your expensive gun oil to protect them if you wish, but the 3in1 is a lot cheaper to buy.
BTW, they mention it, but not in detail and that's pretty common with all of the manufacturers. That's what you talk to old Fudds like me on the internet for, to find out stuff like this. (grin)
Regards,
Dave
Lol thanks dave, my turret should be here tomorrow, i will be sure to take extra care of it.... Now I just have to pick up some denatured alcohol...
So any tips or recommendations before I setup the new classic turret tomorrow? like little things not included in the manual or the articles? I am very excited to stop using this damn challenger press for pistol ammo.
So any tips or recommendations before I setup the new classic turret tomorrow? like little things not included in the manual or the articles? I am very excited to stop using this damn challenger press for pistol ammo.
DaveInFloweryBranchGA
Member
Sure, here's a tip or two:
!. Take the worm gear out and polish the sharp corners smooth and remove the tiny machining nub on the bottom end, then reassemble it into the press. Be careful not to destroy the plastic indexing parts.
2. Lube it with some CLP/Breakfree on all hinge points and the worm gear.
3. Carefully align the safety prime head with the Lever prime. Drill the mounting hole out one size larger if necessary to do so. Use an extra washer underneath if necessary. Make sure the washer with the cut off portions is on top of the safety prime bracket.
4. Take care setting up your dies and you'll only have to do it once. Make sure the powder through expansion die's lock ring is good and tight on the press. The others can be finger tight.
5. Use a electrical zip tie to attach the plastic tube to the bottom of the ram so it won't come off at an inconvenient time.
6. 2 lb. Coffee cans make good primer catchers.
7. Lube the ring the turret rides in when you change turrets.
8. If you have to adjust the timing, adjust it so the turret rotates and just makes it into lock position when you're going slow. This allows you to go the maximum speed possible when operating the press because the turret will have more momentum and lock solidly when going faster without going past the lock position.. Follow the adjustment procedures provided on the Lee website.
Regards,
Dave
!. Take the worm gear out and polish the sharp corners smooth and remove the tiny machining nub on the bottom end, then reassemble it into the press. Be careful not to destroy the plastic indexing parts.
2. Lube it with some CLP/Breakfree on all hinge points and the worm gear.
3. Carefully align the safety prime head with the Lever prime. Drill the mounting hole out one size larger if necessary to do so. Use an extra washer underneath if necessary. Make sure the washer with the cut off portions is on top of the safety prime bracket.
4. Take care setting up your dies and you'll only have to do it once. Make sure the powder through expansion die's lock ring is good and tight on the press. The others can be finger tight.
5. Use a electrical zip tie to attach the plastic tube to the bottom of the ram so it won't come off at an inconvenient time.
6. 2 lb. Coffee cans make good primer catchers.
7. Lube the ring the turret rides in when you change turrets.
8. If you have to adjust the timing, adjust it so the turret rotates and just makes it into lock position when you're going slow. This allows you to go the maximum speed possible when operating the press because the turret will have more momentum and lock solidly when going faster without going past the lock position.. Follow the adjustment procedures provided on the Lee website.
Regards,
Dave
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