Tell me about the PSA Dagger

gc70 said:
Having owned several M&Ps, Glocks, and Daggers, I was intrigued by your 'long trigger' comment. I got my most recent Dagger out of the safe and used digital calipers to measure trigger travel from fully forward to striker release; the result was 0.3" for four separate measurements. Since I no longer have any M&Ps, I wanted something more than fading impressions from my memory to reflect M&P trigger travel. I found the illustration below on the M&P Forum that shows a Gen1 M&P with a trigger travel of 0.3" from fully forward to striker release.

link to M&P trigger travel illustration
Click to expand...
Its not just a question of total travel though. The M&P trigger take up has basically no resistance, you can push it right to the wall and know when it is about to break. The intial take up on the early M&P's was gritty and they were generally crappy triggers but I got used to them.

The glocks i have shot I would describe as having a trigger like rubber band. Tension increases all the way until the trigger breaks. Having spent very little time behind one, I have a hard time judging the break and I don't care for that style take up, especially not if they have any over travel.

I'm not saying one is better than the other, both can be done well or poorly. The Kahr K9 I have is buttery smooth and breaks very clean, it is easily argued to be a better trigger than my Gen 1 M&P, but I shoot the M&P better. I also carry a 2.0 and have a shield. The dagger is probably as good or better quality as any of them but it doesn't sound like the trigger will be consistent with what I am used to.
 
redneck said:
Its not just a question of total travel though. The M&P trigger take up has basically no resistance, you can push it right to the wall and know when it is about to break. The intial take up on the early M&P's was gritty and they were generally crappy triggers but I got used to them.

The glocks i have shot I would describe as having a trigger like rubber band. Tension increases all the way until the trigger breaks. Having spent very little time behind one, I have a hard time judging the break and I don't care for that style take up, especially not if they have any over travel.

I'm not saying one is better than the other, both can be done well or poorly. The Kahr K9 I have is buttery smooth and breaks very clean, it is easily argued to be a better trigger than my Gen 1 M&P, but I shoot the M&P better. I also carry a 2.0 and have a shield. The dagger is probably as good or better quality as any of them but it doesn't sound like the trigger will be consistent with what I am used to.
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The Dagger's take-up is definitely heavier than my M&Ps, which I remember as more like the SA take-up on DA/SA pistols. However, Dagger triggers do have a defined break and a clear difference in pull weight between take-up and releasing the sear after reaching the wall.

Try a Dagger if you get a chance. I probably have more trigger time on M&Ps than anything other than classic P-series Sigs and Dagger triggers feel much more comfortable to me than Glock triggers.

Good luck with your search!
 
drobs said:
Complete slide assembly $149.99:

Complete frame $49.99:

$200 + a couple Glock mags, shipping, and transfer - Just buy one and make up your own mind on the trigger.
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My local dealers all want $50 or more for a transfer, understandable but kind of a buzzkill. If I get a dagger I think I'm going to jump in the deep end and get one of the complete guns with 10 mags and make the most of the shipping charges and what not. The one I was initially looking at was around $380 which seemed like a very good deal to me. Ten mags for my M&P would cost more than that!
 
I bought one because it came with ten PMags that fit my Glock 19. I was going to buy some PMags anyway so why not throw in the gun too? I've had it to the range only once and it went through 100rds without a hitch. The trigger doesn't excite me but I've sure had worse. Accuracy on par with your basic 9mm combat guns. I think it's a great value and quite happy with it. Mine came with a pretty decent soft case too.
 
Well I ordered one :D
The kicker is that I've been on the fence and tire kicking for a rock island 1911 set up for 9mm and 22tcm as combo for a long time. I wanted to try 22tcm but did not want a gun dedicated to it in the event it dies. I was searching for one again and it now appears they don't make the combo gun in a double stack anymore which is really the way I wanted to go as I already have traditional 1911's. And then I came across discussion of there being a conversion kit with barrel, guide rod and springs for gen 3 glock 17's that convert it to 22tcm9r.

So I ordered a full size dagger in flat dark earth with basic carry cut slide and ten mags. Then I cruised the web and found that absolutely nobody has the conversion kits in stock and nobody knows if they will ever come back. Might have got the cart before the horse but for now I have no regrets :rofl:
 
redneck said:
My local dealers all want $50 or more for a transfer, understandable but kind of a buzzkill. If I get a dagger I think I'm going to jump in the deep end and get one of the complete guns with 10 mags and make the most of the shipping charges and what not. The one I was initially looking at was around $380 which seemed like a very good deal to me. Ten mags for my M&P would cost more than that!
Click to expand...

I see you bought one.

RE $50 transfers. Check gunbroker's ffl finder:

Find an FFL Near You | GunBroker

Search the GunBroker.com network for transfer agents near you. If you are a Federal Firearms License holder, consider joining the FFL Network.
www.gunbroker.com

You might see if there are any coffee table dealers (home business) around you that charge less for transfers.
 
someguy2800 said:
If I didn't know anything about these brands or what they cost and you handed me a Glock 19, a S&W M&P, a FN509, a CZP10c, and a PSA Dagger with a cleaned up trigger, let me shoot a box through all of them, and then said you can buy any of these you want for $500, I would pick the Dagger 10/10. The fact that the dagger is actually only $250 and 15 minutes of polishing is just icing on the cake. Maybe that's not a fair comparison to give the PSA the benefit of trigger work, but that is really the only thing that any of the others would have up on it out of the box IMHO.
Click to expand...
I like the Dagger ergonomics, feel, and parts compatibility. The Dagger I've shot, however, doesn't always lock the slide back on an empty magazine. Daggers are much more ergonomic than Glocks, IMO. For equal price, I would take the P-10C over the Dagger as I shoot it more naturally and accurately.

Daggers are ~$200 now and P-10Cs are ~$300 now. The others in your list are more expensive, if I'm not mistaken.
 
drobs said:
I see you bought one.

RE $50 transfers. Check gunbroker's ffl finder:

Find an FFL Near You | GunBroker

Search the GunBroker.com network for transfer agents near you. If you are a Federal Firearms License holder, consider joining the FFL Network.
www.gunbroker.com

You might see if there are any coffee table dealers (home business) around you that charge less for transfers.
Click to expand...
PSA's listing had an actual shop that I've been to a few times and the website says they charge $35 so I gave them a shot. I bet the website is outdated but we will see.

I don't blame FFL's for trying to make some money and $50 doesn't seem too unreasonable but when you're talking about a $50 pistol frame, or a $200 pistol and they start wanting $50-$75 just to do ten minutes of paperwork its kind of a drag.
 
SKILCZ said:
I like the Dagger ergonomics, feel, and parts compatibility. The Dagger I've shot, however, doesn't always lock the slide back on an empty magazine. Daggers are much more ergonomic than Glocks, IMO. For equal price, I would take the P-10C over the Dagger as I shoot it more naturally and accurately.

Daggers are ~$200 now and P-10Cs are ~$300 now. The others in your list are more expensive, if I'm not mistaken.
Click to expand...
The Dagger owner should contact PSA. I have read good things about their customer service. There is a PSA Dagger group on F-book that is monitored by a couple of their employees. If someone comes there with a complaint/problem they seem to make sure it is addressed.
 
I've got two of them. They're cheap and work pretty well. Sometimes if you buy them separately (frame + barrel + slide) you can put them together for as low as $200-ish (and since I have a PSA locally I can just get it shipped to store with no transfer fee :)). I'd certainly take one over a Hi Point.

If you're just looking for a boring but functional utility gun, they're a great value. They're supposed to be coming out with more variants other than just the "Glock 19" form factor - personally I'd love to see one in the micro-9 P365-ish size myself.
 
mgmorden said:
If you're just looking for a boring but functional utility gun, they're a great value. They're supposed to be coming out with more variants other than just the "Glock 19" form factor - personally I'd love to see one in the micro-9 P365-ish size myself.
Click to expand...

They are doing small batch releases of Micro Daggers that are based off the Glock 43X model. Small as in they have done two stocking events on the website and they have sold out in literally seconds. I plan to get one when I don't have to be quick draw Mcgraw on a mouse.

I have a regular Dagger. Like it better than every Glock or M&P I have fired. Feels like they took the best features of both designs and undercut both in price. Even under Glock Blue label program, you aren't going to get a G19 for around 300. And 250ish on sales. I shot about 1000 rounds through mine today with a student. She liked it because it was far lighter than her Sig X-Five Legion.
 
redneck said:
My local dealers all want $50 or more for a transfer, understandable but kind of a buzzkill. If I get a dagger I think I'm going to jump in the deep end and get one of the complete guns with 10 mags and make the most of the shipping charges and what not. The one I was initially looking at was around $380 which seemed like a very good deal to me. Ten mags for my M&P would cost more than that!
Click to expand...
I can only think of one single FFL around here that charges $50. Most of them, including the last three I've used, charge $25, which is fine, IMHO. $50 is like the $40 shipping charge on guns some places want, it's a bit much. The GB FFL search can be very handy to find a better priced FFL to transfer with.
 
SKILCZ said:
I like the Dagger ergonomics, feel, and parts compatibility. The Dagger I've shot, however, doesn't always lock the slide back on an empty magazine. Daggers are much more ergonomic than Glocks, IMO. For equal price, I would take the P-10C over the Dagger as I shoot it more naturally and accurately.

Daggers are ~$200 now and P-10Cs are ~$300 now. The others in your list are more expensive, if I'm not mistaken.
Click to expand...
Were you using MagPul PMags? The PMags are known to either not lock the slide back when empty or lock the slide back with one round still in the magazine. I've had this happen in Gen 3 Glocks and the different 80% frames I have built. IT seems to effect non Glock frames more.
 
I escaped work long enough to pick it up yesterday but haven't had time to shoot it or really do much other than open the box and dry fire it a few times.

First impressions-
Grip shape is awesome but I would like the texture to be more aggressive, I like the M&P 2.0 which a lot of folks end up sanding down though so ymmv. Its very good, just fairly smooth.

Overall fit and finish- slide to frame is pretty tight. No high seams on the plastic or anything. Even color on all the metal. Surprisingly good quality for such a cheap gun. The carry bag is a nice touch, better quality than I expected.

Sights- I got the 1/3 co witness sights. They are basic irons with no dots or anything. I actually kind of like the tall skinny front sight for a target type site but will probably do something to make them a bit quicker to pick up, or just swap them with fiber optics or something.

Trigger- I have bic pens with better action. It does not have the rubber band snap I've come to expect from a glock, but it is also nothing like an M&P. Best I can describe it is to say it is spongey. The take up is long and there is a very slight wall all the way at the back and just when you think the trigger is out of travel it snaps and travels just a bit further. Dry firing it I can easily hold the sights still and I think it will be easy enough to shoot, but it definitely is not a "nice" trigger. I will say the reset is very positive with a loud click. I don't have a scale for pull weight but it is in the ball park of most carry pistols. It definitely would not stop me from recommending this gun to anybody, just is not what I look for in a trigger.

Hopefully I will get a range session in soon.
 
I put a hundred or so rounds through one Friday. It had never been fired and the owner wanted to part with it. The ergonomics are worlds and away better than a Glock 19, and the trigger was better than factory glock triggers I've tried recently. I guess maybe the quality of the trigger varies from gun to gun; hardly surprising at this price point. The gun ran flawlessly. I don't care about the hinged trigger. I'll be picking the gun up tomorrow, and there's a Dagger Compact lower arriving Friday or so. I'll post something about the gun after tomorrow's shooting session.

I've owned Glocks over the years, and somehow I never hang onto them. I think a lot of that was the blocky grip but the PSA solves that nicely. The gun i am getting tomorrow has an RMR cut and co-witness sights with the rear sight located between the ejection port and the optic. I'm doing an extended review of the Cyelee Bear enclosed-emitter optic and this is going to be one of several test-guns I run it on.
 
One reason Daggers are less expensive… no middle men straight from PSA to the consumer, I really wouldn’t describe a Dagger as cheap .. The tigger is a step up from a Gen 1 M&P and extremely similar to a stock Glock .. To me after about 3 mags .. I was use to it … the triggers are good enough for me … I have never been a “trigger guy” but I have never shot competition …I have owned a couple of strikerfired pistols that triggers stand out … my XDM E 10mm ,
CZ P10C and of all things a Glock 23 police trade in ,that had the dreaded New York triggers
Oh my .. love it .. its well worn in .. smooth and predictable
I even like Taurus G3 series triggers ….
But when you are a revolver guy .. you can adjust with any trigger as long as you practice a bit
 
redneck said:
I escaped work long enough to pick it up yesterday but haven't had time to shoot it or really do much other than open the box and dry fire it a few times.

First impressions-
Grip shape is awesome but I would like the texture to be more aggressive, I like the M&P 2.0 which a lot of folks end up sanding down though so ymmv. Its very good, just fairly smooth.

Overall fit and finish- slide to frame is pretty tight. No high seams on the plastic or anything. Even color on all the metal. Surprisingly good quality for such a cheap gun. The carry bag is a nice touch, better quality than I expected.

Sights- I got the 1/3 co witness sights. They are basic irons with no dots or anything. I actually kind of like the tall skinny front sight for a target type site but will probably do something to make them a bit quicker to pick up, or just swap them with fiber optics or something.

Trigger- I have bic pens with better action. It does not have the rubber band snap I've come to expect from a glock, but it is also nothing like an M&P. Best I can describe it is to say it is spongey. The take up is long and there is a very slight wall all the way at the back and just when you think the trigger is out of travel it snaps and travels just a bit further. Dry firing it I can easily hold the sights still and I think it will be easy enough to shoot, but it definitely is not a "nice" trigger. I will say the reset is very positive with a loud click. I don't have a scale for pull weight but it is in the ball park of most carry pistols. It definitely would not stop me from recommending this gun to anybody, just is not what I look for in a trigger.

Hopefully I will get a range session in soon.
Click to expand...
If you wanted to change the grip texture Talon has grip options for this gun. You could stipple it or do what I have done to a couple of my pistols & put some skateboard or tread tape on it. I am another that likes the rough texture of the M&P grip.
 
Really like mine. I tried a sw shield, ss legion, and Glock 19 and it fit my hand better than any of them
 
I have had my Dagger since the end of winter and could not wait to get up to my cabin, to shoot it. Well I got busy with life and projects and had the Dagger up there twice with out shooting it. Finally in July I was up again and getting ready to leave and yes the Dagger again had not been shot. I said to myself I am going to shoot a magazine for function test. I had some several day old donuts that I placed on the shore of the pond about 30yards away. First shot one donut went flying up into the air, awesome! The donuts were destroyed by the mag dump, I was impressed. The only thing I do not like about the Dagger is the magazine release seems to be very sharp and it's not ambidextrous which kept me from getting a Glock for a long time.
 
tangara said:
I have had my Dagger since the end of winter and could not wait to get up to my cabin, to shoot it. Well I got busy with life and projects and had the Dagger up there twice with out shooting it. Finally in July I was up again and getting ready to leave and yes the Dagger again had not been shot. I said to myself I am going to shoot a magazine for function test. I had some several day old donuts that I placed on the shore of the pond about 30yards away. First shot one donut went flying up into the air, awesome! The donuts were destroyed by the mag dump, I was impressed. The only thing I do not like about the Dagger is the magazine release seems to be very sharp and it's not ambidextrous which kept me from getting a Glock for a long time.
Click to expand...

The gen 5 glocks have reversible safeties. Not sure if there is any way to put a left handed safety on a Gen 3 like the dagger.
 
someguy2800 said:
The gen 5 glocks have reversible safeties. Not sure if there is any way to put a left handed safety on a Gen 3 like the dagger.
Click to expand...

I am guessing you mean Mag release.. Gen4 which came out in 2010 had reversible Mag releases too. I dont see why a Gen3 Clone couldnt be made with one as its still the same simple mechanism that drives all of them.
 
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